When do we start talking about Jos Buttler?

[rentaghost]

I think Buttler and Foakes will go to SL where it will be a close call. Foakes is a truly class keeper and that is very important in SL. I expect tho that Buttler will keep his place for that tour but really could do with some runs in the last test.

 

[Parkside]

You can read too much into Lions’ squads. They generally take younger squads, rather than the next 15 in the queue

Bit of both according to Ed Smith "With this tour we’ve got England’s short-term needs in mind, with the upcoming tour of Sri Lanka and a busy summer schedule, as well as an opportunity to provide players with relevant experience for future Ashes series."
Bess, Crawley, Sibley and Parkinson are all in the Lions squad and surely all 4 will go to Sri Lanka. Certainly a top wicketkeeper used to keeping to spin i.e. Foakes should go there. Interesting!

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I think Buttler and Foakes will go to SL where it will be a close call. Foakes is a truly class keeper and that is very important in SL. I expect tho that Buttler will keep his place for that tour but really could do with some runs in the last test.

This is my prediction

they will take both
They will also take Bairstow under the guise of backup batsman
Buttler gets the shits on the morning of the first day of the first test
Bairstow back in
Bairstow bowled through the gate for 12

Bit of both according to Ed Smith "With this tour we’ve got England’s short-term needs in mind, with the upcoming tour of Sri Lanka and a busy summer schedule, as well as an opportunity to provide players with relevant experience for future Ashes series."
Bess, Crawley, Sibley and Parkinson are all in the Lions squad and surely all 4 will go to Sri Lanka. Certainly a top wicketkeeper used to keeping to spin i.e. Foakes should go there. Interesting!

I take your point. But the 4 you list are way younger

 

[smoker]

This is my prediction

they will take both
They will also take Bairstow under the guise of backup batsman
Buttler gets the shits on the morning of the first day of the first test
Bairstow back in
Bairstow bowled through the gate for 12

Yup, so predictable!

 

[Paddy O'Dors]

Foakes was canny in Sri Lanka last time like. A horse for the course.

 

[NorthCountryBoy]

One thing I’d say about Buttler is that you should add a few runs to his average to reflect the amount of times he selflessly throws the bat.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

tests and tons of England’s middle and lower order in recent times. I’ve looked at 5-8 and tried not to be selective. This is from 2012, and I accept there is the odd test cap for the likes of Ansari, Dawson, Overton and Jordan. But they are fundamentally bowlers who can bat.

Stokes 62/9
Pope 6/1
Bairstow 70/6
Modern 60/5
Foakes 5/1
Woakes 31/1
Curran 15/0

Buttler 38/1

so Curran aside, he’s poorer than the rest. By some distance

 

[NorthCountryBoy]

tests and tons of England’s middle and lower order in recent times. I’ve looked at 5-8 and tried not to be selective. This is from 2012, and I accept there is the odd test cap for the likes of Ansari, Dawson, Overton and Jordan. But they are fundamentally bowlers who can bat.

Stokes 62/9
Pope 6/1
Bairstow 70/6
Modern 60/5
Foakes 5/1
Woakes 31/1
Curran 15/0

Buttler 38/1

so Curran aside, he’s poorer than the rest. By some distance

Graham Thorpe would probably rank worse than some inferior batsmen under that metric mind.

Plus I daresay JB has been left with the tail more than Bairstow and Stokes.

 

[smoker]

tests and tons of England’s middle and lower order in recent times. I’ve looked at 5-8 and tried not to be selective. This is from 2012, and I accept there is the odd test cap for the likes of Ansari, Dawson, Overton and Jordan. But they are fundamentally bowlers who can bat.

Stokes 62/9
Pope 6/1
Bairstow 70/6
Modern 60/5
Foakes 5/1
Woakes 31/1
Curran 15/0

Buttler 38/1

so Curran aside, he’s poorer than the rest. By some distance

Why did you use hundreds not batting average to compare their value to the team? On tons alone, Keaton Jennings would be playing ahead of Crawley.

 

[Paddy O'Dors]

tests and tons of England’s middle and lower order in recent times. I’ve looked at 5-8 and tried not to be selective. This is from 2012, and I accept there is the odd test cap for the likes of Ansari, Dawson, Overton and Jordan. But they are fundamentally bowlers who can bat.

