Moyes needs much more time.....

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Grammar Police said:
He fucked the job up before it even began.

Sam handed him a dossier and even spoke with him before taking on the job.

All he had to do was listen and carry forward the plan on the small foundations Sam had put in place. Stay up, finish mid-table THEN build.

But no, he knew better, flogged Kaboul, spunked £30m on shite and told us we were in a relegation battle from the start despite good form in 2016.

Good one Dave.
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is 100% correct. Sam had four ready to sign and 1 other lined up
 
People go on about all the injuries, but how many out of the long termers are we really missing? Borini, Kirchhoff and maybe Cattermole, Pickford is more than an able replacement for Vito, Januzaj is shite, any others would barely feature anyway. It's a lame excuse that's easy to hide behind.
 
Ceverton said:
He has got great pedigree, he was headhunted 3 years ago by one of the biggest clubs in the world, he has did a similar job before (albeit 12 years ago).

However so far despite an injury crisis, I have seen no indication he has a f***ing clue what he is doing, we dont look as though we want to even try win a game.

Allardyce lost 8 from his first 11 games here but you could see what he was doing and apart from the village idiots, we could see he was going to get us better in time. Moyes has shown none of that so far, and I am normally a happy clapper.
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You could say the same about Rodwell. I want them both out as soon as possible, both finished at this level.
 
He's actively taken us backwards. His signings look poor, the team have lost all cohesion and any signs of organisation that was apparent last year. Team spirit looks shot to pieces and we've lost 6 of our first 8 games.

There have been no signs of any tactics, his substitutions have been poor and often too late.

His signings look, so far, dreadful. He's negative in his outlook and see seemingly has very little idea on how to turn it around.

We had a very solid base with which to push on from the back end of last year and he's fucked up in nearly every aspect.

We'll be relegated if we give him more time.
 
ungowa said:
Its simple
if the players wont perform for him, he has to go.
like it or not .
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Or don't give in to player power (If that's the case) because every manager lately has talked of a certain thing holding the club back. Maybe let a manager have a few transfer windows, which is exactly what he said we would need, when he joined. I was gutted when Sam went, but he forced the move himself. We didn't sack him. I don't blame him for taking his dream job. I blame him for messing it up, but that's really my problem, or concern, as i'm a Sunderland fan first, then England second. Sam finished the season great.Just like Poyet and Dick did beforehand. Their next seasons didn't start off rosy so Sam might not have either.
 
dcl0sc said:
How's he clueless? So every bad period we go though, do we sack every manager? broken brains!
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His signings have been appalling, there's no discernible style or way of playing, he's negative, dour and downbeat, the players don't look motivated and I genuinely don't see any improvements or a singlenpositive since he's arrived. If you have, let's hear it?
 
I'd sack him and try for Sam again. Failing that, honestly, I'd try and unload as much shite as possible in January, accept were down and play the young un's with a view to re-building in the summer, spending the Spring identifying a manger that can getting us back with a different squad and confident, aggressive mindset and style of play.
 
Space Hopper said:
Please God let Big Sam come back. Moyes is soul destroying.
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Moyes isn't up for a relegation fight, he's admitted as much.

last season when he was approached by Ellis, he turned us down because he thought we'd be relegated, i.e. he didn't think he'd keep us up. This implies that BSA is not only a better manager but is up for a fight.

2 games into this season, he admits it's a relegation battle and has offered very little since to even suggest he's capable of turning this around.

Changing managers every 5 minutes is clearly a bad idea, but in this case, Moyes will take us down and walk away leaving us in the Championship with someone like Mick Mc in charge.

Leicester Fan said:
It's irrelevant how long he has been manager for IMO. There is a big myth perpetuated by football people that give a manager time and he will get things right, some managers would take a club like Sunderland into the Conference if they were give a 20 year contract.
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If we were amid table side looking to break into Europe, he'd be the perfect manager. he could spend 3 or 4 years steadily improving the squad and getting us further up the table.

Unfortunately, the team is relegation fodder and has been for 5 years and we simply don't have the luxury of time for long term projects.

BSA was a our best chance to stabilise and make progress. Ellis should have given him everything he wanted in the close season and make it difficult for him to to walk away.

Instead we have a manager who appears to have no clue how to win a single game.
 
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nandos sonic sauce said:
Any manager after Fergie was on a hiding to nothing. LVG one of the most experienced managers about who has managed big big clubs, and who spent a load had a worse record than Moyes. We can't keep changing managers (Not meaning you, just talking in general on here) People on here have become like the trigger happy chairmen. They can argue that it has worked the last few seasons, just, but we will never ever build anything doing it like that.

