The Super spoilery Star Wars : The Last Jedi spoilers thread *don't even put your mouse over it*

[StiflerPG]

Sums it up perfectly....

Jesus, imagine being this dull in real life.

I f***ing enjoyed it, my kids enjoyed it, it had stupid parts granted but its a f***ing film, not a documentary who honestly give a flying fuck.

I think I'll make a blog and a 35 minute video on how I enjoyed it....oh no wait, I've got better things to do with my life.

 

[The Exile]

there was a guardian article linking the trashing of the last jedi, back to gamer gate & the ghostbusters reboot arguments through the the various happenings of the last 18 months, which i thought was a long jump. however, @Deano is proving that the link to gamer gate has some legs - should rose have been a white anglo-saxon male?

The problem there being that people's legitimate fears were all proved absolutely correct tbh. Now that really was an awful film with little to redeem it.

 

[Cockney Mackem]

The problem there being that people's legitimate fears were all proved absolutely correct tbh. Now that really was an awful film with little to redeem it.

That was a whole different kettle of fish. It was shite but the switch from men to women wasn’t what made it shit, it was the usual lazy remake shit and the mismatch of the loose improv style comedy they were doing with the need for all the blockbuster boxes to be ticked. But the reaction to it was so over the top and hijacked by little fascist trolls who funnily enough had nothing to say about Point Break or Robocop, or Total Recall, or Halloween, or Nightmare on Elm Street, or Clash of the Titans, or Rollerball, or Death Race, or The Omen, or The Pink Panther, or Conan the Barbarian, or The Hitcher, or Get Carter, or Arthur, or Carrie, or The Karate Kid...

 

[errant]

The problem there being that people's legitimate fears were all proved absolutely correct tbh. Now that really was an awful film with little to redeem it.

ghostbusters passed me by, as did gamer gate... retrospectively it all seems a fuss over nothing. one assumes the ghostbusters script and narrative is dog shit, the lasting memory being an all female cast hoisting a lightening rod for the misogynistic keyboard warriors to claim the world was ending. the star wars reaction and petulant response to fans throwing their toys out their prams (the change.org thing being prime example) seems to be a lack of self awareness about what taste is, and how some people like somethings, and some people like other things... see mrs browns boys for example.

why do people claim their own personal ownership over star wars?

Point Break or Robocop, or Total Recall, or Halloween, or Nightmare on Elm Street, or Clash of the Titans, or Rollerball, or Death Race, or The Omen, or The Pink Panther, or Conan the Barbarian, or The Hitcher, or Get Carter, or Arthur, or Carrie, or The Karate Kid...

i didnt even know half of those had been remade!? who remade conan? and was he knocking off the maid at the same time?

 

[The Exile]

ghostbusters passed me by, as did gamer gate... retrospectively it all seems a fuss over nothing. one assumes the ghostbusters script and narrative is dog shit, the lasting memory being an all female cast hoisting a lightening rod for the misogynistic keyboard warriors to claim the world was ending. the star wars reaction and petulant response to fans throwing their toys out their prams (the change.org thing being prime example) seems to be a lack of self awareness about what taste is, and how some people like somethings, and some people like other things... see mrs browns boys for example.

why do people claim their own personal ownership over star wars?


i didnt even know half of those had been remade!? who remade conan? and was he knocking off the maid at the same time?

You assume correctly. Plus there was the problem of all four main cast members trying to be the comic relief all at the same time. A fundamental misunderstanding of how the first two films worked with three of them playing the straight man to Murray's Venkman. Bringing the original cast back in cameos, but not as the original team. Barmy. Then lazily palming any mention of these concerns off with 'well you just hate women'.

I think people get so obsessed with stuff, so wrapped up in it, that they begin to feel they're the sole 'guardians' of it because nobody can care as much as they do about it, and anything that doesn't match exactly with their predictions simply can't be correct. They want new stories, but nothing that's different from the old stories or anything that contradicts where they want it to go. Surprises, but nothing they don't know is coming.

There's no excuse for Mrs Brown's Boys like.

 

[Cockney Mackem]

ghostbusters passed me by, as did gamer gate... retrospectively it all seems a fuss over nothing. one assumes the ghostbusters script and narrative is dog shit, the lasting memory being an all female cast hoisting a lightening rod for the misogynistic keyboard warriors to claim the world was ending. the star wars reaction and petulant response to fans throwing their toys out their prams (the change.org thing being prime example) seems to be a lack of self awareness about what taste is, and how some people like somethings, and some people like other things... see mrs browns boys for example.

why do people claim their own personal ownership over star wars?


i didnt even know half of those had been remade!? who remade conan? and was he knocking off the maid at the same time?

