New football charter on club owners

Biffo The Bear said:
The Super League is coming. It has to come. It is the only way the other European clubs (barring PSG) will get to the point where they can compete with Premier League clubs again. How many teams, outside of England, could have challenged Chelsea to sign that Argentinian lad (yes I have forgotten his name). How many could have really challenged City for Haarland. I wonder how much of Cancelo's wages City are still paying etc
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All those teams will still be in the PL though. The Super League just replaces Champions League.
 


Biffo The Bear said:
I don't think the Mags ignoring it is an issue to be honest. I work with one. They are entitled to their opinions and entitled, as my colleague does, to not care about MBS and the Saudi states vile behaviour. Choosing to ignore it, or not care, in exchange for a winning team is their prerogative. Where I take issue / am amazed / lose the plot when discussing is those who simply refuse to accept that (i) MBS is our de facto owner (ii) what others do (City / PSG) doesn't dilute the issues around MBS owning an English club or, (iii) and the worst of all, realise all of the aforementioned and try to defend it.
Guardian podcast touch on it this week and, in my opinion, deal with it well. Barry Glendinning is, as always, a great listen.


Just for clarity, you do know I was being sarcastic, don't you?
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You work with one? I thought you are a mag?
 
wigwams said:
You work with one? I thought you are a mag?
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I am. What i meant was i work with one who chooses to ignore the issues. He doesn't deny, or defend, but is in the "i am only interested in a wining team" camp.
two left feet said:
All those teams will still be in the PL though. The Super League just replaces Champions League.
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That won't address the issues that i believe really drives the push from the non English clubs.
They can't compete financially.
 
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Inside Forward said:
Yeah was reading on BBC news this morning that other European leagues are becoming increasingly exasperated and annoyed at the amount of money being thrown around by English clubs. You could argue that the Premier League is the super league really.

UEFA will have to look at competitive balance soon, but what they can do about it I don’t know.
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The revamping of FFP is part of it. Rrestricting football expenditure (wages + fees paid) to a percentage of income (turnover + fee received). I really hope that means payable and receivable, so that full fees are taken into account in the season they arise irrespective of instalment plans. That would put an immediate kibosh on Chelsea's piss-taking this season.
 
Grumpy Old Man said:
The revamping of FFP is part of it. Rrestricting football expenditure (wages + fees paid) to a percentage of income (turnover + fee received). I really hope that means payable and receivable, so that full fees are taken into account in the season they arise irrespective of instalment plans. That would put an immediate kibosh on Chelsea's piss-taking this season.
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Perhaps they saw that coming. What seems obvious is they have taken a hefty punt on this getting them into Champions League. If they miss out, then did so again next year, they could be in serious difficulty.
 
Biffo The Bear said:
Perhaps they saw that coming. What seems obvious is they have taken a hefty punt on this getting them into Champions League. If they miss out, then did so again next year, they could be in serious difficulty.
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I'm struggling to see how, looking at their earlier losses, they aren't in FFP trouble despite manipulating the amortisation charge.
 
Biffo The Bear said:
I am. What i meant was i work with one who chooses to ignore the issues. He doesn't deny, or defend, but is in the "i am only interested in a wining team" camp.

That won't address the issues that i believe really drives the push from the non English clubs.
They can't compete financially.
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Ah. That makes sense
Grumpy Old Man said:
The revamping of FFP is part of it. Rrestricting football expenditure (wages + fees paid) to a percentage of income (turnover + fee received). I really hope that means payable and receivable, so that full fees are taken into account in the season they arise irrespective of instalment plans. That would put an immediate kibosh on Chelsea's piss-taking this season.
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I believe it already has but doesn’t kick in until July, hence forcing a couple more through this week. It’s an idiotic plan. One or two duds and they’ll be difficult to shift given their contact lengths
 
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MickeyV said:
D'ya know what? I'm starting to think the Superleague can't come soon enough. The big six and a load of top foreign teams will make a piss-pot full of money, and I and most real football supporters will have as much engagement with it as American Football- you watch it on the tele occasionally but it does not move your soul. No relegation jeopardy X 20 clubs = boredom.
Seeing two real honest clubs slugging it out like we did last weekend is real football. There might not be as much money for the clubs at our level (except when they want to buy our young talent) but TV will pay to screen good quality national footy. I don't understand the concern about the 'destroying the pyramid' because it will still be exactly the same except a few clubs will have gone. Frankly it is a fantasy that a club could come from the lower reaches to take on those mega-clubs anyway. That includes us BTW, realistically. So bye-bye and don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way out!
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Would there not be a new 'top6' in a few years time though?
 
wigwams said:
Ah. That makes sense

I believe it already has but doesn’t kick in until July, hence forcing a couple more through this week. It’s an idiotic plan. One or two duds and they’ll be difficult to shift given their contact lengths
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The lad they have just spent 105m on. I realise that was the buy-out clause so they had to pay the price on the tag.
If, for example, Argentina had lost to Mexico and went out of WC. Or, he didn't feature as strongly how much would they have been prepared to pay?
Seems like a huge risk based upon strong performances over a short tournament.
 