His signings are still to be judged, but it hasn't helped with the injury list. I just hope this injury list isn't because we are struggling, as it seems players have a habit of picking up 'injuries' when a team is doing shite. Flying at the top, and players play through the pain barrier to be involved
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Spot on post by the way marra. Now isn't the time for panic, but inevitably some are doing exactly that. I've always said if and when relegation does happen, it will hit us so hard that the repercussions might be felt for some considerable time.

I'd personally see if we can establish with Moyes at the helm. That would include relegation and beyond if necessary. The support might not stand for that and there will be casualties. Ellis Short will need to show his mettle firstly with his loyalty to his chosen manager, then by backing his judgment by allowing Moyes to rebuild.

Then on the other hand.....sack and recruit has worked so far ;)
 
Maximus said:
Spot on post by the way marra. Now isn't the time for panic, but inevitably some are doing exactly that. I've always said if and when relegation does happen, it will hit us so hard that the repercussions might be felt for some considerable time.

I'd personally see if we can establish with Moyes at the helm. That would include relegation and beyond if necessary. The support might not stand for that and there will be casualties. Ellis Short will need to show his mettle firstly with his loyalty to his chosen manager, then by backing his judgment by allowing Moyes to rebuild.

Then on the other hand.....sack and recruit has worked so far ;)
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My thoughts as well. We have who we have until January even if another manager came in. Just say they come in and suddenly Moyes buys are not included with their plans. It has been this way for loads of our players and manager, and why we are stuck with what we have. New players and teams take time to settle. I would personally go down with Moyes to rebuild if we have to. Everyone seems to think our form from January onwards meant we were a top ten team, which Moyes dismantled. Big Sam was great for us, but hi gather him and Short fell out over the way he went about the England job. Can't see how Short would take him back over his preferred choice.
It seems a long time ago over the summer when we were linked to Dzeco but ended up with Victor! :lol:
I just think it's time to batten down the hatches and stick together as one. If that makes me a happy clapper so be it in some eyes. I'm far far from happy. I just think positive things happen to positive people, so when things go shite, i look to be positive. It is getting hard like :lol:
 
MrBraithwaite said:
You cannot maintain performance when you have never been able to field the same 11 twice, the most important players are injured on and off, and you lack quality in key areas.

Borini and Cattermole are big misses, Kirchoff is injured as usual and Kone has been lazy all season
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Their injury records are legendary and well-documented. Hardly comes as a surprise

Those 3 in particular are sick-notes. Look up their records.
 
fyl2u said:
Unfortunately, sometimes in life we have to accept that things out of our control can screw up even the best-laid plans of the finest men. This is one of those times.
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As Robbie Burns would say:

The best laid schemes o' mice an' men
Gang aft a-gley, [often go awry]
An' lea'e us nought but grief an' pain,
For promised joy.
 
TiredEyes said:
I wouldn't mind if I could see progress or had an idea about what he was trying to achieve but it's just woeful performance after woeful performance and as much as the players do the playing, the buck stops with Moyes.
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You're not the only one. Can take defeats, it's the manner of them that's the worry. It's as bad as anything served up by MON, PDC, Poyet and Advocaat. Difference being they had all improved us before it went tits up. Moyes has been left a team that was better than any the others had as a starting point.
 
nandos sonic sauce said:
My thoughts as well. We have who we have until January even if another manager came in. Just say they come in and suddenly Moyes buys are not included with their plans. It has been this way for loads of our players and manager, and why we are stuck with what we have. New players and teams take time to settle. I would personally go down with Moyes to rebuild if we have to. Everyone seems to think our form from January onwards meant we were a top ten team, which Moyes dismantled. Big Sam was great for us, but hi gather him and Short fell out over the way he went about the England job. Can't see how Short would take him back over his preferred choice.
It seems a long time ago over the summer when we were linked to Dzeco but ended up with Victor! :lol:
I just think it's time to batten down the hatches and stick together as one. If that makes me a happy clapper so be it in some eyes. I'm far far from happy. I just think positive things happen to positive people, so when things go shite, i look to be positive. It is getting hard like :lol:
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Oh well, at least there's a few of us at least prepared for the worst and that includes any muck and bullets coming our way. I've already committed to this season and I'm sure after having witnessed the great escapes in glorious live detail, the thought of witnessing another relegation isn't a pleasant one - especially as it has been such a long time.

Such a pity as I was enjoying the £30 away games. :cool:
 
Our injured players....

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P van Aanholt Groin Strain No Return Date
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L Kone Hamstring Injury October 22, 2016 Late Fitness Test
J Kirchhoff Hamstring Injury November 26, 2016
L Cattermole Back Injury No Return Date
A Januzaj Ankle Injury November 5, 2016
F Borini Groin Strain December 26, 2016
V Mannone Elbow November 19, 2016
S Larsson MCL Knee Ligament Injury February 1, 2017

The majority of which will start in/improve our first team.... Moyes has ben very unlucky thus far, IMO....
 
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