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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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Salem-Hillbilly said:
it is on sky certainly and they are taking the piss out of the west.
as bad as fox and gb news
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I think the government banned RT from broadcasting. You should check that. I may be wrong.

Personally I think we should be able to listen to all broadcasting services and be able to discern what is shite.

And, why shouldn’t the Russian viewpoint be heard? Even if you don’t have to watch it. I stick with Channel 4 News myself.
 
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Mackem Mad said:
I think the government banned RT from broadcasting. You should check that. I may be wrong.

Personally I think we should be able to listen to all broadcasting services and be able to discern what is shite.

And, why shouldn’t the Russian viewpoint be heard? Even if you don’t have to watch it. I stick with Channel 4 News myself.
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Lord Haw Haw likes this.
 
r@mside said:
He doesn't want Ukraine, there are two key issues motivating Russia.

The first is settling the civil war in Ukraine which people forget is on temporary hold pending conclusion of the Minsk II agreement brokered by Germany and France with Ukraine
The second and even more problematic is the demand that NATO stops expanding into Eastern Europe and neighbouring Stans.
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I thought you said there was no logical reason for Russia to invade Ukraine? Have you not just outlined some logic there?
 
r@mside said:
I think this post at least attempts to take a broader geopolitical view, so credit for that.

What make your points invalid is trying to make standard international practice something sinister when one state does it and totalling avoiding the fact the US does exactly the thing you suggested would not be tolerated by Russia.

You're also offering these things as evidence of Russian malevolence in Ukraine. What we regularly see with competing major powers are clashes of conflict, espionage and intelligence gathering in some arenas while co-operating on issues that are mutually beneficial. This happens with US-Russia relations, US-China relations and China-Russia relations, it's happening right now.

When you refer to a Russian invasion of Ukraine, I assume you mean Crimea. There's nothing much to dispute, Russia violated international law and is paying the price through sanctions and the EU pulling back from their strategic partnership. If the return of Crimea to Ukraine is a central and uncompromisable position in the negotiations then this could well end badly. I don't know if it's telling or not, but there's not a great deal being made of it considering. Most of the hysteria is about the whole thing being a Russian ruse to take Ukraine and beyond.

Regards your last paragraph, that's just childish. Read what I posted again, I suggested you listen to experts on Russia and China and was obviously referring to views picked up from what I've read or heard. I wouldn't want to swear on it but I think the nature of the naval exercise came from an interview between someone from The Spectator and a researcher at the Carnegie Moscow Centre, hardly Pravda or Sputnik propaganda.
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To be honest mate I couldn't care less about taking a more geopolitical view. This isn't an analysis and dissertation. I did say originally that a broader view did need to be taken but to place the Ukraine situation in its current context. If there are nuclear armed Russian subs lurking off the British Isles, I want NATO to hassle them into leaving by whatever means possible. That is about the safety of this country and its people. I am in my 70s and lived through the entire Cold War. I am all aware of the global game of chess played by America and the Russians with many shit things done by the USA.

It's hardly surprising that Russia would want the Minsk II agreement signed by Ukraine for reasons I also included in my earlier post.
 
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Ancient Prophecy

As the Sleeper stirs, madness was to spread across the mortals. Cities would burn, insanity flare like wildfire and blood flow in preparation for the Ones to Come.

On top of a Global Pandemic 🙄

Just to brighten everyones morning 😁
 
Mercia Blackcat said:
To be honest mate I couldn't care less about taking a more geopolitical view. This isn't an analysis and dissertation. I did say originally that a broader view did need to be taken but to place the Ukraine situation in its current context. If there are nuclear armed Russian subs lurking off the British Isles, I want NATO to hassle them into leaving by whatever means possible. That is about the safety of this country and its people. I am in my 70s and lived through the entire Cold War. I am all aware of the global game of chess played by America and the Russians with many shit things done by the USA.

It's hardly surprising that Russia would want the Minsk II agreement signed by Ukraine for reasons I also included in my earlier post.
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If they are in international waters there's very little that can be done.
 
Dogbark said:
If they are in international waters there's very little that can be done.
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Well that's what the Soviet sub K-219 thought in 1986 until it encountered the American sub USS Augusta off the coast of Bermuda and experienced a close encounter that was a common tactic during the Cold War and in fact beyond. If NATO wants them to move they will be given a gentle nudge in the right direction.
 
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Mercia Blackcat said:
Well that's what the Soviet sub K-219 thought in 1986 until it encountered the American sub USS Augusta off the coast of Bermuda and experienced a close encounter that was a common tactic during the Cold War and in fact beyond. If NATO wants them to move they will be given a gentle nudge in the right direction.
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Go on then?
 
woodlebert said:
I thought you said there was no logical reason for Russia to invade Ukraine? Have you not just outlined some logic there?
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No, but if you can see the rationale in a country that says it doesn't want to invade its neighbour invading its neighbour then I'm interested to know what it is.

I can see a scenario where Russia pulls the reins holding back the separatists in the east and the civil war going into full swing but it doesn't require this escalation of forces to do that.
Mercia Blackcat said:
To be honest mate I couldn't care less about taking a more geopolitical view. This isn't an analysis and dissertation. I did say originally that a broader view did need to be taken but to place the Ukraine situation in its current context. If there are nuclear armed Russian subs lurking off the British Isles, I want NATO to hassle them into leaving by whatever means possible. That is about the safety of this country and its people. I am in my 70s and lived through the entire Cold War. I am all aware of the global game of chess played by America and the Russians with many shit things done by the USA.

It's hardly surprising that Russia would want the Minsk II agreement signed by Ukraine for reasons I also included in my earlier post.
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You keep slipping this into the conversation, I've made no comment about NATO chasing off subs.

Are you trying to suggest that what Russia is doing in Ukraine poses a direct threat to the safety of the people on this country? Or Russian subs in international waters is an indication it wants to invade Ukraine? I don't see the connection, just as I don't see US subs conducting exercises in the Black Sea as an indication it plans to retake the Crimea for Ukraine.
 
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Dogbark said:
If they are in international waters there's very little that can be done.
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The problem is how would we know they're staying in international waters?

Edit: see
You must be logged on to see external links
 
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APH said:
The problem is how would we know they're staying in international waters?

Edit: see
You must be logged on to see external links
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that wiki link there, did something similar happen in the baltic a couple of years ago? i seem recall they complained about a foreign submarine in their waters or something?
 
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