Conan was remade by some German hack whose directorial credits are mostly music videos and straight to on-demand shite, including not just the Friday 13th remake of my list of shame but a Texas Chainsaw Massacre remake as well. Jason Momoa filled in for Arnie showing why everything he’s ever done apart from GoT has been shit, and Colonel Bangfuckingaverage from Avatar tried and failed to fill James Earl Jones’s shoes.

 

[Fetch Fletch]

Thanks to this and the other thread, my expectations were so low I enjoyed it not a classic but some really fun stuff amongst some dog awful shite.

 

[DaveH]

You assume correctly. Plus there was the problem of all four main cast members trying to be the comic relief all at the same time. A fundamental misunderstanding of how the first two films worked with three of them playing the straight man to Murray's Venkman. Bringing the original cast back in cameos, but not as the original team. Barmy. Then lazily palming any mention of these concerns off with 'well you just hate women'.

There is a style of comedy in American films which is pretty much just shout drivel then give a stern/defiant look at the end of it. I don't find it funny or entertaining. From the adverts I saw it looked 4 women doing that, so I had no particular desire to watch it. If it comes on Netflix then I might take a look, but nothing inspired me to pay or make effort to see it. If it was 4 blokes doing the same style 'in your face' American humour then I'd probably feel the same.

 

[The Cabbage]

You assume correctly. Plus there was the problem of all four main cast members trying to be the comic relief all at the same time. A fundamental misunderstanding of how the first two films worked with three of them playing the straight man to Murray's Venkman. Bringing the original cast back in cameos, but not as the original team. Barmy. Then lazily palming any mention of these concerns off with 'well you just hate women'.

I think people get so obsessed with stuff, so wrapped up in it, that they begin to feel they're the sole 'guardians' of it because nobody can care as much as they do about it, and anything that doesn't match exactly with their predictions simply can't be correct. They want new stories, but nothing that's different from the old stories or anything that contradicts where they want it to go. Surprises, but nothing they don't know is coming.

There's no excuse for Mrs Brown's Boys like.

Agree other than the voices merely criticising the film for being shite were largely drowned out by people calling one of the stars a gorilla. Also worth saying that most of it started at the point of casting. A very bad film though, granted.

 

[Cockney Mackem]

Agree other than the voices merely criticising the film for being shite were largely drowned out by people calling one of the stars a gorilla. Also worth saying that most of it started at the point of casting. A very bad film though, granted.

They could have gone a long way to fixing the problems if they'd made the backstory that the original 4 led by Bill Murray were the first Ghostbusters and this new crew were picking up where they left off. Some sort of motivation that one of them was the daughter of one of the original 4 and wanted to restore his reputation or just a devoted follower of the original team who wanted to emulate them. They also needed to have characters who all have to have a funny routine in every scene so the film didn't have to stop for them every five minutes, like a band where every player has to have a solo in every song.

But they would still have had the problems that there was no need to remake Ghostbusters, and that the white supremacist fantwats weren't going to tolerate it under any circumstances

They also needed to have characters who all have to have a funny routine in every scene so the film didn't have to stop for them every five minutes, like a band where every player has to have a solo in every song.

Sorry that should read they needed to have characters who DON'T all have to have a funny routine in every scene etc

 

[The Exile]

Agree other than the voices merely criticising the film for being shite were largely drowned out by people calling one of the stars a gorilla. Also worth saying that most of it started at the point of casting. A very bad film though, granted.

I'm sure I said at the time that I felt it was 'stunt casting' of four not very funny people who happened to be women and that if that was their only original idea we'd be in bother.

The simple solution was always - make a good film.

As it is for the next Star Wars film (bringing us neatly back on the track I steered us from )

They could have gone a long way to fixing the problems if they'd made the backstory that the original 4 led by Bill Murray were the first Ghostbusters and this new crew were picking up where they left off. Some sort of motivation that one of them was the daughter of one of the original 4 and wanted to restore his reputation or just a devoted follower of the original team who wanted to emulate them. They also needed to have characters who all have to have a funny routine in every scene so the film didn't have to stop for them every five minutes, like a band where every player has to have a solo in every song.

But they would still have had the problems that there was no need to remake Ghostbusters, and that the white supremacist fantwats weren't going to tolerate it under any circumstances

Pretty much what The Force Awakens did, when you think about it.

 

[PTR]

By the way, just came across this. Lucas' plan for luke

"He ended up secluding himself in this Jedi temple on a new planet, and he's just there meditating, reassessing his whole life. Gradually, over the arc of the movie, he rediscovers his vitality and comes back to himself.""

