England squad suprises

[The Rat]

Christ almighty, I've asked it TWICE now and you've still missed it. You spend a lot of time on here, like me, so 6 pages is hardly difficult is it? 60 pages, fair enough

Just ask the f***ing question man

jesus wept

It really isn't a no brainer and you are the naive one for suggesting that.

Every player is different, but if a player values playing for England in Test cricket then all things (wages) being equal - its more important to play County Championship cricket in April and May than IPL isn't it? That's just one reason why it isn't a no brainer, but there are many others.

Not really

Why if there are six better batsman - just go with me - and he is the most counterattacking option. Why can we have Bairstow at seven, who is much better as a batsman, but not Stokes? Why are we so inflexible on this?

Because Bairstow has the gloves, he has only moved up as people wanted him too.

 

[Voice of fair play]

It really isn't a no brainer and you are the naive one for suggesting that.

Every player is different, but if a player values playing for England in Test cricket then all things (wages) being equal - its more important to play County Championship cricket in April and May than IPL isn't it? That's just one reason why it isn't a no brainer, but there are many others.

Nobody and I mean nobody is going to turn down a IPL contract to play county championship it’s naive to think anything else.

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

Just ask the f***ing question man

jesus wept



Not really



Because Bairstow has the gloves, he has only moved up as people wanted him too.

The gloves aren't tied to seven. You could easily have him batting at six ahead of Stokes and keeping the gloves. In fact, the press seemed to be suggesting yesterday that he would keep the gloves even with Buttler in the squad. Agnew said he'd bat five and keep - and he just repeats whatever he's told by the ECB.

It really isn't a no brainer and you are the naive one for suggesting that.

Every player is different, but if a player values playing for England in Test cricket then all things (wages) being equal - its more important to play County Championship cricket in April and May than IPL isn't it? That's just one reason why it isn't a no brainer, but there are many others.

Is it? I would have thought so personally, but Ed Smith seems to think otherwise.

 

[The Rat]

The gloves aren't tied to seven. You could easily have him batting at six ahead of Stokes and keeping the gloves. In fact, the press seemed to be suggesting yesterday that he would keep the gloves even with Buttler in the squad. Agnew said he'd bat five and keep - and he just repeats whatever he's told by the ECB.



Is it? I would have thought so personally, but Ed Smith seems to think otherwise.

Yeah he is keeping mate, everybody knows that at already.

N0t sure what your point is

 

[Steak Pie]

Nobody and I mean nobody is going to turn down a IPL contract to play county championship it’s naive to think anything else.

Apart from Mark Wood you mean?

 

[Voice of fair play]

Apart from Mark Wood you mean?

Could have sworn he played in the IPL this season and only came back because not getting his place.

That’s totally different from turning it down in the first place which of course you know!

 

[Steak Pie]

Could have sworn he played in the IPL this season and only came back because not getting his place.

That’s totally different from turning it down in the first place which of course you know!

So he walked away from his IPL contract to play in the CC? That's right isn't it?

We're not talking about somebody putting themselves up for auction here, someone who actually had a contract and guaranteed money but ripped it up to play in the County Championship. It's not the same, it's much bigger!

 

[rentaghost]

It’s a ridiculous selection. End of debate

Jonathan Agnew thinks its a great selection. Debate ongoing

 

[mikemanc]

So he walked away from his IPL contract to play in the CC? That's right isn't it?

We're not talking about somebody putting themselves up for auction here, someone who actually had a contract and guaranteed money but ripped it up to play in the County Championship. It's not the same, it's much bigger!

I'm not sure I really want to wade into this argument but weren't you arguing that players went to the IPL for the money? Wood is proving that he went for the cricket as he has turned down the chance to pick up money for nothing by returning to play in the Championship. If he was playing in the IPL he'd have stayed there. Until this week and his call up.

 

[chopsfc007]

I'm not sure I really want to wade into this argument but weren't you arguing that players went to the IPL for the money? Wood is proving that he went for the cricket as he has turned down the chance to pick up money for nothing by returning to play in the Championship. If he was playing in the IPL he'd have stayed there. Until this week and his call up.

Wood stayed for ages without playing mind

 

[Steak Pie]

I'm not sure I really want to wade into this argument but weren't you arguing that players went to the IPL for the money? Wood is proving that he went for the cricket as he has turned down the chance to pick up money for nothing by returning to play in the Championship. If he was playing in the IPL he'd have stayed there. Until this week and his call up.

They do, but there are plenty of instances of people putting their career before the money. Mark Wood and Perera from this season, once upon a time it was Broad and Jimmy. It happens.

 

[mikemanc]

Wood stayed for ages without playing mind

Yup, maybe he thought he'd pick up as much as he could then play the one championship game before the squad announcement. Maybe he was going to hang around until CSK were out but he was told to get some match practise as he'd be in the squad. I don't know.

 

[brandon]

Nobody and I mean nobody is going to turn down a IPL contract to play county championship it’s naive to think anything else.

That isn't what was put forward though.

Just ask the f***ing question man

jesus wept



Not really



Because Bairstow has the gloves, he has only moved up as people wanted him too.

You're taking the piss. It's been posted THREE times now.

FAO: @The Rat

A stupid thing to say? Really? So you think Jos Buttler would play in the IPL for his air fare alone if they asked him to? Now that is stupid.

