NUFC/Sportwashing

[Deleted member 31333]

Henry Winter is up there with Jake Humphrey for sticking his tongue up Newcastle fans bum holes, horrendous views.

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Winter is a mag anyways. Makes sense as he’s an utter prick.

 

[The Fish]

You do, because that's exactly what the club are doing now and it's spent alot of money recently on the likes of ASM, Joelinton, Willock.

It's spending less than it makes, and it's not spending on what the squad needs. e.g. NUFC signed Joelinton for £40m despite the then manager saying it was a bad idea, the scouts saying the player was overvalued. Had that £40m been made available to the manager (Bruce or Benitez) they'd have signed a proven striker like Rondon or Wilson for 1/2 that and had £20m to spend on defenders or midfielders.

Which happens to many clubs, Newcastle United are not unique. It even happened to us after finishing 10th, We neglected the squad that got us to the best finish since the Reid days.

Right, which is bad, I've never said Newcastle have it the worst in that regard, or we're unique or whatever.

Is this just guess work? Have you got any quotes from anyone within the club to confirm Newcastle don't have the facilities to 'combat soft tissue injuries'? Genuinally intrigued to see if this has been mentioned by someone within the club to advise your rehabilitation and medical unit isn't that of a standard Premiership outfit.

I've had a look but can't find a direct quote, but there's plenty of mentions of no investment and pieces in the Athletic showing nothing more than the basic. I remember a mention of other clubs having hydropools and the like, where Newcastle do not.

Andy Carroll, Longstaff Brothers, Woodman, Dummett, Armstrong etc all came through the academy and represented the first team, Can you let me know who have you lost as an academy prospect that has went on to represent clubs at a higher level or had an outstanding career since?

You're stretching it a bit by demanding a player who's gone on to have 'an outstanding career' aren't you? You've had at least 1, we've had none.

Ah, So even when Ashleys appointments work, it's got nothing to do with him and no credit should be given yet every appointment that fails, is his fault.

It's a gamble with Ashley, not a considered plan.

Are you that braindead that you can't accept / acknowledge that Mike Ashley has stated on several occasions he want's to sell the club, and until he does, the scenario is pretty much going to be the same? Every single person knows that in order for Newcastle to progress from now, they need a change of ownership. That isn't my argument, my point is that Mike Ashley hasn't had a sole aim of only ever surviving since he bough the club in 2007. Ashley is probably one of the longest serving owners in the PL and took over the club when the PL was in a very different financial position to what it now is. He has admitted he hasn't got the financial ability to plough endless amounts of money into the club. How is it a surprise to you that an owner, who's entire empire is dictated by the success of his retail businesses, is unwilling to plough money into an asset, on the back of a global pandemic that absolutely decimated the retail sector? I don't know how a) you can't accept this or b) realise it, when it's so f***ing obvious.

I've not asked for Ashley to put his own (or Sports Direct's) money into the club, so the decimation of the retail sector doesn't impact NUFC. I've asked for him to invest in the club, if that means we don't spunk £40m on a non-goalscoring forward and instead develop the facilities, then that's grand. If it means he sells some of the advertising hoarding space in St James' to a company he doesn't own, then that's grand too.

Also, the scenario being the same until he goes doesn't mean the scenario isn't worth criticising. Especially when you have people saying that Newcastle fans should be happy with the scenario.

 

[Sons of The Wear]

Winter is a mag anyways. Makes sense as he’s an utter prick.

Colleague of arch Mag and fellow Times football reporter Martin Hardy and The Athletics #cans George Caulkin (ex Times). These fkrs are a disgrace.

Utterly biased, no sense of impartiality and blind to what the Saudi regime stands for.

They just want a glamorous, wealthy NUFC at any cost and fcuk what anyone else thinks.

 

[The Fish]

The first period was neglect, the second is sensible.

Can you clear something up, why does sensible book-keeping have to go hand in hand with a lack of ambition? Other clubs seem to be able to be both well-run and ambitious?

 

[Deleted member 31333]

Colleague of arch Mag and fellow Times football reporter Martin Hardy and The Athletics #cans George Caulkin (ex Times). These fkrs are a disgrace.

Utterly biased, no sense of impartiality and blind to what the Saudi regime stands for.

They just want a glamorous, wealthy NUFC at any cost and fcuk what anyone else thinks.

Yeah they use their position in the media as football writers to push their own agenda. i know they we’ll do it but it’s pathetic when theres so many mags.

 

[Binxy]

Can you clear something up, why does sensible book-keeping have to go hand in hand with a lack of ambition? Other clubs seem to be able to be both well-run and ambitious?

Which clubs?
Away name them.

