Cynicism about Donald et al?

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hertsmackem said:
People here keep saying that they have come in and reduced the debt and made the whole thing more stable, it had to be done and any buyer would have had to have done it. I don't see why anyone should be so thankful for this.

What I don't get is that Ellis says he sold the club and into the best hands, but it appears the owners don't have the money, yet to be proven of course. Didn't Ellis also say that there were plenty of other potential buyers?

Anyway I hope the current owners can make a profit if and when they sell if that's what they want to do
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the other buyers all wanted to prot the debt-which would have fucked the club massively..SD was the only guy who wouldnt do that..and he hasnt...
porting the debt would have allowed new owners to take £70m out..
 


cmmackem said:
Donald is out of his depth. A club of Safc size deserves better/wealthier owners.
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better and wealthier are different things..
i think his record has shown he is willing to spend millions on a football club-and has the money-but isnt gooid at making football decisions..

he isnt out of his depth in terms of sizze of business..he has worked in a senior rule at a business sold for almost ten times safcs size..
 
Buzzers boot boy said:
There’s a lot of people who don’t listen to what they say. They just here and read stuff and repeat it.
The bloke has said repeatedly said he isn’t out to rip safc, yes they might make a profit if and when they sell but only by leaving us in a far better position than they found us, be it on or off the pitch. Hopefully both.
They seem on the face of things to have halted the financial disaster they inherited ( with shorts help by righting off an awful lot of money) but IMO they’re doing good things. Yes we could’ve went up and probably should have but we didn’t.
We need to move on and go again. Which is the message they put across after the play off loss.
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If you cannot buy the right players financial disaster will always be there. Suppose, as is likely at the moment, promotion is not achieved this season, how will that affect finances and season ticket sales? The club could disappear if it is stuck down here. Just too big to sustain life in the third division.
 
Bottom line-our financial position now (engineered by CM and SD) is a damn site better than it was 15 months ago.

The club is now in a better position to attract a better level of investment becaus eof this.

We still have the biggest budget in the division.

If someone comes in and they sell and make a few quid, then its they who took the gamble in the first place so fair play to them.

To be honest, without the changes they made we'd be ****ed.
 
hertsmackem said:
People here keep saying that they have come in and reduced the debt and made the whole thing more stable, it had to be done and any buyer would have had to have done it. I don't see why anyone should be so thankful for this.

What I don't get is that Ellis says he sold the club and into the best hands, but it appears the owners don't have the money, yet to be proven of course. Didn't Ellis also say that there were plenty of other potential buyers?

Anyway I hope the current owners can make a profit if and when they sell if that's what they want to do
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They were the only buyers who didn't want the internal debt. That actually matters a lot. Taking on that debt would have given any new owner the right to remove up to whatever that debt at the time of the sale (potentially up to £100m) from the club tax free and with nothing to stop them. Even to the point of a SISU style sale and leaseback of the ground, and paying the proceeds to themselves. Now, I'm not saying that any or all of the other interested parties would have done that, but that possibility was there. If a buyer didn't take on that debt, then the only way of getting value on the investment is by selling the shares at a profit at a later date; the club won't be in a position to pay dividends for many years because the losses sustained in earlier years have to be cleared first. If terms of risk to the club on an ongoing basis, that was the risk-free option available to Short. As much as his tenure ended badly, I believe he had, and still had, the club's best interest at heart. That's why he took on the Madrox offer in preference.
 
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Grumpy Old Man said:
They were the only buyers who didn't want the internal debt. That actually matters a lot. Taking on that debt would have given any new owner the right to remove up to whatever that debt at the time of the sale (potentially up to £100m) from the club tax free and with nothing to stop them. Even to the point of a SISU style sale and leaseback of the ground, and paying the proceeds to themselves. Now, I'm not saying that any or all of the other interested parties would have done that, but that possibility was there. If a buyer didn't take on that debt, then the only way of getting value on the investment is by selling the shares at a profit at a later date; the club won't be in a position to pay dividends for many years because the losses sustained in earlier years have to be cleared first. If terms of risk to the club on an ongoing basis, that was the risk-free option available to Short. As much as his tenure ended badly, I believe he had, and still had, the club's best interest at heart. That's why he took on the Madrox offer in preference.
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Thanks for your explanation, time will tell I guess, I’m not with this current owners have done a good job in reducing the debt and outgoings, anyone taking over would have had to do I’m not thankful about that. I do expect however that whoever took over was to take us forwards not standing still. I sincerely hope the current owners can do that or find someone that can.
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
They were the only buyers who didn't want the internal debt. That actually matters a lot. Taking on that debt would have given any new owner the right to remove up to whatever that debt at the time of the sale (potentially up to £100m) from the club tax free and with nothing to stop them. Even to the point of a SISU style sale and leaseback of the ground, and paying the proceeds to themselves. Now, I'm not saying that any or all of the other interested parties would have done that, but that possibility was there. If a buyer didn't take on that debt, then the only way of getting value on the investment is by selling the shares at a profit at a later date; the club won't be in a position to pay dividends for many years because the losses sustained in earlier years have to be cleared first. If terms of risk to the club on an ongoing basis, that was the risk-free option available to Short. As much as his tenure ended badly, I believe he had, and still had, the club's best interest at heart. That's why he took on the Madrox offer in preference.
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How do we know they were the only buyers who didn’t want the debt ?
 
Randy Savage said:
Anyone else as cynical about Donald et al as my old man?

Seen him yesterday and his opening gambit to me was “have you seen what those two spivs, Donald and slicked back, are up to now. Using the parachute money to buy the club and flipping it for a hefty profit within a year when they knew they never had the money to run it long term.”

Now, let it be said I like SD and I think there is a genuineness to him. I take what he says at face value. However, I’m a fairly trusting person for the most part.

Does anyone share my old man’s view, or is he just a cynical old Sunderland supporter worn down by six decades of largely shite?
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Your old man is right. In fact I hope he is. The best we can hope for with them is the club gets settled then sold on ASAP to somebody with the money to take us forward. All we have now is the championship/league 1 version of Ellis Short. Nothing has changed.
 
seanwharton said:
Short actually said that ?
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yes he did..and the fact they havent done the thing with he debt proves Sd didnt want o di it..
RedFlag1308 said:
Your old man is right. In fact I hope he is. The best we can hope for with them is the club gets settled then sold on ASAP to somebody with the money to take us forward. All we have now is the championship/league 1 version of Ellis Short. Nothing has changed.
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what has changed is the club is being better by owners who care..they could have taken a lot of cahs out now and have chosen not to..
 
kildaremackem said:
yes he did..and the fact they havent done the thing with he debt proves Sd didnt want o di it..

what has changed is the club is being better by owners who care..they could have taken a lot of cahs out now and have chosen not to..
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I’d argue being 5th in league 1 with the shortest squad in our history is not the club being better. But of course there are mitigating circumstances for that, the future matters more than the present. So I ask you, how far do you see the club getting under this ownership? What do you feel we can achieve ?
 
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