England squad suprises

[Dexter]

Buttler is a strange choice mind, he’s probably played about 10 defensive shots all year.

Is his technique really good enough to come in at 7 when we’re 100-5 and Amir is swinging it round corners testing his defensive aptitude? Great to come in when we’re flying to add more impetus to an innings, but I really can’t see him in the team long term, too many technical faults in his game.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Buttler is a strange choice mind, he’s probably played about 10 defensive shots all year.

Is his technique really good enough to come in at 7 when we’re 100-5 and Amir is swinging it round corners testing his defensive aptitude? Great to come in when we’re flying to add more impetus to an innings, but I really can’t see him in the team long term, too many technical faults in his game.

His technique is clearly not good enough as they are picking him as a batsman only at 7.

 

[The Rat]

A stupid thing to say? Really? So you think Jos Buttler would play in the IPL for his air fare alone if they asked him to? Now that is stupid.

Fantastic experience, improving him as a Cricketer - definitely, I agree, but only as a WHITE ball Cricketer.

As Bri and Chunky pointed out, he's absolutely mediocre against a red ball and clearly his previous record tells you that he's got no time for it and very little interest in it at all.

We can have a wild card, Bess is that wild card in this squad - young lad, given a go. Buttler is talented, but is he talented against the red ball? No.

I think it was Chunky that said it's like picking someone for an 11 a side football game because they're good at 5 a side - T20 and Test Match Cricket are absolutely poles apart, both are completely different games.

He would play in the IPL for the same money he is getting paid for Lancashire, absolutely, why wouldn;t you, what a life experience for you.

Not really like, plenty of players have been picked for white ball form, Pietersen being one.

He is batting 7, not opening the batting like

Might not work, give it a chance, don't see what they have got to lose like, well done Smith, bold selection for once, makes a nice change.

Buttler is a strange choice mind, he’s probably played about 10 defensive shots all year.

Is his technique really good enough to come in at 7 when we’re 100-5 and Amir is swinging it round corners testing his defensive aptitude? Great to come in when we’re flying to add more impetus to an innings, but I really can’t see him in the team long term, too many technical faults in his game.

Possibly yeah, but lets find out, I actually thought he looked decent towards of the India tour

A lot of players are struggling with the step up in attention from county to international cricket, least he knows it

Not saying its a perfect pick, but I reckon worth a gamble

His technique is clearly not good enough as they are picking him as a batsman only at 7.

Only because they want to push Bairstow up like and they want to keep the gloves with him

So they would have been picking a batsman at 7 whatever, regardless of his technique

Well it’s about game changing scores really, 100 is an arbitrary number I agree. Vince made 80 odd in Brisbane. Had that’s been 150 then that changes the game.

Yeah totally agree with that, and if they said that its a fair point, but I do think some commentators are just too obsessed with that number

Maybe I am old school but I want my opener batting a period of time, getting 50s etc, obviously 100s would be canny, but he did well in NZ, I want consistency rather than just ten single figure scores then a big 100, if that makes sense, which is what Cook is doing

 

[Voice of fair play]

It's about time Cook made way for someone younger

Dubious about Stoneman also

Which two other openers are good enough to replace them two?

Easy to come out with that statement hard to think of better replacements

 

[The Rat]

I personally think Buttler is a dreadful decision

It’s like picking someone who only plays 5 a side for an 11 a side game

He’s a talent aye. He has getting hit ability. But his FC record is average. And he isn’t even playing the game

Foakes should be in

I'm not convinced Foakes would regularly score more runs than Buttler mind

He only gets in if he gets the gloves, which he isn't, and Bairstow out-kept him at Surrey this week according to all the journos that are there.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I'm not convinced Foakes would regularly score more runs than Buttler mind

He only gets in if he gets the gloves, which he isn't, and Bairstow out-kept him at Surrey this week according to all the journos that are there.

Fair enough. Pick a genuine batsman then

 

[The Rat]

Fair enough. Pick a genuine batsman then

Still going to have a batsman at 7 though, if you are going to do that I'd rather have a freak talent like Buttler than a traditional one, he will be batting with the tail remember.

I'd agree if he was getting picked in the top 5, he isn't though

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

For an opener? Its prbably the hardest position to score a 100 from

He played well in NZ and deserved to keep his place.

The obsession over 100s is ridiculous now, was never like this when growing up, obiously over his England career he needed one, but just on his last series he got 50s and saw off the new ball, batted time, that is what the opener is there for.

