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Defoe or Ibrahimovic

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Imagine having this debate 5 or 10 years a go, it would have been laughable. :lol:

But now it's a fair enough question which is testament to Defoe, I wonder if even he thinks he's a better player now than what he was 5-10 years a go?
 
pwsafc said:
He's not scoring goals in lower league, he's done it in top flight all his career. Can people on here not read the op, he said who would they rather have in current safc team, not who's the better player!!
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Seems like a shitload of people haven't read the question mate. Fair play to you for sticking with it.
 
Leicester Fan said:
Imagine having this debate 5 or 10 years a go, it would have been laughable. :lol:

But now it's a fair enough question which is testament to Defoe, I wonder if even he thinks he's a better player now than what he was 5-10 years a go?
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He's playing in the best team the world has ever seen man :cool:
 
Voice of fair play said:
In your opinion why do you think all these diffrent top class experienced managers have never signed him if it's just common sense?
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Why are people grasping the concept of the original post, in the current safc team I wouldn't swap Defoe, ibra needs quality players around him as has been proven this season when man u were shit earlier in the season he was shit , Defoe has played in a shit team for 2 seasons and played well
 
xmfd said:
just to settle a friendly argument

who would you have in our current team, Defoe or Ibrahimovic
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Ibrahimovic is much better technically, but Defoe is far superior in front of goal.

Ibrahimovic is more of a forward while JD is more of an out and out striker. It's goals that win games so JD any day of the week (and preferably a Sat afternoon against Saints)
 
Voice of fair play said:
I said from teams lower in the league, which means the top flight so guess its you not reading.

He has scored goals all his career in the top flight,you right,which means all the top teams have had a very good look at him,yet have not signed him does that not tell a story? Or do you know better than all them top managers.

What I was mainly discussing with you,was when you said of course Defoe would get in Man United side, nothing about who is the better player,so another assumption made by you.

He would not, at his peak he was not good enough for that, never mind now.



Red and white glasses as always on this site.

Defoe has been exceptional,absolute brilliant for us, the team is built around him scoring goals for us, much like it was for Bent.

I am sure at the time Bent's stats were better than some Man United forwards and we would not have swapped him for many players at the time because he was scoring for fun, however would he have got in the Man United team at the time.

The answer is no, it's exactly the same principle with Defoe.

@Jay first post made total common sense and for that all he got was insults about not understanding football.
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You've made some excellent points in this thread.

Sometimes it's just a case of horses for courses and Defoe and Sunderland's style of play fit each other like a glove. A bit like Vardy and Leicester last year, most people would tell you that Vardy has turned to shit this year and not making the runs, I watch him every week and would say the same but apparently Vardy is covering the same amount of distance and is more clinical in his finishing this season according to this BBC article.

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What has happened to Jamie Vardy?

Vardy has had different strike partners this season, whereas last year he was predominantly up front alongside Shinji Okazaki
Would you be surprised to find out Jamie Vardy's conversion rate is actually better this season than it was during the title campaign?

Vardy scored 24 Premier League goals in 2015-16, form that saw him named Football Writers' Footballer of the Year and shortlisted for the Ballon d'Or and Fifa's own player of the year award.

This season he has only five league goals, three of which came in one game against Manchester City, and has scored in only one league game since 10 September - a run of 17 matches.

But he is actually more clinical this year.

2015-16 2016-17
Excludes penalties
Chance conversion rate (%) 22 24
Big chance conversion rate (%) 42 44
The problem, it seems, is he is simply not getting the chances. This season, on average, he gets one opportunity every two matches, whereas last season it was more than one per game.

Vardy after 24 games of last season and this season
2015-16 2016-17
Goals 18 (ranked 1st in PL) 5 (21st)
Shots (inc blocks) 78 (3rd) 28 (23rd)
Shots on target 37 (2nd) 9 (32nd)
Chances created (inc assists) 30 (5th) 18 (16th)
While the evidence points to the lack of a supply line (fewer shots, fewer chances), there has also been the suggestion Vardy is not making the runs that proved so successful last season.

Ian Stringer, who covers the Foxes for BBC Radio Leicester, said: "Jamie Vardy haring around is a sight to behold, but it seems rare this season.

"I think that's due to his chances being few and far between; he can't run in behind if he's not being slotted in."

The stats actually show that Vardy is working as hard as last season - covering exactly the same average distance per game - and he is even making more sprints than last year. The ball is simply not finding him when he does. And certainly not in dangerous areas.

2015-16 2016-17
Distance covered per 90 mins (average) 10.1km 10.1km
Sprints per 90 min (average) 54.1 57.8
 
Leicester Fan said:
You've made some excellent points in this thread.

Sometimes it's just a case of horses for courses and Defoe and Sunderland's style of play fit each other like a glove. A bit like Vardy and Leicester last year, most people would tell you that Vardy has turned to shit this year and not making the runs, I watch him every week and would say the same but apparently Vardy is covering the same amount of distance and is more clinical in his finishing this season according to this BBC article.

You must be logged on to see external links


What has happened to Jamie Vardy?

Vardy has had different strike partners this season, whereas last year he was predominantly up front alongside Shinji Okazaki
Would you be surprised to find out Jamie Vardy's conversion rate is actually better this season than it was during the title campaign?

Vardy scored 24 Premier League goals in 2015-16, form that saw him named Football Writers' Footballer of the Year and shortlisted for the Ballon d'Or and Fifa's own player of the year award.