Think that's the fourth time it's been posted. Still won't answer it.

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

Yeah he is keeping mate, everybody knows that at already.

N0t sure what your point is

A summary.

ME: Why can't we move Stokes to seven?
YOU: It's not right.

ME: Why not - we can put Bairstow there and he's a better batsman?
YOU: That's different, he's got the gloves.

ME: Ok, but keepers don't have to bat at seven. In fact, Bairstow is keeping gloves at now he's up to five.
YOU: What's your point?

My point is: we can move Stokes to seven - and, moreover, that this might increase our batting potential. In fact, I think this would make the best batting line up at the moment: Cook, Gubbins, Root, Malan, Clarke, Bairstow (keeper), Stokes.

I'm willing to give Buttler a crack - seems a fair gamble. But if it doesn't work out - then the above is the right structure for the team. You don't have to agree - but I don't know why you can't understand what I'm saying.

 

[The Rat]

That isn't what was put forward though.



You're taking the piss. It's been posted THREE times now.

FAO: @The Rat



Think that's the fourth time it's been posted. Still won't answer it.

I've answered that about 5 times, absolutely, its the best tournament in the world. Can't believe you think people just want to play in it for the money

You think if Chris Rushworth got the chance to play in it he would turn it down. No chance man

A summary.

ME: Why can't we move Stokes to seven?
YOU: It's not right.

ME: Why not - we can put Bairstow there and he's a better batsman?
YOU: That's different, he's got the gloves.

ME: Ok, but keepers don't have to bat at seven. In fact, Bairstow is keeping gloves at now he's up to five.
YOU: What's your point?

My point is: we can move Stokes to seven - and, moreover, that this might increase our batting potential. In fact, I think this would make the best batting line up at the moment: Cook, Gubbins, Root, Malan, Clarke, Bairstow (keeper), Stokes.

I'm willing to give Buttler a crack - seems a fair gamble. But if it doesn't work out - then the above is the right structure for the team. You don't have to agree - but I don't know why you can't understand what I'm saying.

Fair enough, not for me, I want him in the the top 6, there aren't 5 better batsman in Englan than Ben Stokes.

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

I've answered that about 5 times, absolutely, its the best tournament in the world. Can't believe you think people just want to play in it for the money

You think if Chris Rushworth got the chance to play in it he would turn it down. No chance man



Fair enough, not for me, I want him in the the top 6, there aren't 5 better batsman in Englan than Ben Stokes.

I agree. But there may be three or four better middle order players. And this is the problem: we have a tonne of options in middle order, but the cupboard is very, very, very bare in the top three. So we have to stack the middle order to add protection - and he's the best at being an attacking batsman at number seven.

If we had a top order worthy of the name he could bat six - but we don't. That's my thoughts.

 

[The Rat]

all about opinions though

I jusy think Buttler is worth ago like, sometimes you take a risk, if it doesn't work out, no big deal, we try someone else.


Hasn't been anyone in the CC averaging 100 or so like Ballance and Bairstow did to get called up.

I agree. But there may be three or four better middle order players. And this is the problem: we have a tonne of options in middle order, but the cupboard is very, very, very bare in the top three. So we have to stack the middle order to add protection - and he's the best at being an attacking batsman at number seven.

If we had a top order worthy of the name he could bat six - but we don't. That's my thoughts.

I get that, but I just think don't diminish your strengths to make up for weaknesses

As I said in other posts, if there was an absolute outstanding candidate averaging 100 then fair enough, but for me I think that top 6 is just about right, and if you are looking for a number 7, why not Buttler, IMO anyway

Also on a different point, its interesting how perceptions of players make such a big difference. Malan and Stoneman averaging almost identically the same, yet Malan is seen as a success and Stoneman "needs runs"

 

[ChicagoCat]

He does at Lancs (apart from the B+B bit, I threw that in as a sweetener to get him over). That's his Lancs contract, so that's all they need to pay him to get him over to India, in your world.

You have a weird concept of how international sportsman work chief. Really weird.

Not sure if there was a quoting issue or someone stole my login - but this was not my post!

 

[Voice of fair play]

So he walked away from his IPL contract to play in the CC? That's right isn't it?

We're not talking about somebody putting themselves up for auction here, someone who actually had a contract and guaranteed money but ripped it up to play in the County Championship. It's not the same, it's much bigger!

It's a tremendous competition and the bottom line is he only came back because he was not getting selected, he even said soo himself!!

If he was getting picked he would still be there until selected for test side

 

[Steak Pie]

Not sure if there was a quoting issue or someone stole my login - but this was not my post!

It was Johnson's, not sure what happened to the technology there!

It's a tremendous competition and the bottom line is he only came back because he was not getting selected, he even said soo himself!!

If he was getting picked he would still be there until selected for test side

And he wanted to play so he handed back the money and came home. He could have stayed out there and picked up the cheques but he wanted to put himself in the shop window for the Test team. I'm not sure what else you want. And in the past we've had Anderson and Broad (and loads of others) who've turned down the IPL. This year Danesh Perera turned down the IPL to play domestically in Sri Lanka and fight for his Test place.

So when you said "Nobody and I mean nobody is going to turn down a IPL contract to play county championship" you meant apart from the ones who have.