 

[Super Ted]

It's spending less than it makes, and it's not spending on what the squad needs. e.g. NUFC signed Joelinton for £40m despite the then manager saying it was a bad idea, the scouts saying the player was overvalued. Had that £40m been made available to the manager (Bruce or Benitez) they'd have signed a proven striker like Rondon or Wilson for 1/2 that and had £20m to spend on defenders or midfielders.

If NUFC hadn't spent the 40 million on Joelinton and put it into the infrastructure there would have been absolute hell on, and you know it. The fact Joelinton hasn't worked (thus far) means you can use this as something to back up your statement because it suits you agenda. I can also guarantee that if Joelinton had been banging the goals in and had you around the top 8, the academy / infrastructure at present wouldn't even be mentioned.

Right, which is bad, I've never said Newcastle have it the worst in that regard, or we're unique or whatever.

Since 2007, The Premiership has had 42 relegation positions available, Newcastle have occupied these finishing positions, twice, in 14 years. There is not one of those clubs who have been relegated (or some of them who haven't even been relegated) twist, moan, and continuously blame the owner for absolutely everything that has happened within that time period. One of the unique things with NUFC is within that time period they have also had some successful seasons, again which is then classed as fluked or nothing to do with the owner at all. There is also clubs who have been relegated and never returned, and fans of these clubs don't kick and scream like petulant children because the owner isn't ploughing money back into the club (when he has already stated on many times that he can't afford to do)

I've had a look but can't find a direct quote, but there's plenty of mentions of no investment and pieces in the Athletic showing nothing more than the basic. I remember a mention of other clubs having hydropools and the like, where Newcastle do not.

So in short, no evidence whatsoever.

You're stretching it a bit by demanding a player who's gone on to have 'an outstanding career' aren't you? You've had at least 1, we've had none.

Isn't the job of the academy to develop either a) players for the first team (Which you have done) b) generate income to the club (Which you have done) - You completely ignored my question here. You haven't released an academy product that has went on to have a really successful career, From the ones that have been developed to a level you are at, You have either got significant money for, or they are part of the first team squad.

It's a gamble with Ashley, not a considered plan.

Every single appointment in football is a gamble, There is absolutely no guarantee that any appointment / signing will always work. You can obviously mitigate the risk but there is no evidence to suggest that when Ashley appointed some of the more successful managers i.e. Hughton, Benitez, Pardew, that these appointments weren't carefully considered behind the scenes, again because it doesn't suit your agenda, your assuming they weren't. You will no doubt come back and say Pardew was appointed following on from L1 in Southampton, yet his appointment was actually pretty successful, you can't have it both ways.

I've not asked for Ashley to put his own (or Sports Direct's) money into the club, so the decimation of the retail sector doesn't impact NUFC. I've asked for him to invest in the club, if that means we don't spunk £40m on a non-goalscoring forward and instead develop the facilities, then that's grand. If it means he sells some of the advertising hoarding space in St James' to a company he doesn't own, then that's grand too.

Also, the scenario being the same until he goes doesn't mean the scenario isn't worth criticising. Especially when you have people saying that Newcastle fans should be happy with the scenario.

If you are not asking for Ashley to put his own money, yet you wan't him to invest in the club, How do you expect him to do this significantly when the club over the last few seasons has spent what it's brought in?

 

[johnny kayo]

Have I missed something?? How come the divvies are on about this takeover again?

 

[The Fish]

Which clubs?
Away name them.

Leicester, Brentford, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace. Perhaps the latter is not ambitious enough to make the list.

Care to answer my question?

 

[Super Ted]

Leicester, Brentford, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace. Perhaps the latter is not ambitious enough to make the list.

Care to answer my question?

I'm not sure if you are serious or not here.

 

[Squat]

Leicester, Brentford, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace. Perhaps the latter is not ambitious enough to make the list.

Care to answer my question?

sensible book keeping?
Leicester’s net debt has gone up by 147% to £162 million. The directors have reviewed the club’s cash flow forecasts and they revealed that the company is reliant on continued funding from external banks as well as King Power International. Leicester have entered into two five-year loan facilities for a total of £ 30 million to finance the working capital requirements of the club and have increased and extended a £ 45 million facility with Macquarie Bank to January 2022. Leicester have also agreed a further £ 16.4 million facility with Macquarie. Should the economic climate worsen for football, the club also have a £ 35 million standby facility with King Power.

brentford were 74m in debt in the championship. they got a bumper cash prize getting promoted

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[Super Ted]

sensible book keeping?
Leicester’s net debt has gone up by 147% to £162 million. The directors have reviewed the club’s cash flow forecasts and they revealed that the company is reliant on continued funding from external banks as well as King Power International. Leicester have entered into two five-year loan facilities for a total of £ 30 million to finance the working capital requirements of the club and have increased and extended a £ 45 million facility with Macquarie Bank to January 2022. Leicester have also agreed a further £ 16.4 million facility with Macquarie. Should the economic climate worsen for football, the club also have a £ 35 million standby facility with King Power.

