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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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Suomifinland said:
If Baltics were threatened then Nato would act.
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Over a piece of paper?

So we would “risk WW3”, “risk nuclear Armageddon” and all the other hysterical soaking wet bullshit over a piece of paper; but we wouldn’t to save the lives of Ukrainian children?

That’s some moral compass we’ve got there.
 

Suomifinland said:
Agree completely.

Anyone saying no fly zone is the right thing to do, needs to accept that it would certainly escalate things & probably bring the war to the rest or Europe.

Russian ground forces might be poor & they're certainly there to be got. And certainly a group of NATO planes could do em in. But remember behind them lies about 600 ready to go nuclear missiles. And a nutter surrounded by nutters or yes men, or people scared to say no. Each of those missiles carries at least one warhead that has on average 10-20x Hiroshimas.
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Same question I’ve asked all day. What if he goes into a NATO country?

All of those reasons not to confront him remain the same. The message we are sending here is - We are terrified of direct conflict (Our political leaders have said it in not so different terms) and don’t want to challenge in case of escalation.

The West is playing into his hands because the same risks are there wherever he goes next - Fuck it if I was in his position I would keep pushing because if your enemy effectively tells you their red line (In this case NATO will not risk a military confrontation in Europe) then that stands be it in Ukraine or Latvia, Estonia or similar.

This gives a reprieve but just kicks the can down the road if he decides he wants to keep going
 
ontap said:
Thats just wonderful.
Putin to me is the new Hitler , saw a video today of ordinary russian people denying that Russia would ever invade Ukraine , they think it's all western propaganda FFS.
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How f***ing dumb would you have to be to see your government shut down all international media, see the whole world being outraged by your governments actions and not realise that maybe its your government that is lying to you. Surely the average Russian can't be that dense.
 
chunkylover53 said:
Can someone point me to what Coke have actually said? Ta
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This is a very fair question and as I first posted about it, I felt it incumbent to have a look beyond the tweets of Nick Tolhurst, who is someone I generally regard as trustworthy (perhaps mistakenly).

I found this from yesterday's FT:

" Russians are now asking which western companies will be next to leave, with several naming Coca-Cola, PepsiCo and McDonald’s among those they would miss most. The three companies did not comment when asked what their plans were for the Russian market, however."

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This is a long way from the positive assertion that Tolhust tweeted, and I copied on here, that Coca-Cola "have confirmed they will continue to support Putin and do "business as usual" in Russia despite the Ukraine invasion". We can take it that if they'd pulled out, they'd tell us clearly. I also think, on reflection, that no company is going to make a positive assertion of business as usual with Russia, they'll just say nothing. So my personal feelings about them still stand and Costa Coffee (owned by Coke) which I used to go to can shove their new partnership with M&S up their arse (yes I know, that'll teach 'em).

However, on reflection I should have double checked Tolhurst's tweet before posting it on here. I do work hard only to post from reputable sources, and to get second source verification where possible. I may have been caught out this time.

Coca Cola should still get out of Russia though
 
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MonkeyLove said:
Same question I’ve asked all day. What if he goes into a NATO country?

All of those reasons not to confront him remain the same. The message we are sending here is - We are terrified of direct conflict (Our political leaders have said it in not so different terms) and don’t want to challenge in case of escalation.

The West is playing into his hands because the same risks are there wherever he goes next - Fuck it if I was in his position I would keep pushing because if your enemy effectively tells you their red line (In this case NATO will not risk a military confrontation in Europe) then that stands be it in Ukraine or Latvia, Estonia or similar.

This gives a reprieve but just kicks the can down the road if he decides he wants to keep going
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Exactly. The message is clear - we are shit scared of you and when it comes down to it, we will do a lot of talking but ultimately stand aside for you.

Great message to be sending to someone like him.
 
Sweeper said:
He’s made a start. And we’ve cowered in the corner pissing our pants whilst he has.

The message is clear - help yourself Vlad.
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You really think if king coward Putin attacks a NATO country they wouldn't be united in fronting him up ? Give owa man.

IF, and it's a big IF, Russia takes Ukraine, the most they will do is make a move on Moldova. No way will he risk a move on the Baltics, Rumania, Poland, Slovakia etc.
 
Sweeper said:
What about the Labour shadow minister who took hundreds of thousands of pounds from a Chinese govt agent?

The reality is that all politicians move in circles of connected and - yes - rich people. It’s part of their job.

What is definitely growing tiresome is the idea that our politics or govt is in any meaningful way “corrupt”. It’s an insult to the billions of people who live under actual corrupt governments.
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Whataboutery again.

