Why does nobody care?

nilid69 said:
For the record I don't see Brexit as one of our major issues. I didn't bring it up, I was replying to a post on here
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To be fair, most footballers are thick as pigshit anyway, so I would guess most of them voted leave. So the fact Sunderland voted leave could be seen as a positive for attracting potential players. any bites?
 


nilid69 said:
We'll probably have to agree to disagree. For me, what you're saying here is just highlighting the issue. People shouldn't be coming to Sunderland because "it's ok, we'll live out in the country and order from Waitrose so my family don't get abused in the street, and ah well the city hasn't attracted investment in a long time but we'll just go out in Newcastle, it'll be fine.

At least they're paying me more than anyone else was willing to give to a shit mercenary like me. "

For the record I don't see Brexit as one of our major issues. I didn't bring it up, I was replying to a post on here.
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I'm not saying that they'll be thinking that at all, don't put words in my mouth. I'm saying they because they won't be living here or going out regularly here it won't be on their radar when choosing a club. Professional footballers won't live in any city centre and won't regularly go out where they're liable to be recognised and hassled by people wanting selfies and the likes, or in our case more likely people wanting to tell them they're shit, even if the place in question voted remain. It's an utterly ridiculous argument. If we make enquiries for 100 players I'd be absolutely staggered if even 1 of them was put off because of f***ing Brexit.

@Frijj you like statistics, do you have any stats about the incidents of race hate crime in different areas of the country, just wondering if we are any worse here than the likes of Manchester and London where clubs have no problem attracting players, pretty sure we'll compare quite favourably
 
Guinness Guzzler said:
I'm not saying that they'll be thinking that at all, don't put words in my mouth. I'm saying they because they won't be living here or going out regularly here it won't be on their radar when choosing a club. Professional footballers won't live in any city centre and won't regularly go out where they're liable to be recognised and hassled by people wanting selfies and the likes, or in our case more likely people wanting to tell them they're shit, even if the place in question voted remain. It's an utterly ridiculous argument. If we make enquiries for 100 players I'd be absolutely staggered if even 1 of them was put off because of f***ing Brexit.

@Frijj you like statistics, do you have any stats about the incidents of race hate crime in different areas of the country, just wondering if we are any worse here than the likes of Manchester and London where clubs have no problem attracting players, pretty sure we'll compare quite favourably
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Ooh I don’t get on PF much.

This information is available but it’s tied to constabularies, rather than geographical areas.

I can’t imahine hate crimes in the bridges are putting people off joining the club

I’d say the fact we’re f***ing dogshit and dropping like a stone is doing that just fine
 
Frijj said:
Ooh I don’t get on PF much.

This information is available but it’s tied to constabularies, rather than geographical areas.

I can’t imahine hate crimes in the bridges are putting people off joining the club

I’d say the fact we’re f***ing dogshit and dropping like a stone is doing that just fine
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So our figures would be tied in with Newcastle's then? Just the lad said Sunderland had seen a massive increase in race hate crime, wonder where those stats come from if the stats available come from Northumbria police who also cover Newcastle? But yes, I rather agree with you, it's the whole being broke and shit thing that's stopping us from getting players, not Brexit!
 
Guinness Guzzler said:
So our figures would be tied in with Newcastle's then? Just the lad said Sunderland had seen a massive increase in race hate crime, wonder where those stats come from if the stats available come from Northumbria police who also cover Newcastle? But yes, I rather agree with you, it's the whole being broke and shit thing that's stopping us from getting players, not Brexit!
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In public releases I think they are tied in with all of Northumbria but on occasion they get published separately.

I’m sure a rate of hate crimes is calculable for Sunderland but not without a bit of work first I’d say, especially not when comparing to other areas

You could FOI the police or maybe a newspaper has, or maybe they have split the data in publication somewhere and I’ve not realised...
 
nilid69 said:
Not high on the list. All these things add up though.

See last few posts. It concerns me that people down here have Sunderland as the butt of their jokes now. It can't help our current predicament.
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Like I said mate. Pro footballers weren’t keen on coming here prior to the vote unless we launched wads of cash at them. I’ve no reason to believe it’s any different now other than we are one, possibly two divisions lower than we were two seasons ago. The fact we’re leaving the EU won’t alter that.
 
Dogbark said:
Any West Ham predicament will get media coverage regardless of whether the fans protest or not.
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if that was the case then why did it take a mass protest for it to become news worthy? West Ham fans have been on at their board since they left Upton Park!
 
