The vaccine thread

[SAFCOldie]

I'd agree, it's become very clear that you can still catch COVID after 1,2,3 vaccines and it seems the risks have been almost universally underrepoted..

We Don't Know Enough About Risks to the Vaccinated

Americans have too little information on infections and hospitalizations among those who have gotten the shots, and the numbers can be spun in different ways.

www.bloomberg.com

Whats become totally clear is this Omicron business has changed the game

 

[Frijj]

I'd agree, it's become very clear that you can still catch COVID after 1,2,3 vaccines and it seems the risks have been almost universally underrepoted..

We Don't Know Enough About Risks to the Vaccinated

Americans have too little information on infections and hospitalizations among those who have gotten the shots, and the numbers can be spun in different ways.

www.bloomberg.com

That’s a frankly terrible article. It bases its assertions at least party on the statement

“In the UK, the majority of deaths have been in the vaccinated”

This is a sentence easily misunderstood by people who either

a) do not know enough about the subject matter to comment

or

b) are trying to skew the data to support their views

The vast majority of adults, at the time of writing of that article, were vaccinated.

This includes those most at risk of dying, who even after vaccination, still had higher risk than most, just lower risk than they had without a vaccine.

So it’s not unusual for most people who died to be vaccinated, because almost everyone was vaccinated, especially the elderly.

This doesn’t mean the vaccine doesn’t work. It just means there’s numerically far more people!

-

And another thing, why give a fuck about a Bloomberg article lamenting poor data quality in the US when we have exceptional data quality in our hospitals and have tracked data on vaccinations and hospital outcomes?

Most people with a low post count or who have a new account are current or former posters using a new account. They often post covid or vaccine sceptical content. I hope you are not one such person

 

[Pants]

That’s a frankly terrible article. It bases its assertions at least party on the statement

“In the UK, the majority of deaths have been in the vaccinated”

This is a sentence easily misunderstood by people who either

a) do not know enough about the subject matter to comment

or

b) are trying to skew the data to support their views

The vast majority of adults, at the time of writing of that article, were vaccinated.

This includes those most at risk of dying, who even after vaccination, still had higher risk than most, just lower risk than they had without a vaccine.

So it’s not unusual for most people who died to be vaccinated, because almost everyone was vaccinated, especially the elderly.

This doesn’t mean the vaccine doesn’t work. It just means there’s numerically far more people!

-

And another thing, why give a fuck about a Bloomberg article lamenting poor data quality in the US when we have exceptional data quality in our hospitals and have tracked data on vaccinations and hospital outcomes?

Most people with a low post count or who have a new account are current or former posters using a new account. They often post covid or vaccine sceptical content. I hope you are not one such person

The article is also 6 months old. Very poor attempt.

 

[Hyltonian]

Over 75s and the most vulnerable offered boosters from spring

 

[parm]

I'd agree, it's become very clear that you can still catch COVID after 1,2,3 vaccines and it seems the risks have been almost universally underrepoted..

We Don't Know Enough About Risks to the Vaccinated

Americans have too little information on infections and hospitalizations among those who have gotten the shots, and the numbers can be spun in different ways.

www.bloomberg.com

they are still in their trial periods , only were allowed onto0 the market because we were in a pandemic , i had 2 pfizer but will never have another , i dont know what i was thinking and i will regret it till the day i die

 

[Hammertime4]

That’s a frankly terrible article. It bases its assertions at least party on the statement

“In the UK, the majority of deaths have been in the vaccinated”

This is a sentence easily misunderstood by people who either

a) do not know enough about the subject matter to comment

or

b) are trying to skew the data to support their views

The vast majority of adults, at the time of writing of that article, were vaccinated.

This includes those most at risk of dying, who even after vaccination, still had higher risk than most, just lower risk than they had without a vaccine.

So it’s not unusual for most people who died to be vaccinated, because almost everyone was vaccinated, especially the elderly.

This doesn’t mean the vaccine doesn’t work. It just means there’s numerically far more people!

-

And another thing, why give a fuck about a Bloomberg article lamenting poor data quality in the US when we have exceptional data quality in our hospitals and have tracked data on vaccinations and hospital outcomes?

Most people with a low post count or who have a new account are current or former posters using a new account. They often post covid or vaccine sceptical content. I hope you are not one such person

I'm not saying the vaccine doesn't work, I'm just sensing that the downsides have been seriously under-reported..

Three things to know about the long-term side effects of COVID vaccines

Many Americans say they want to “make sure the shot is safe” before getting vaccinated. That data is already in, and it is overwhelming.

www.uab.edu

This is very worth a read from the University of Alabama at Birmingham, especially the second half..

they are still in their trial periods , only were allowed onto0 the market because we were in a pandemic , i had 2 pfizer but will never have another , i dont know what i was thinking and i will regret it till the day i die

I've got mixed feelings, I know it's been rushed but still feel that the benefits outweigh the costs, ie more info/choice is my opinion - which should always be the main priority in the free world.
edit: and incidentally I was sick as a dog for nearly 4 days from my 2nd Astrazenica jab - I asked mycousin (who is high up in the NHS) if they were giving you small doses of the disease and she said no, I'm honestly not so certain though.