Exactly what everyone seems to have wanted, but instead he basically committed suicide, robbing the good guys of much needed assistance

 

[The Cabbage]

By the way, just came across this. Lucas' plan for luke

"He ended up secluding himself in this Jedi temple on a new planet, and he's just there meditating, reassessing his whole life. Gradually, over the arc of the movie, he rediscovers his vitality and comes back to himself.""

Exactly what everyone seems to have wanted, but instead he basically committed suicide, robbing the good guys of much needed assistance

Not too far from what happened from a certain point of view (!). But again, where does that lead? A retread of the themes of the original trilogy whilst facing off against a lesser baddie. Nothing new, nothing to make you think. Just another white hat vs black hat battle in space with no new motivation for characters other than Sith Lord whack-a-mole.

 

[PTR]

Not too far from what happened from a certain point of view (!). But again, where does that lead? A retread of the themes of the original trilogy whilst facing off against a lesser baddie. Nothing new, nothing to make you think. Just another white hat vs black hat battle in space with no new motivation for characters other than Sith Lord whack-a-mole.

Obvious answer would be that he properly redeems himself in some kind of real sacrifice, rather than, frankly, shacking out.

 

[The Exile]

Obvious answer would be that he properly redeems himself in some kind of real sacrifice, rather than, frankly, shacking out.

He allowed the Rebellion to escape and created another legend.

No doubt he'll return in the next film as a Force Ghost anyway, that's almost guaranteed with Fisher now dead.

Maybe he'll haunt Kylo Ren, that would be a nice twist.

 

[The Cabbage]

Obvious answer would be that he properly redeems himself in some kind of real sacrifice, rather than, frankly, shacking out.

He was the spark that lit the fire etc etc. His action has rekindled the resistance at its darkest hour. He’s provided a legend that will be told across the galaxy - as evidenced by the kids in casinoworld playing it out with toys.

 

[PTR]

He was the spark that lit the fire etc etc. His action has rekindled the resistance at its darkest hour. He’s provided a legend that will be told across the galaxy - as evidenced by the kids in casinoworld playing it out with toys.

If only people actually knew he was real in his own lifetime after almost single handedly ACTUALLY defeating the REAL empire and then still being alive afterwards........

Another terrible piece of the "plot" in the 2 new films.

 

[The Cabbage]

If only people actually knew he was real in his own lifetime after almost single handedly ACTUALLY defeating the REAL empire and then still being alive afterwards........

Another terrible piece of the "plot" in the 2 new films.

He didn’t defeat them. He set them back and they grew up bigger and worse than before - driving the resistance to the point of extinction. No wonder the small folk needed more evidence of his good deeds. As I said earlier, as soon as they decided to make new films, Skywalker’s legacy was diminished. Indeed it was a necessity to do so in order to create a new drama. That doesn’t make it a terrible piece of plot. It is however a point where people are likely to nope out on a story, which is fair enough.

 

[PTR]

He didn’t defeat them. He set them back and they grew up bigger and worse than before - driving the resistance to the point of extinction. No wonder the small folk needed more evidence of his good deeds. As I said earlier, as soon as they decided to make new films, Skywalker’s legacy was diminished. Indeed it was a necessity to do so in order to create a new drama. That doesn’t make it a terrible piece of plot. It is however a point where people are likely to nope out on a story, which is fair enough.

He was responsible the elimination of
The emporer
Darth Vader
2 x Death Stars

They gave him a medal.

30 years later, people don't think he was even real.
That's like people in America not knowing who Churchill was. Its ludicrous.

 

[Steak Pie]

Must admit this was the vibe I got on second watch. That being said, it probably magnifies @Steak Pie ’s gripe. Mind that doesnt preclude the notion that if they were in any position of strength, Poe would be swinging from a crane rn.

Maybe it's the start for the next one, Poe is kicked out of the Alliance and goes proper rogue. Who knows.

I should add that I'm not particularly rabid in my hatred for the rest of the film. The first was clunky (to the point where I was expect Lord Helmet to appear) but I enjoyed the 2nd act, and I don't mind the story arc of cleaning out the Skywalkers. I didn't like the comedic glances (which wouldn't have been out of place in a Jim Carrey movie), I didn't like the Porgs, and I thought the slow motion space chase was contrived and a bit stupid, but I can see past all of those things as - as you have said - it's a kids film set in a made up universe and it isn't supposed to be high art.

But they should stick the the rules of the universe else we're going to end up something like the various Star Trek series, where a character makes up a random new problem and a new enemy each episode, and then they defeat it.