You can add in the fact that Leicester are probably the most unique footballing story of modern football (if not it's entirety)

They defied all odds and won the Premiership on the back of escaping relegation from nowhere the season before, it's single handedly set the club up for life to acheive things it could never have even dreamt of, It probably won't ever happen again. Comparing Leicester's situation to Newcastles (or anyone else's for that matter is just stupid) - Man United would swap Leicesters recent success for their own which says it all.

As for saying Brentford & Palace I bet he would have used Sheffield United as of two years ago anarl.

 

[Binxy]

Leicester, Brentford, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace. Perhaps the latter is not ambitious enough to make the list.

Care to answer my question?

Scraping the barrel there mind.
Last 14 seasons (as this is your barometer) Villa have spent 3 seasons in the championship and have a highest finish of 6th.
Palace have 6 seasons with a highest finish of 10th.
Leicesters success is unsustainabl, they're already in huge debt.
Brentford have achieved absolutely bot all.

 

[Super Ted]

Scraping the barrel there mind.
Last 14 seasons (as this is your barometer) Villa have spent 3 seasons in the championship and have a highest finish of 6th.
Palace have 6 seasons with a highest finish of 10th.
Leicesters success is unsustainabl, they're already in huge debt.
Brentford have achieved absolutely bot all.

No doubt he would have used Sheffield United as an example two years ago when they were the media darlings, or maybe Bournemouth, Blackpool, Swansea who all had little stints of being the medias favourite club.

Funny that they've all now gone, yet one thing remains, Newcastle as a Premiership club.

As for f***ing Brentford, Jesus wept.

 

[The Fish]

If NUFC hadn't spent the 40 million on Joelinton and put it into the infrastructure there would have been absolute hell on, and you know it. The fact Joelinton hasn't worked (thus far) means you can use this as something to back up your statement because it suits you agenda. I can also guarantee that if Joelinton had been banging the goals in and had you around the top 8, the academy / infrastructure at present wouldn't even be mentioned.

If Mike Ashley pumped £40m of the club's money into the training ground and academy there'd be a collective heart attack across Tyneside. Might not scan with your invented caricature of Newcastle fans, but it's true.

Since 2007, The Premiership has had 42 relegation positions available, Newcastle have occupied these finishing positions, twice, in 14 years. There is not one of those clubs who have been relegated (or some of them who haven't even been relegated) twist, moan, and continuously blame the owner for absolutely everything that has happened within that time period. One of the unique things with NUFC is within that time period they have also had some successful seasons, again which is then classed as fluked or nothing to do with the owner at all. There is also clubs who have been relegated and never returned, and fans of these clubs don't kick and scream like petulant children because the owner isn't ploughing money back into the club (when he has already stated on many times that he can't afford to do)

Yes they f***ing do, Arsenal, Man Utd, West Ham, Chelsea, Liverpool, have all had protests and cry-arsing about how their clubs are run. Villa fans were livid when they went down and how their club was run. There are a few fanbases who went down with barely a whimper, just a glum acceptance of their fate. You don't seem to see that whatever Burnley fans feel about how they're run, doesn't impact how Newcastle fans about how we're run.

So in short, no evidence whatsoever.


Isn't the job of the academy to develop either a) players for the first team (Which you have done) b) generate income to the club (Which you have done) - You completely ignored my question here. You haven't released an academy product that has went on to have a really successful career, From the ones that have been developed to a level you are at, You have either got significant money for, or they are part of the first team squad.

Academy sees no significant investment for 14yrs, and you think that's fine? Also, the "really successful" part of your caveat is doing a fuck ton of heavy lifting. What % of youth products go on to have a "really successful" career?

Every single appointment in football is a gamble, There is absolutely no guarantee that any appointment / signing will always work. You can obviously mitigate the risk but there is no evidence to suggest that when Ashley appointed some of the more successful managers i.e. Hughton, Benitez, Pardew, that these appointments weren't carefully considered behind the scenes, again because it doesn't suit your agenda, your assuming they weren't. You will no doubt come back and say Pardew was appointed following on from L1 in Southampton, yet his appointment was actually pretty successful, you can't have it both ways.

Pardew was sacked by League 1 Southampton. You cannot sit there with a straight face and say that wasn't a massive gamble for a newly promoted Premier League club? Hughton had never managed before and was given the charge of winning immediate promotion back to the Premier League. That's a massive gamble. Benitez, with his impressive CV was less of a gamble.

Look at the styles of football we've lurched between, this isn't the application of a considered strategy. Even under the previous owners we went from cavalier Keegan to Dour Dalglish, Robson's flowing attacking football, to Souness' shite, Allardyce to Keegan, Keegan to Kinnear, pragmatic Hughton to attacking Pardew, whatever the fuck McClaren was aiming for to pragmatic Benitez, now to 'front foot Bruce'. Where's the long term planning? How can you have long term recruitment plans when the managers play significantly differing styles of coaching, of playing?