 

[bahtat]

Another booster on its way for over 75s According to bbc

 

[parm]

I'm not saying the vaccine doesn't work, I'm just sensing that the downsides have been seriously under-reported..

Three things to know about the long-term side effects of COVID vaccines

Many Americans say they want to “make sure the shot is safe” before getting vaccinated. That data is already in, and it is overwhelming.

www.uab.edu

This is very worth a read from the University of Alabama at Birmingham, especially the second half..

I've got mixed feelings, I know it's been rushed but still feel that the benefits outweigh the costs, ie more info/choice is my opinion - which should always be the main priority in the free world.

what i struggle to understand about the situation we have been through is this , they had to really sell these vaccines , nobody can deny the hard sell the govt , media , medical proffesions , big pharma implemented , now in a genuine pandemic (like we have seen in the past) , you would have manned guards at the vax centres to stop folk breaking in , you wouldn t need the hard sell

 

[Hammertime4]

what i struggle to understand about the situation we have been through is this , they had to really sell these vaccines , nobody can deny the hard sell the govt , media , medical proffesions , big pharma implemented , now in a genuine pandemic (like we have seen in the past) , you would have manned guards at the vax centres to stop folk breaking in , you wouldn t need the hard sell

Mate big pharma is a massive bugbear of mine, I used to do clinical trials for money (very good money) years ago and I spoke privately to one of the guys in charge one time and he said in effect that the pharma companies would much rather keep on selling you crutches indefinitely than fix your leg - he meant it and I totally got the jist of what he was saying - sad and scandalous but it doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

 

[parm]

after this im never taking another vax again , thinking of wrapping in the statins as well , can i trust them , can i trust the tests , the data , im not sure anymore

 

[chrismisterx]

after this im never taking another vax again , thinking of wrapping in the statins as well , can i trust them , can i trust the tests , the data , im not sure anymore

Not my place, but have read some disturbing stuff about them. If you ever have concerns its always best to speak with your Doctor and discuss it with him.

It is true can be a minefield out there when reading stuff, more so when you see the horror stories of the wrong doing by some big medical companies.

 

[Frijj]

after this im never taking another vax again , thinking of wrapping in the statins as well , can i trust them , can i trust the tests , the data , im not sure anymore

Jesus man. I don’t like your ideology or views but do not put your health at risk.

Your doctor has no reason to lie to you about your statins or anything else. If you don’t trust them, get a second opinion.

There is absolutely no reason to doubt the efficacy of statins, or vaccinations in general. None.

You are letting worry get the better of you and you get no brownie points for not taking medicine. Nobody is gonna slap you on the back for it.

 

[bahtat]

what i struggle to understand about the situation we have been through is this , they had to really sell these vaccines , nobody can deny the hard sell the govt , media , medical proffesions , big pharma implemented , now in a genuine pandemic (like we have seen in the past) , you would have manned guards at the vax centres to stop folk breaking in , you wouldn t need the hard sell

Im not sure that’s a true analysis of what has happened, the way I see it there has been an excellent take up across all generation, we’ll over 50% especially amongst the elderly

there has been a hard sell though but aimed at the sceptics and there are certainly more of them about after the MMR debate but also because the number of people who remember life without vaccines is decreasing daily. How many posters on here knows anyone who has contracted and died from polio, whooping cough, lockjaw, diphtheria etc I do but my kids or grandkids don’t

 

[Frijj]

Not my place, but have read some disturbing stuff about them. If you ever have concerns its always best to speak with your Doctor and discuss it with him.

It is true can be a minefield out there when reading stuff, more so when you see the horror stories of the wrong doing by some big medical companies.

There are side effects to everything, but statins are very safe:

“ These are very powerful drugs and in the early days of statins, understandably, some people were concerned about potential undiscovered risks associated with them. They’re now one of the most investigated drugs, and we have lots of reliable data – some of which originated from work that’s been funded by the BHF – that show they are very safe and effective to take.”

Statins – your questions answered

Statins help lower your cholesterol levels. We answer your top questions, such as are they safe, what’s a low dose statin and what to do about side effects.

www.bhf.org.uk

 

[Hammertime4]

Jesus man. I don’t like your ideology or views but do not put your health at risk.

Your doctor has no reason to lie to you about your statins or anything else. If you don’t trust them, get a second opinion.

There is absolutely no reason to doubt the efficacy of statins, or vaccinations in general. None.

You are letting worry get the better of you and you get no brownie points for not taking medicine. Nobody is gonna slap you on the back for it.