[QUOTE="The Rat, post: 27260582, member: 34071"
I just don't see our situation being mentioned anywhere outside of our bubble. No ex-players speaking out. No pundits.[/QUOTE]

Haven't you heard Gary Bennett lately?
 
Guinness Guzzler said:
Spot on, as you say it is surprising but Sunderland are not militant at all as a fan base. Also, the mags seem to have the attention seeking fanzine type things that enjoy planning things like this. A lot of protests, other than the stand outside the ground and shout abuse type, need planning. We don't have any supporters group that seems capable of, or inclined to do it. RAWA are only just starting to be fair to them but they're still very much in the "let's discuss it" phase. Do ALS just not want to rock the boat? They've been very quiet on the protest front throughout our struggles. Roker Report equally hasn't tried to plan anything. Your average fan is a bit limited in terms of what they can do and the reach they have
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Just seen this so thought I'd put my point across.

I've had the same stance throughout these talks regarding protest - I'm more than happy for Roker Report to help promote any initiative if a) it seems worth doing and b) there's an appetite there to support it.

Unfortunately nobody has organised anything yet. Because RR has a platform we can help promote stuff and get the word out, but I'm just a fan who writes a bit that has a family, a house, a job - there aren't enough hours in the day and I wouldn't know the first place to start with organising a protest, nor do I think there should be an expectancy for a bunch of bloggers to be able to put something together.

But I digress - if there's anyone out there, yourself perhaps?, that is organising something I'd be more than happy to help promote it if its deemed worthwhile.
 
Cack Stottie said:
Just seen this so thought I'd put my point across.

I've had the same stance throughout these talks regarding protest - I'm more than happy for Roker Report to help promote any initiative if a) it seems worth doing and b) there's an appetite there to support it.

Unfortunately nobody has organised anything yet. Because RR has a platform we can help promote stuff and get the word out, but I'm just a fan who writes a bit that has a family, a house, a job - there aren't enough hours in the day and I wouldn't know the first place to start with organising a protest, nor do I think there should be an expectancy for a bunch of bloggers to be able to put something together.

But I digress - if there's anyone out there, yourself perhaps?, that is organising something I'd be more than happy to help promote it if its deemed worthwhile.
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To be fair RR aren't really the people I'd expect to plan it, largely for the reasons you mention, but certainly it's something that I'd expect ALS to be leading on. I'm not absolutely convinced a protest would be a good idea, and certainly any idea started by me is unlikely to catch on, I really think a fanzine type group should decide if they want to organise and promote a protest and should just do it if they decide it's worth doing. Leading things like this is something I'd expect from ALS (like I say, not so much from bloggers like yourselves although I'd expect as you mention you could help spread the word). It just feels like no organisation is prepared to do anything about it despite all publishing letters etc and articles about it. If there is appetite for a protest it needs to be planned now, it's nearly the end of the season and we know all momentum will be lost when that point is reached.

Mentioned it before but individuals/ groups of mates might be able to get a random shout outside the ground protest started but anything more involved (organising people to leave/ enter the ground at a certain time, banners or whatever) needs to be led by a fans organisation, none seem to have the inclination to do it so we've just got loads and loads of talk
 
We are the club that the England manager told our star striker he needs to move from to get a chance of playing for England.
No disrespect to them but he only moved to Villa and suddenly started getting selected.
 
Guinness Guzzler said:
To be fair RR aren't really the people I'd expect to plan it, largely for the reasons you mention, but certainly it's something that I'd expect ALS to be leading on. I'm not absolutely convinced a protest would be a good idea, and certainly any idea started by me is unlikely to catch on, I really think a fanzine type group should decide if they want to organise and promote a protest and should just do it if they decide it's worth doing. Leading things like this is something I'd expect from ALS (like I say, not so much from bloggers like yourselves although I'd expect as you mention you could help spread the word). It just feels like no organisation is prepared to do anything about it despite all publishing letters etc and articles about it. If there is appetite for a protest it needs to be planned now, it's nearly the end of the season and we know all momentum will be lost when that point is reached.

Mentioned it before but individuals/ groups of mates might be able to get a random shout outside the ground protest started but anything more involved (organising people to leave/ enter the ground at a certain time, banners or whatever) needs to be led by a fans organisation, none seem to have the inclination to do it so we've just got loads and loads of talk
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Sadly I suspect that there's isn't the appetite for protest. People can barely be arsed to sit through 90 minutes of footy at the minute.

