Aircraft fire Haneda (Tokyo)

0verlord44 said:
plenty of runway incursions aren't caused by ATC. Planes are not made of biscuits, its because they tend to be doing speed when they hit something. The A350 in this case, doing around 125-150 knots hit another plane and stayed almost completely structurally sound.

What's your source on the coastguard pilots health condition??
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How could it be anything other than an ATC error? bicuits everywhere!

5 have been confirmed dead from the CG plane, 6th in ICU
 


gards2 said:
How could it be anything other than an ATC error? bicuits everywhere!

5 have been confirmed dead from the CG plane, 6th in ICU
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Pilots make mistakes, misinterpret clearance, or even get lost.

Point is its way too early to start saying the Air Traffic Controller is in the wrong and will likely top him/herself, unless of course you work in Haneda tower? Then please tell them not to do it
 
0verlord44 said:
Pilots make mistakes, misinterpret clearance, or even get lost.

Point is its way too early to start saying the Air Traffic Controller is in the wrong and will likely top him/herself, unless of course you work in Haneda tower? Then please tell them not to do it
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That A350 was landing, it's been in the process of landing for 20+ minutes. It's an ATC fuck up and that's what will be revealed after the investigation.

I'm not a gambling man but I would put my house and dog and wife on it
 
gards2 said:
That A350 was landing, it's been in the process of landing for 20+ minutes. It's an ATC fuck up and that's what will be revealed after the investigation.

I'm not a gambling man but I would put my house and dog and wife on it
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you have no way of knowing that. So if it turns out not to be an ATC mistake, Ill have your house, and depending on breed, your Dog. You can keep your wife
 
Kevj said:
If that’s correct, then it appears ATC did what they should and the coast guard plane didn’t wait at the holding position?

Unless I’ve read that incorrectly.
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That’s the way I read it.

I’ll be honest and say I can’t be bothered to sit through it all and proof listen to what the poster has picked up on.
 
I had this down as an atc mistake but it appears not to be the case. Why any pilot would ignore instructions from the controller is something I can't fathom. So I'm still a bit dubious about the cause. We'll just have to wait for the investigation and reports to find out.
 
Monty Pigeon said:
Big Jet TV doing a live chat about the incident using aircraft models, for what it's worth.

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I watched that. The bit about tower comms for arrivals & departures being on different frequencies was an eye opener for me. No idea if its true or not mind as it was in the members chat.

On a lighter note, still no sign of GT showing herself though. Sounds like she's from N. Yorks/Teesside way though.
Edit - Forgot the bit about the lights not working on the runway entries.
 
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gards2 said:

Both pilots given clearance to use the runway
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Doesn't say that at all. The presenter says "what might have happened"

Government saying ATC gave permission for JAL land, coastguard to hold.

Coastguard captain saying he was given clearance.

Sounds like you need to get onto the CAA and let them know your detailed experience of investigating plane crashes and incidents so they can pass your essential info onto the Japanese authorities.
 
Point of impact very clear. Quite a long way down the runway. Likely that the A350 was solidly on the runway and in the process of rolling out. I wonder if the pilots went off the runway deliberately at the end or if the landing gear was so badly damaged they had no control.

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All that's left of the A350.

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Dash-8 wreckage. Cross-referenced with the top pic, it's clearly on the runway.

 
Impact on the runway and not just the skirting beside it where maybe the CG plane had crossed the line by mistake. Probably only a minute from taking of itself, the CG plane. Terrible really, an avoidable accident.
 
The Lambton Worm said:
Going off the runway entry/exit points, I wonder if the pilots of the coastguard plane couldn't see the the JAL A359 due to the angle.
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That's possible. It's a high-winged aircraft, and the engines would obscure the view looking back. That said, it's looking increasingly likely that the Dash-8 entered the runway without clearance.

As with most accidents, it'll probably turn out to be due to a combination of circumstances. Although Coast Guard plane shouldn't have been on the runway, in a different aircraft type they may have had more awareness of the imminent danger.

 
Monty Pigeon said:
That's possible. It's a high-winged aircraft, and the engines would obscure the view looking back. That said, it's looking increasingly likely that the Dash-8 entered the runway without clearance.

As with most accidents, it'll probably turn out to be due to a combination of circumstances. Although Coast Guard plane shouldn't have been on the runway, in a different aircraft type they may have had more awareness of the imminent danger.

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Looks like pilot error by the Coast Guard Captain according to the highlighted bit halfway down.

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