COVID-19: NHS doctor Steve James who challenged Sajid Javid still refusing to have vaccine as ministers reconsider health worker mandate

As ministers admitted they are reconsidering the vaccine mandate for NHS staff and health workers, Dr Steve James tells Sky News he "never thought I would need to be vaccinated".

news.sky.com

 

[Frijj]

COVID-19: NHS doctor Steve James who challenged Sajid Javid still refusing to have vaccine as ministers reconsider health worker mandate

As ministers admitted they are reconsidering the vaccine mandate for NHS staff and health workers, Dr Steve James tells Sky News he "never thought I would need to be vaccinated".

news.sky.com

What’s your point? Throwing up an article and making no comment is pointless.

What are you trying to say?

 

[Hammertime4]

There are side effects to everything[/URL]

nail on head here IMHO

What’s your point? Throwing up an article and making no comment is pointless.

What are you trying to say?

^^^^

 

[chrismisterx]

There are side effects to everything, but statins are very safe:

“ These are very powerful drugs and in the early days of statins, understandably, some people were concerned about potential undiscovered risks associated with them. They’re now one of the most investigated drugs, and we have lots of reliable data – some of which originated from work that’s been funded by the BHF – that show they are very safe and effective to take.”

Statins – your questions answered

Statins help lower your cholesterol levels. We answer your top questions, such as are they safe, what’s a low dose statin and what to do about side effects.

www.bhf.org.uk

not really the place to discuss this, but 2 sides to every story, for example:-

Dr Kendrick
For many years, I have been ridiculed by colleagues for saying that if you do not already have established heart disease, statins do not increase your life expectancy. By which I mean that they don’t’ actually work. ‘Don’t be ridiculous,’ they exclaim. I usually reply that the evidence is pretty clear and always has been. But I know that they don’t believe me.

However now one of the most influential medical journals in the world had turned round and confirmed it. JAMA has stated in black and white that if you do not have established heart disease, e.g. angina or a previous heart attack, you will not live any longer if you take a statin. I should add, at this point, that around 95% of people who take statins do not have established heart disease.

I am no expert, but it wouldn't be the first time a mistake has been made on the effectiveness of a treatment or data being withheld for profit.

Also some research is showing lowering total cholesterol isnt a good idea anyway and that high cholesterol with the right ratios isnt a problem at all.

But i will restate, no one ever should take advice or follow what someone says on a football message board and should always speak to there own health care giver, nothing wrong with doing research, writing down some questions and asking your doctor to explain things and options.

 

[parm]

There are side effects to everything, but statins are very safe:

“ These are very powerful drugs and in the early days of statins, understandably, some people were concerned about potential undiscovered risks associated with them. They’re now one of the most investigated drugs, and we have lots of reliable data – some of which originated from work that’s been funded by the BHF – that show they are very safe and effective to take.”

Statins – your questions answered

Statins help lower your cholesterol levels. We answer your top questions, such as are they safe, what’s a low dose statin and what to do about side effects.

www.bhf.org.uk

yeah i guess at least with statins we have a decade of research behind us , as for asking a doctor i reckon 99.9% will say they are safe so im not sure theres much point

 

[Frijj]

yeah i guess at least with statins we have a decade of research behind us , as for asking a doctor i reckon 99.9% will say they are safe so im not sure theres much point

When 99.9% of experts think something is safe, that’s usually* a very good indicator that they are safe.

If 99.9% of road safety analysts said seatbelts save lives, would anyone say eee well 0.01% don’t agree…

*there are exceptions as with everything

not really the place to discuss this, but 2 sides to every story, for example:-

Dr Kendrick
For many years, I have been ridiculed by colleagues for saying that if you do not already have established heart disease, statins do not increase your life expectancy. By which I mean that they don’t’ actually work. ‘Don’t be ridiculous,’ they exclaim. I usually reply that the evidence is pretty clear and always has been. But I know that they don’t believe me.

However now one of the most influential medical journals in the world had turned round and confirmed it. JAMA has stated in black and white that if you do not have established heart disease, e.g. angina or a previous heart attack, you will not live any longer if you take a statin. I should add, at this point, that around 95% of people who take statins do not have established heart disease.

I am no expert, but it wouldn't be the first time a mistake has been made on the effectiveness of a treatment or data being withheld for profit.

Also some research is showing lowering total cholesterol isnt a good idea anyway and that high cholesterol with the right ratios isnt a problem at all.

But i will restate, no one ever should take advice or follow what someone says on a football message board and should always speak to there own health care giver, nothing wrong with doing research, writing down some questions and asking your doctor to explain things and options.

This needs its own thread but one JAMA paper does not unequivocal proof make

nail on head here IMHO

^^^^

So you are literally saying nothing then. Just cryptic anti-vax shite. Doubtless you’re another alter-ego of another banned anti-vaxxer