Stokes 62/9
Pope 6/1
Bairstow 70/6
Modern 60/5
Foakes 5/1
Woakes 31/1
Curran 15/0

Buttler 38/1

so Curran aside, he’s poorer than the rest. By some distance

Bairstow and Moeen and have had a fair few innings near the top of the order mind.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Why did you use hundreds not batting average to compare their value to the team? On tons alone, Keaton Jennings would be playing ahead of Crawley.

It’s just one view of it. I recognise there are others

Bairstow and Moeen and have had a fair few innings near the top of the order mind.

True

but both have 3 tons from 7 and Bairstow has 2 from 6. Only 1 above 6

 

[The Breen Machine]

This whole he’s a great ODI player doesn’t wash with me. Different format and even when he gets the opportunity to be a bit more expansive he usually fails. He’s on par with Paine at the moment in terms of test performance and most questioned his ongoing selection by the Australian’s.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

This whole he’s a great ODI player doesn’t wash with me. Different format and even when he gets the opportunity to be a bit more expansive he usually fails. He’s on par with Paine at the moment in terms of test performance and most questioned his ongoing selection by the Australian’s.

That’s been my argument all along

if he actually played more first class cricket then maybe he would have a better chance

but as I said in my first post on the thread, I don’t mind him or Bairstow at 7. I would prefer Foakes but I can see the logic. You just pick one of the 3, you don’t try and shoe horn 2 or even 3 in

 

[Voice of fair play]

This whole he’s a great ODI player doesn’t wash with me. Different format and even when he gets the opportunity to be a bit more expansive he usually fails. He’s on par with Paine at the moment in terms of test performance and most questioned his ongoing selection by the Australian’s.

I certainly take your point with your second sentence, but not sure what you mean that 'This whole he's a great ODI player doesn't wash me'

Of course he is a great one day player he has something like the 5 or 6 fastest one days tons by a englishman ever, and is nothing short of superb in the format.

 

[The Breen Machine]

I certainly take your point with your second sentence, but not sure what you mean that 'This whole he's a great ODI player doesn't wash me'

Of course he is a great one day player he has something like the 5 or 6 fastest one days tons by a englishman ever, and is nothing short of superb in the format.

I mean it holds no relevance in a discussion about his test place. Aaron Finch, Michael Bevan to name two are/were world class ODI players who simply weren’t up to standard at test level, Buttler is in danger of staying in that category.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I mean it holds no relevance in a discussion about his test place. Aaron Finch, Michael Bevan to name two are/were world class ODI players who simply weren’t up to standard at test level, Buttler is in danger of staying in that category.

He’s well into that category

see also Jason Roy, Eoin Morgan

no issue with it at all, he’s brilliant in the short form

 

[Voice of fair play]

I mean it holds no relevance in a discussion about his test place. Aaron Finch, Michael Bevan to name two are/were world class ODI players who simply weren’t up to standard at test level, Buttler is in danger of staying in that category.

Fair enough, like I said was not sure what you were getting at, makes sense.

 

[TravellingMackem]

None of the keepers can bat. Foakes is a far superior keeper though. Seems a no brainier to me to bring in Foakes

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

If Jennings gets picked for SL based on his performance on the last tour there then surely Foakes should too

I think both will go. Jennings will start as cover, maybe Foakes too. But Foakes may end up starting - Buttler is in the last chance saloon at the Wanderers and that's not really the pitch you'd pick for a save your place innings.

Tbh, even if he gets 80 I'd be dropping him. It's ton or bust for me. Not so much for the runs, but has anyone seen the quality of his glovework against spin on this pitch? All series really - he's way below the standard of Foakes (and to be fair, Bairstow) in this department.

Foakes was canny in Sri Lanka last time like. A horse for the course.

More than that, really. His turn to cement his place - the others have fucked it.

 

[Liverpool Beachball]

I think both will go. Jennings will start as cover, maybe Foakes too. But Foakes may end up starting - Buttler is in the last chance saloon at the Wanderers and that's not really the pitch you'd pick for a save your place innings.

Tbh, even if he gets 80 I'd be dropping him. It's ton or bust for me. Not so much for the runs, but has anyone seen the quality of his glovework against spin on this pitch? All series really - he's way below the standard of Foakes (and to be fair, Bairstow) in this department.



More than that, really. His turn to cement his place - the others have fucked it.

Think Jennings will start over Crawley unless Crawley gets a score as well