MickeyV said:
D'ya know what? I'm starting to think the Superleague can't come soon enough. The big six and a load of top foreign teams will make a piss-pot full of money, and I and most real football supporters will have as much engagement with it as American Football- you watch it on the tele occasionally but it does not move your soul. No relegation jeopardy X 20 clubs = boredom.
Seeing two real honest clubs slugging it out like we did last weekend is real football. There might not be as much money for the clubs at our level (except when they want to buy our young talent) but TV will pay to screen good quality national footy. I don't understand the concern about the 'destroying the pyramid' because it will still be exactly the same except a few clubs will have gone. Frankly it is a fantasy that a club could come from the lower reaches to take on those mega-clubs anyway. That includes us BTW, realistically. So bye-bye and don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way out!
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I agree. My fear is that they’ll get their cake and eat it, and continue to play in their domestic leagues. I still see far too much push back from supporters of the clubs involved. The owners were well up for it but the fans certainly weren’t
 
bobpc30 said:
No club in the EPL will get banned even if it blatantly obvious. Darlington, Harrogate and so on will be.
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This is 100% correct. If the owner has loads of cash and is powerful they will make a couple of calls and all will be ok. The ones that will be hit will be the small time business people trying to buy or owning smaller clubs. These will be placed into a fund until it is discovered that no one else wants to buy them and they will go under.

That’s always the problem with these well intended policies, big money always wins.
 
Does anyone have any confidence whatsoever the EFL could manage this without making a massive mess of it?
 
ir35 said:
Does anyone have any confidence whatsoever the EFL could manage this without making a massive mess of it?
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The EFL will say a lot then do as the PL want in fear of missing out on cash.

The PL will protect the 'elite' and their cash cow.

Small teams will suffer and anyone trying to break into the 'elite' will have more obstacles in their way than its a knockout
 
Qwerty said:
Would there not be a new 'top6' in a few years time though?
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Of course there would a new top 6 but they won’t have the financial muscle of the current top 6 as all the TV and sponsorship cash will leave the EPL and follow the Superleague clubs.
Personally I think those who think the EPL will bar the Superleague clubs are living in cloud cuckoo land. There are too many noses in the trough to risk losing the cash cow.
 
FC United of Manchester said:
Of course there would a new top 6 but they won’t have the financial muscle of the current top 6 as all the TV and sponsorship cash will leave the EPL and follow the Superleague clubs.
Personally I think those who think the EPL will bar the Superleague clubs are living in cloud cuckoo land. There are too many noses in the trough to risk losing the cash cow.
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Sadly I agree, if the super league does come off the PL will bend over and accept it. They will of course moan about it and pretend to do something but they won't want to risk losing the money
 
wigwams said:
I agree. My fear is that they’ll get their cake and eat it, and continue to play in their domestic leagues. I still see far too much push back from supporters of the clubs involved. The owners were well up for it but the fans certainly weren’t
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Surely they can't do both? If they want their Superleague it must be at the price of forfeiting their domestic competitions, including cups, and European competitions that involve non-SL teams. They have already bought their way onto a level that few other clubs can hope to reach, so if the want to out-cock-wave each other, then bugger off and have at it! SL will be a televisual event anyway, so they could actually play the matches anywhere in the world, so they'll be getting the bunting out in Qatar, Beijing, Atlanta and a dozen more cities with a rich footballing history. But think of the money! I'm sure many real footy fans all over the world will be thinking it's time for these mega-clubs to go.
Regarding fan pushback at the clubs themselves, you can see their point. The same old faces year in - year out, and awaydays to Munich and Madrid don't come cheap! Ultimately the decisions will be made by owners, not fans, and we know how much regard they have for each other.
 
chunksafc said:
Sadly I agree, if the super league does come off the PL will bend over and accept it. They will of course moan about it and pretend to do something but they won't want to risk losing the money
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I have mixed feelings on it. Sadly I still live in this misguided realm where clubs should be run for the supporters not the TV companies and sponsors.

On the one hand I think these clubs should still be able to compete in domestic competition, the supporters are not choosing this and those who like to support their club home and away should be able to do so.

On the other hand, the clubs in the Superleague will just widen the financial gap even further making it even more unlikely that supporters of other clubs will get to witness their clubs winning trophies.

I don’t really know what the answer is. I despise the fact that these owners can come in and effectively franchise these clubs, taking them away from supporters and effectively leaving 300,000 regular supporters without a club to follow because as sure as eggs is eggs it won’t stop there. Games will be played in Saudi, China or wherever the cash cow is. On the other hand I understand those who just want them to sod off. What I would say was if it was Sunderland amongst these clubs would you still want your club taken away from you in this manner?

The Superleague will come, hopefully it will just be an expansion of the Champions League ran as a midweek league but if it isn’t I’d like to see some kind of compromise made for supporters. Maybe they could retain their place in domestic competition but have to field an entirely different playing squad whereby those players registered for the Superleague couldn’t play in the domestic league.
 
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