This season he has only five league goals, three of which came in one game against Manchester City, and has scored in only one league game since 10 September - a run of 17 matches.

But he is actually more clinical this year.

2015-16 2016-17
Excludes penalties
Chance conversion rate (%) 22 24
Big chance conversion rate (%) 42 44
The problem, it seems, is he is simply not getting the chances. This season, on average, he gets one opportunity every two matches, whereas last season it was more than one per game.

Vardy after 24 games of last season and this season
2015-16 2016-17
Goals 18 (ranked 1st in PL) 5 (21st)
Shots (inc blocks) 78 (3rd) 28 (23rd)
Shots on target 37 (2nd) 9 (32nd)
Chances created (inc assists) 30 (5th) 18 (16th)
While the evidence points to the lack of a supply line (fewer shots, fewer chances), there has also been the suggestion Vardy is not making the runs that proved so successful last season.

Ian Stringer, who covers the Foxes for BBC Radio Leicester, said: "Jamie Vardy haring around is a sight to behold, but it seems rare this season.

"I think that's due to his chances being few and far between; he can't run in behind if he's not being slotted in."

The stats actually show that Vardy is working as hard as last season - covering exactly the same average distance per game - and he is even making more sprints than last year. The ball is simply not finding him when he does. And certainly not in dangerous areas.

2015-16 2016-17
Distance covered per 90 mins (average) 10.1km 10.1km
Sprints per 90 min (average) 54.1 57.8
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:rolleyes:
 
Into the Light said:
Ibrahimovic is much better technically, but Defoe is far superior in front of goal.

Ibrahimovic is more of a forward while JD is more of an out and out striker. It's goals that win games so JD any day of the week (and preferably a Sat afternoon against Saints)
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Defoe is not superior to Ibrahimovic is everyway imo
 
pwsafc said:
How do you know they never tried to sign him
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Is that the best you can come with,you know rightly or wrongly the big teams simply have fancied him.

pwsafc said:
Why are people grasping the concept of the original post, in the current safc team I wouldn't swap Defoe, ibra needs quality players around him as has been proven this season when man u were shit earlier in the season he was shit , Defoe has played in a shit team for 2 seasons and played well
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I am grasping the concept of the post and your reasoning total understand it, what I am not grasping is your statement that 'of course he would get in Man United's side.

You seem incapable of thinking of the wider picture that diffrent teams play diffrent systems and just because a goalscorer scores lots of goals for a lesser teams does not mean would score them for a better team.

Football is a lot more complicated than that,

It's not common sense like you say or as simple as that, otherwise Defoe would have been snapped up years ago, because he had always scored goals, but the experts I.e top class managers don't think that obviously.
 
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Voice of fair play said:
Is that the best you can come with,you know rightly or wrongly the big teams simply have fancied him.
Your the one that can't seem to grasp the concept of the op. And yes he would get in the Man U team in my opinion and the opinion of many others. You have no idea if bids or enquiries were made when he was at Spurs, don't pretend that you know that as a fact


I am grasping the concept of the post and your reasoning total understand it, what I am not grasping is your statement that 'of course he would get in Man United's side.

You seem incapable of thinking of the wider picture that diffrent teams play diffrent systems and just because a goalscorer scores lots of goals for a lesser teams does not mean would score them for a better team.

Football is a lot more complicated than that,

It's not common sense like you say or as simple as that, otherwise Defoe would have been snapped up years ago, because he had always scored goals, but the experts I.e top class managers don't think that obviously.
Click to expand...
 
@pwsafc

Why do you keeping saying I have not read the op,once again I totally understand the reasoning for us to prefer Defoe, just to make that clear as you keep coming back with the same thing I agree Defoe suits us and would not swap him for many forwards.

However I am disagreeing with you that he would get in Man United side,that's a totally different thing or any top 4 side for that matter.

I also saying using your words that it is common sense that if Defoe was good enough for a top side,he would have played for them by now.
 
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Voice of fair play said:
@pwsafc

Why do you keeping saying I have not read the op,once again I totally understand the reasoning for us to prefer Defoe, just to make that clear as you keep coming back with the same thing that Defoe suits us and would not swap him for many forwards.

However I am disagreeing with you that he would get in Man United side,that's a totally different thing.

I also saying using your words that it is common sense that if Defoe was good enough for a top side,he would have played for them by now.
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He played for Spurs
 
pwsafc said:
He played for Spurs
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And was third and fourth choice striker for a lot of that time, all the easier for a Man Utd or Arsenal to have picked him up.

Seen as you side stepped that question before why do you think they didn't sign him.

Just going round in circles here mate just to clarify I think Defoe is a fantastic striker who suits our play and has been awesome for us but IMO is just below top class, and that is why top clubs have not come in for him and why a lot of other forwards were picked for England ahead of him.
 
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pwsafc said:
It makes no sense?!! Can you not read. What ur saying makes no sense, Defoe would score more in a poor team but wouldn't in a team who creates chances for fun
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Because that logic makes no sense otherwise top clubs would sign strikers who score a barrel load in league two. Can you explain why Defoe has scored more in his past two seasons here at the age of 34 than he did for Tottenham in his career bar one season in his prime? Can you explain why Darren Bent has scored over 100 goals but the only time he got a move to a team battling for honours he failed? Why Demba Ba failed at Chelsea? Why Remy scored more for Newcastle than he did at Chelsea? Why Roque Santa Cruz scored 1 in 2 at Blackburn but failed at Man City?

Maybe you should give all the blokes were in charge of them players a call to to tell them they're clueless as well.
 
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