Its like when Vince got 87 or someit, its like "oh but he didn't get the 100 he really needed" like 13 runs would have made any difference to the context of a match

There is a balance, and I feel its gone too far

As @chunkylover53 said the 100 is just a proxy for game-changing scores. His average is poor (for an supposed international) at first class level and nowt flash, albeit at an early stage and against decent opposition, at test level either.

I personally don't think he has it in him - and he is very, very, lucky to still be there. If he fails against Pakistan, he'll be out - and rightly so.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Still going to have a batsman at 7 though, if you are going to do that I'd rather have a freak talent like Buttler than a traditional one, he will be batting with the tail remember.

I'd agree if he was getting picked in the top 5, he isn't though

I can see that argument.

But the reality is that we are short of runs and whilst I like Bairstow higher, I’d prefer someone who can bat properly.

As much as this place will disagree, Stokes at 7 may be worth considering. He’s the counter attacker from that position? Similar to Gilchrist.

 

[Voice of fair play]

The red ball whores Won’t be happy with butlers inclusion.
Finally sense prevails and bairstow moves up the order. Only been blindingly obvious for last 12 months!

He actually batted 8 in the pivotal second ashes test! Beyond belief that was!

I actually think it's a breath of fresh air picking Buttler.

It's difficult to argue with the arguments against him,however sometimes you just go with someone who clearly has a big game mentality, rather than just look at averages (anyone can pick a team on that basis).

Although Buttler struggled at test level, he actually started his test career quite well, and people with his obvious talent should always be given another chance imo.

 

[Comeback_Kenwyne]

He actually batted 8 in the pivotal second ashes test! Beyond belief that was!

I actually think it's a breath of fresh air picking Buttler.

It's difficult to argue with the arguments against him,however sometimes you just go with someone who clearly has a big game mentality, rather than just look at averages (anyone can pick a team on that basis).

Although Buttler struggled at test level, he actually started his test career quite well, and people with his obvious talent should always be given another chance imo.

Smith loves him and its no real surprise to see him there. If England have a lengthened tail - which, without Ali and Woakes, we will - then you probably need someone like him at seven too. You aren't going to craft a century out if Mark Wood is coming in at number eight - you don't have time. He's worth a go, but he's equal worth axing if it doesn't work out.

I think Stoneman selection is poor. I think the mooted Bairstow experiment might have been worth considering - allowing for a player in form, Joe Clarke, to come in at five.

I can see that argument.

But the reality is that we are short of runs and whilst I like Bairstow higher, I’d prefer someone who can bat properly.

As much as this place will disagree, Stokes at 7 may be worth considering. He’s the counter attacker from that position? Similar to Gilchrist.

I don't disagree. Good idea. Should definitely be plan B if Butler blows up - as I expect tbh.

 

[The Rat]

I can see that argument.

But the reality is that we are short of runs and whilst I like Bairstow higher, I’d prefer someone who can bat properly.

As much as this place will disagree, Stokes at 7 may be worth considering. He’s the counter attacker from that position? Similar to Gilchrist.

I think Stokes is too good a player for that

I know what you mean, but this is why I was always a fan of Bairstow at 7, as you could have a more traditional batsman at 5

Smith loves him and its no real surprise to see him there. If England have a lengthened tail - which, without Ali and Woakes, we will - then you probably need someone like him at seven too. You aren't going to craft a century out if Mark Wood is coming in at number eight - you don't have time. He's worth a go, but he's equal worth axing if it doesn't work out.

I think Stoneman selection is poor. I think the mooted Bairstow experiment might have been worth considering - allowing for a player in form, Joe Clarke, to come in at five.



I don't disagree. Good idea. Should definitely be plan B if Butler blows up - as I expect tbh.

Stoneman deserved to be kept after how he played in NZ when he was consistent, if he keeps that up he is doing his job.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I think Stokes is too good a player for that

I know what you mean, but this is why I was always a fan of Bairstow at 7, as you could have a more traditional batsman at 5



Stoneman deserved to be kept after how he played in NZ when he was consistent, if he keeps that up he is doing his job.

I know what you’re saying. But he averages 12 less than Gilchrist who was happy there (albeit with a much stronger top 6)

 

[The Rat]

He actually batted 8 in the pivotal second ashes test! Beyond belief that was!

I actually think it's a breath of fresh air picking Buttler.

It's difficult to argue with the arguments against him,however sometimes you just go with someone who clearly has a big game mentality, rather than just look at averages (anyone can pick a team on that basis).

Although Buttler struggled at test level, he actually started his test career quite well, and people with his obvious talent should always be given another chance imo.