We held a survey that garnered 1800 responses regarding the type of protest people would support, and the responses were really mixed. Granted, that's a small number, but I just don't get the feeling that people are bothered much at the moment. It feels like that ship has sailed.
 
The Great MES said:
I'm not trying to have a dig. We're talking about Sunderland's demise and trying to gain national attention. And then we look up the road and we see a club that runs at a profit, spends quite big (don't tell me that 100 mil over the last two seasons isn't big), full house every week, high profile manager and now more or less established in the PL, basically booming. And then we see all the banners and protests. Every Sunderland fan I know (myself included) are at an absolute loss as to the point of them.
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source? It's nowhere near that...and don't give me that shite about you can't take into account the millions raked in from Sissoko, Wijnaldum, Townsend, Janmaat et al. Over 10 years, we are the lowest spending club in the Premier League - less than £6m per year. This is when TV money is at record highs. Ashley uses the club as a giant billboard for sports Direct foregoing all other sponsorship. And you still don't understand the frustrations?

cluffy said:
Pardew was the one the mags should have held onto as he got them fifth. Must be gutting for them having Rafa now who can't get them anywhere near as high and has taken them down
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The thinking that a manager can 'take a club down' after 9 games is exactly why safc is in such a mess. Hounding managers out after a dozen games. It's the reason nufc fans have stuck firmly behind Benitez. A good manager working for a shithouse of an owner.
 
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king of the road said:
source? It's nowhere near that...and don't give me that shite about you can't take into account the millions raked in from Sissoko, Wijnaldum, Townsend, Janmaat et al. Over 10 years, we are the lowest spending club in the Premier League - less than £6m per year. This is when TV money is at record highs. Ashley uses the club as a giant billboard for sports Direct foregoing all other sponsorship. And you still don't understand the frustrations?



The thinking that a manager can 'take a club down' after 9 games is exactly why safc is in such a mess. Hounding managers out after a dozen games. It's the reason nufc fans have stuck firmly behind Benitez. A good manager working for a shithouse of an owner.
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NET SPEND :D
 
king of the road said:
Yes Rafa took us up with a net spend of minus £25m. Grayson/Coleman have taken you close to relegation on a net spend of minus £28m.

Love a net spend argument as it shows up the financially clueless
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In terms of how a team is performing in any given season net spend isn't really important. Obviously long term low net spend is a benefit. In any given season, however, what matters is the value of the squad, not how much money you've made/ spent since the last season. Try and estimate how much NUFC would have been able to raise had they sold every player from last seasons team, that's a rough value of players available to Benitez. How much do you think SAFC would get if we sold our lot (let's assume we could sell the loanees and get the money). Our squad would be lucky to be worth £10m for the whole lot of them. Yours was worth comfortably more. Net spend doesn't affect that, you had more valuable players available who, in theory should be (and in practice were) considerably better than ours.

If man city keep their exact same squad next season except they sell Bravo for £6m they've got a net spend of -6m. Imagine Middlesbrough go up, don't sell anyone and sign one player, a £2m backup right back. Their net spend is higher than man City's, should they finish ahead of them? That's why net spend is a load of shit in a single season, city's squad would still be worth probably not far off half a billion quid more
 
Guinness Guzzler said:
In terms of how a team is performing in any given season net spend isn't really important. Obviously long term low net spend is a benefit. In any given season, however, what matters is the value of the squad, not how much money you've made/ spent since the last season. Try and estimate how much NUFC would have been able to raise had they sold every player from last seasons team, that's a rough value of players available to Benitez. How much do you think SAFC would get if we sold our lot (let's assume we could sell the loanees and get the money). Our squad would be lucky to be worth £10m for the whole lot of them. Yours was worth comfortably more. Net spend doesn't affect that, you had more valuable players available who, in theory should be (and in practice were) considerably better than ours.

If man city keep their exact same squad next season except they sell Bravo for £6m they've got a net spend of -6m. Imagine Middlesbrough go up, don't sell anyone and sign one player, a £2m backup right back. Their net spend is higher than man City's, should they finish ahead of them? That's why net spend is a load of shit in a single season, city's squad would still be worth probably not far off half a billion quid more
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I totally agree. And you back up my point nicely. Man city's net spend over 10 years is £500m, Newcastle's is around £60m. One of the lowest, if not the lowest of all 'established' Premier clubs. Some say that's being well run. My view is that Ashley is lining his pockets.
 

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