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Rafael Benítez

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Morny said:
No, they didn't. But they did improve, noticeably, and in particularly after his first 3 or 4 games (which indicates it wasn't actually a new manager bounce). He improved them more than Di Canio did with us, or Advocaat. Both of them had the good fortune that other teams were shite enough to keep us afloat.

I don't get how people can't accept he did improve them. Of course he f***ing did, you'd have to be barmy to think otherwise. He didn't improve them as much as they needed, but he absolutely cannot be blamed for their relegation, that's ridiculous.
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Would you say beating us, Norwich or Villa was asking too much of him?
 
Morny said:
So they did improve then? Extrapolated over a whole season, you're talking about 8 points better. So about a 22-23% improvement? That's without considering the fact that you'd expect them to get better the more time he spent with them (as they did, or as we did under Allardyce?).
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The two points across 10 games is too mild a variance to be considered as being necessarily attributable across further games. For me it is far too close a set of results to draw any meaningful conclusion from as to whether one was achieving better results or not - certainly not as clear as the wild difference in perception between McClaren and Benitez's results with fans.
 
The Fish said:
I wasn't aware a club's performance in the league was in total isolation from other clubs?
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OK, you were one of the shittest 3 teams in the division and got RELEGATED, you do understand that? you are not in the champions league and wont be for a long time, so go and infest another forum you WUM
 
AndrewP said:
It isn't, but the only thing relevant to staying up is finishing outside of the bottom three.

Had Newcastle beaten Sunderland at home or Norwich away they'd have stayed up, they bottled the games that mattered.
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They did but again, you have to look at the bigger picture, it's childish not to. Like saying Pochettino is a shit manager because relegated Newcastle did the double over him. Or if Newcastle had beaten Villa, or Bournemouth at home, or, or ,or...

doesn't really tell the whole story does it.

I understand it's a sunderland message board, so there's value in trying to have a dig at the lost magpies, but to claim Benitez didn't improve Newcastle from the shit show McClaren left, that Rafa isn't a good manager, that we're not lucky to have him in our current state... it's just a bit f***ing silly really. :lol:
 
Mainze said:
Would you say beating us, Norwich or Villa was asking too much of him?
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They're poor results and he could have done better, I suppose. But then, thrashing Spurs and Swansea was very good, as were points against City and Liverpool.

But to blame a relegation on a manger who had ten games, and in those ten games he improved the side, then it's silly. Actually, it's the type of thing we'd routinely rip the piss out of the Mags for - jumping on a managers back far too fast (despite our recent record).
 
Black Cat Gypsy said:
Leicester was a fluke. Even they'll tell you that. What have big clubs done this summer? Gone out and got the best managers around. Chelsea, Spurs, Liverpool, Man Utd and City will only get stronger. West Ham and Southampton will get stronger. We don't know about Leicester. It seems it's a forgone conclusion that Benitez will have you in the mix next season. But first you need to get promoted. All this will happen under Benitez and of course Satan himself Mike Ashley. You've forgotten about him.

I believe Allardyce could have us knocking on the door of Europe within 2 years giving the right backing and time. But first we need to build a team that finishes comfortably mid-table without fear of relegation. That's been realistic. Talk of CL when you're in the Championship is delusional.
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It's delisional talk that got Steve McClaren egg on his face.
When he first took over I was chuffed, there was a reason the wally with the brolly was sacked or swiftly jumped ship from Wolfsburg, FC Twente (Second Time),Notts Forest and Derby. Then when he spouted on about top 8 target, I nearly choked on my pint.
They need to get their heads out of the clouds and concentrate on the reality in front of them. At least 1 long season in the Chumpionship, where they currently deserve to be.
 
Jardin said:
The two points across 10 games is too mild a variance to be considered as being necessarily attributable across further games. For me it is far too close a set of results to draw any meaningful conclusion from as to whether one was achieving better results or not - certainly not as clear as the wild difference in perception between McClaren and Benitez's results with fans.
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But they were better. Anyone with eyes could see they were better. They were better organised defensively (especially after the Southampton game) and they looked like a coherent unit. They never looked like that under Mclaren.

I'm sorry, but if you can't see that they improved then there's no point in the discussion.
 
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