He looked ok in India too

Can't argue with the arguments against him, but I see it like you a breath of fresh air

If it doesn't work, not sure its a big deal personally

I know what you’re saying. But he averages 12 less than Gilchrist who was happy there (albeit with a much stronger top 6)

well albeit stronger top 6 is quite a key point isn't it.

Root, Bairstow and Stokes are the best batsman in England in the 5 day format

If you are going to have any of them at 7 then it should be Bairstow

We can always drop him back down there if this doesn't work out.

I thought more people would be up for the Buttler inclusion, bit surprised by the reaction actually.

 

[rentaghost]

I don't see how Stoneman is, he did well New Zealand.



Don't agree

This is the problem with selection, everyone has a different opinion, there is no right answer its all subjective

But people usually say "typical ECB" "Typical England" etc

In reality, there is no agenda, just people selecting a team they think can win

He did OK - averaged 40 in a 2 test series but looking at it as a collective whole that's 19 innings with a top score of 60 and an average of around 30. Its not enough and if there was a realistic alternative he would be out. NZ followed a similar pattern of him getting stuck in a rut when the ball gets softer and then getting out. The problem now is he is nowhere near as confident as he was a few months ago and it would be a surprise if he scores big against Pakistan. I will be delighted if he does though.

 

[GordonMuchallNo1Fan]

Which two other openers are good enough to replace them two?

Easy to come out with that statement hard to think of better replacements

I believe it was the right time to give Jennings a better chance. Like it not he's the future now and I feel we need to move on which will be difficult as the ecb have fucked about with red ball cricket so much, the test side is struggling and I dont see much coming through. It's a very average squad

 

[Mackem DJ]

Its really not classic ECB, its the opposite of what the ECB would normally do

Why not? What have we got to lose, he is a freak talent, got to be worth ago IMO

Not really remotely interested if he is squeaking out 50s against Glamorgan in May

Give owa lad

 

[Mrjardine]

You think he is only there for the money? What a stupid thing to say

Most cricketers would play for little over there, full houses, crazy crowds, biggest tournament in the world

Its a fantastic experience for him and is improving him as a cricketer.

You'd rather have Foakes in? That is your call, I think Buttler is a lot more talented and has a lot more potential

We pick all our players on county form, why can't we have a slight wild card, especially when he is that talented?



I like how he keeps the gloves though

can't underestimate how hard he has worked to be a world class gloveman, and he really is now, to take it off him would be cruel and detrimental to him at the minute

Totally get your argument about the gloves and as you say he’s become an excellent, However other than sangakarra I can’t think of any other who have combined batting top order and keeping with any great success. I personally think if it continues one will have to give and if buttler starts doing the business with bat he’ll end up with gloves as well.

He actually batted 8 in the pivotal second ashes test! Beyond belief that was!

I actually think it's a breath of fresh air picking Buttler.

It's difficult to argue with the arguments against him,however sometimes you just go with someone who clearly has a big game mentality, rather than just look at averages (anyone can pick a team on that basis).

Although Buttler struggled at test level, he actually started his test career quite well, and people with his obvious talent should always be given another chance imo.

I’ve always argued he’s too much of a talent to just disregard because he might not flourish in the county game, some lads are better on the big stage and I think buttler is one of them IMO.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Totally get your argument about the gloves and as you say he’s become an excellent, However other than sangakarra I can’t think of any other who have combined batting top order and keeping with any great success. I personally think if it continues one will have to give and if buttler starts doing the business with bat he’ll end up with gloves as well.


I’ve always argued he’s too much of a talent to just disregard because he might not flourish in the county game, some lads are better on the big stage and I think buttler is one of them IMO.

The challenge is that he has played 18 tests. With mixed results.

 

[The Rat]

The challenge is that he has played 18 tests. With mixed results.

Its a test, he knows why he has been called up, if I was him I'd just back myself

If he isn't getting a proper recall he deserves a run though

He did OK - averaged 40 in a 2 test series but looking at it as a collective whole that's 19 innings with a top score of 60 and an average of around 30. Its not enough and if there was a realistic alternative he would be out. NZ followed a similar pattern of him getting stuck in a rut when the ball gets softer and then getting out. The problem now is he is nowhere near as confident as he was a few months ago and it would be a surprise if he scores big against Pakistan. I will be delighted if he does though.

Yeah OK is fair, I did think he did well in NZ though

If he gets dropped, then it happens but I think some of the criticism in the press has been over the top, he has outperformed Cook since he came into the side, yet he will be the one who gets blamed

I think Cook's form over the last few years has hurt the other openers, lots of low scores then a big one.