UK govt isn't as corrupt as massively corrupt govts doesn't make them "not corrupt".

The list of Tory MPs who took Russian money is a very long one. Even the Berwick MP (who are technically at war with Russia I think 😉) took money.

Boris is delaying sanctions against Russian banks by long enough for money to get out of London.

The house of Lords has the son of a KGB agent sitting in it.

Bent. As. Fuck.
 
HerdnMulhall said:
Cos on a board where there has been incipient homophobia on and off for years and at time when we are all facing the most challenging times since the 2nd world war and the LGBT community in Russia is under greater threat than it was here in the 80s to come up with the slime ball nickname ' Puffkin' is a step back perhaps?
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Ok dear!
 
Sweeper said:
Over a piece of paper?

So we would “risk WW3”, “risk nuclear Armageddon” and all the other hysterical soaking wet bullshit over a piece of paper; but we wouldn’t to save the lives of Ukrainian children?

That’s some moral compass we’ve got there.
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Serious question. Would you take a nuke for Ukraine?
 
sonson said:
There's innocent people of all stripes died to tyrants so far this century all over the world. None of them deserved to die.

But the inaction over them would suggest that the Ukrainians are unlikely to be an exception to the rule.

The fundamental reason so much has heen done in respect to opposing Putin is because the West has been so invested with his fortunes and so passive in response to his agression over the past decade that a lot of work is required to decouple itself from his now naked tyranny and to try and make up for that enabling

But he hasn't become a tyrant overnight, which Is why its facile to equate this as a matter of good and evil. Or rather, Putin is evil in my mind but thats not the reason for the West's response and its consequent actions won't be based upon a moral compass that mone of them agree upon anyway.

It's about the strategic and political interest of Western paeties. And those factors will decide the fate of innocent Ukrainians in the same way it has decided the fare of Afghans and Yazidi and Yemeni and Palestinian and Congoloese and so on.
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The west is bad m'kay.
 
Sweeper said:
What about the Labour shadow minister who took hundreds of thousands of pounds from a Chinese govt agent?

The reality is that all politicians move in circles of connected and - yes - rich people. It’s part of their job.

What is definitely growing tiresome is the idea that our politics or govt is in any meaningful way “corrupt”. It’s an insult to the billions of people who live under actual corrupt governments.
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It’s really not tiresome.

1) PPE contracts to bloke who runs the pub
2) Dido Harding gets another job, and fucks it up. Now remind me, who does she know?
3) The Lord of Hampton and Siberia because he takes you on the piss
4) Sir Gavin Williamson. He knows where the bodies are buried
5) Mogg mysteriously selling his shares in Sberbank
6) Jennifer Accuri
7) donations from less than reputable sources for many
8) expenses, expenses, expenses
9) trying to change the rules to protect Patterson

I mean I could go on for hours

It’s an insult to say this is corrupt? I’d say it’s a f***ing insult to ignore this, an insult to the people they are meant to serve

Note: they serve us, we don’t serve them
 
Boots said:
History mate. Russia is.one of very few that stood with India over Bangladesh/East Pakistan. Britian/USA etc sided with Pakistan and they havnt forgotten. Plus the Indian armed forces are pretty much equipped with Russian gear.
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And Modi is a nationalist who has fermented nationalism in the country - including incorporating a part of Kashmir under Indian rule when it is meant to be semi-independent. So the government line there will be in support of similar leaders.
 
Pantomime Mackem said:
This is a very fair question and as I first posted about it, I felt it incumbent to have a look beyond the tweets of Nick Tolhurst, who is someone I generally regard as trustworthy (perhaps mistakenly).

I found this from yesterday's FT:

" Russians are now asking which western companies will be next to leave, with several naming Coca-Cola, PepsiCo and McDonald’s among those they would miss most. The three companies did not comment when asked what their plans were for the Russian market, however."

You must be logged on to see external links


This is a long way from the positive assertion that Tolhust tweeted, and I copied on here, that Coca-Cola "have confirmed they will continue to support Putin and do "business as usual" in Russia despite the Ukraine invasion". We can take it that if they'd pulled out, they'd tell us clearly. I also think, on reflection, that no company is going to make a positive assertion of business as usual with Russia, they'll just say nothing. So my personal feelings about them still stand and Costa Coffee (owned by Coke) which I used to go to can shove their new partnership up their arse (yes I know, that'll teach 'em).

However, on reflection I should have double checked Tolhurst's tweet before posting it on here. I do work hard only to post from reputable sources, and to get second source verification where possible. I may have been caught out this time.

Coca Cola should still get out of Russia though
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It’s hardly just you to be fair, it’s trending on Twitter
 
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