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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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archfiend said:
Incredible this if true.

I’ve never been so conflicted. Soldiers obey but the Russian soldiers are being hung out to dry by their own superiors.

The only people facing war crime tribunals has to be putin and his generals surely
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I think the obvious thing to say is that there will be soldiers who have done monstrous things, more than likely committed atrocious war crimes.

AND

there will also be soldiers who were conscripted and forced into a war against their will that they absolutely do not believe in or want.

It’s possible for both statements to be true. The videos that we are seeing of Russian soldiers who have surrendered/deserted are good for us as people who want Russia to lose, but also incredibly sad on a human level that these (often) very young men are being put in the position they have been.
 
Kevj said:
Excellent point. Sanctions should stay in place long after the situation in Ukraine is over. It needs to be a financial throttling for long enough that they voluntarily hand over their nuclear arsenal. Never again should a situation such as this be allow to take hold of the world.
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The fear is that Russia pulverise Ukraine, install a puppet and then all the leaders sat "well that's over" and go back to engaging with (taking their money) Russia as before. This turning a blind eye has led to war in Europe and threats of nuclear oblivion.
 
Beery said:
I’m sorry, are you justifying the killing of civilians by an invading force against a non- aggressive sovereign state because “that’s just what happens”?
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Seems so. Haven’t been able to get a straight answer on that question all day though, despite numerous attempts.
 
genewolf said:
The fear is that Russia pulverise Ukraine, install a puppet and then all the leaders sat "well that's over" and go back to engaging with (taking their money) Russia as before. This turning a blind eye has led to war in Europe and threats of nuclear oblivion.
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I hope we’re past that point. None of the countries imposing sanctions will want to be the first to break ranks
 
Hugh Gains said:
NATO a defence alliance, that creeps east after saying it wouldn't, suffocating the Russia state along it's borders and bringing the weapons of a super power closer and closer to it's borders. You'd don't see how that's an issue to the Russians.




Once the Ukraine was brought into the fold through the IMF and given bilateral loan guarantees from the US, the strings were attached. At that point, whoever is elected is beholden to the West. Joe Biden explained how US money can be used to influence internal Ukrainian decision making "either fire him or you're not getting the billion dollars."

In the Washington Post in 2015 by Fiona Hill, a NSC member and European and Russian affairs expert, she said this.

In Putin’s view, the United States, the European Union and NATO have launched an economic and proxy war in Ukraine to weaken Russia and push it into a corner. As Valery Gerasimov, chief of staff of the Russian armed forces, has underscored, this is a hybrid, 21st-century conflict, in which financial sanctions, support for oppositional political movements and propaganda have all been transformed from diplomatic tools to instruments of war. Putin likely believes that any concession or compromise he makes will encourage the West to push further.

We've been playing a game with Ukraine, and Putin made his move, right or wrong. But, we knew the crash course this was on and did nothing to stop it, and only instigated it further.
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So what does Russia do, they invade a country which gets them closer to NATO countries. I think we have reds in the bed on this board.
 
brandon said:
How is that even relevant?

I haven’t seen a single poster suggesting those killings were justified. Plenty of people would like to see Blair and Bush infront of a jury at The Hague for example.

Stop deflecting and playing for time and tell us how what Russia is doing is NOT war crimes given that the International Criminal Court have are now investigating.

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