If you are not asking for Ashley to put his own money, yet you wan't him to invest in the club, How do you expect him to do this significantly when the club over the last few seasons has spent what it's brought in?

He's been here 14 years, he could easily have ring fenced £2m a year from the tv deals, or perhaps paid for the advertising space his companies have enjoyed for nowt. £2m a year upgrading and maintaining the facilities beyond a lick of paint, so that the club isn't a decade behind other PL clubs in this regard.

 

[Binxy]

No doubt he would have used Sheffield United as an example two years ago when they were the media darlings, or maybe Bournemouth, Blackpool, Swansea who all had little stints of being the medias favourite club.

Funny that they've all now gone, yet one thing remains, Newcastle as a Premiership club.

As for f***ing Brentford, Jesus wept.

West Brom, Watford and Burnley usually get spouted as well.

 

[The Fish]

sensible book keeping?
Leicester’s net debt has gone up by 147% to £162 million. The directors have reviewed the club’s cash flow forecasts and they revealed that the company is reliant on continued funding from external banks as well as King Power International. Leicester have entered into two five-year loan facilities for a total of £ 30 million to finance the working capital requirements of the club and have increased and extended a £ 45 million facility with Macquarie Bank to January 2022. Leicester have also agreed a further £ 16.4 million facility with Macquarie. Should the economic climate worsen for football, the club also have a £ 35 million standby facility with King Power.

brentford were 74m in debt in the championship. they got a bumper cash prize getting promoted

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Fair enough on the Leicester front, didn't know it was that bad. Re: Brentford, they owe less to their owner than we do to ours and we've had 12 years of PL money coming into the club.

They both shown more ambition than we have.

 

[Binxy]

Fair enough on the Leicester front, didn't know it was that bad. Re: Brentford, they owe less to their owner than we do to ours and we've had 12 years of PL money coming into the club.

They both shown more ambition than we have.

And 12 years of Premier league wages.

 

[The Fish]

Scraping the barrel there mind.
Last 14 seasons (as this is your barometer) Villa have spent 3 seasons in the championship and have a highest finish of 6th.
Palace have 6 seasons with a highest finish of 10th.
Leicesters success is unsustainabl, they're already in huge debt.
Brentford have achieved absolutely bot all.

Villa are aiming for more, Palace... to early to tell under Vieira but appear to be trying to rejuvenate their squad and push away from a relegation scrap, fair enough re: Leicester, Brentford have achieved promotion to the Premier League, that's no mean feat for a club their size.

 

[Exile 1968]

If NUFC hadn't spent the 40 million on Joelinton and put it into the infrastructure there would have been absolute hell on, and you know it. The fact Joelinton hasn't worked (thus far) means you can use this as something to back up your statement because it suits you agenda. I can also guarantee that if Joelinton had been banging the goals in and had you around the top 8, the academy / infrastructure at present wouldn't even be mentioned.


Since 2007, The Premiership has had 42 relegation positions available, Newcastle have occupied these finishing positions, twice, in 14 years. There is not one of those clubs who have been relegated (or some of them who haven't even been relegated) twist, moan, and continuously blame the owner for absolutely everything that has happened within that time period. One of the unique things with NUFC is within that time period they have also had some successful seasons, again which is then classed as fluked or nothing to do with the owner at all. There is also clubs who have been relegated and never returned, and fans of these clubs don't kick and scream like petulant children because the owner isn't ploughing money back into the club (when he has already stated on many times that he can't afford to do)


So in short, no evidence whatsoever.


Isn't the job of the academy to develop either a) players for the first team (Which you have done) b) generate income to the club (Which you have done) - You completely ignored my question here. You haven't released an academy product that has went on to have a really successful career, From the ones that have been developed to a level you are at, You have either got significant money for, or they are part of the first team squad.


Every single appointment in football is a gamble, There is absolutely no guarantee that any appointment / signing will always work. You can obviously mitigate the risk but there is no evidence to suggest that when Ashley appointed some of the more successful managers i.e. Hughton, Benitez, Pardew, that these appointments weren't carefully considered behind the scenes, again because it doesn't suit your agenda, your assuming they weren't. You will no doubt come back and say Pardew was appointed following on from L1 in Southampton, yet his appointment was actually pretty successful, you can't have it both ways.



If you are not asking for Ashley to put his own money, yet you wan't him to invest in the club, How do you expect him to do this significantly when the club over the last few seasons has spent what it's brought in?

Your 1st reply mate. Didn't Keegan scrap the Reserves and didn't bring anyone through? They were spending and winning and not a thing was said.