Arguements against sacking Poyet

[The Exile]

It's not his fault.

Not all his fault, certainly, but where the rest of the problems lie seems all to difficult to contemplate. Sacking the manager is the easy way out and the one we'll likely take. In 12 months time, same again. The underlying problems remaining.

Which in turn suggests he doesnt know a player.

He knew who'd done well for him and who he felt he could work with. If he'd signed a different player the whinge would inevitably be 'Bridcutt and Buckley were desperate to come, why didn't he buy them?'

 

[supermackem123]

You've got to be realistic about this, I keep coming back to this point when arguing this with my mates, who can come in and do a better job? Once the 'Poyet out' crew get past sacking Poyet, they don't have a clue what to say or suggest.

Poyet has got a certain philosophy and knows what he wants from his team, nobody can deny that since he's come in - we're hard to beat (Southampton game aside). Defensively, we look pretty solid. Yes, the football on show is quite depressing, we've got to accept we are not Barcelona, we don't really have any right to expect to be entertained and winning. If playing this, at times extremely boring football keeps us up then it'll be a job done.

We clearly needed to improve our options up front, Poyet has identified that and signed a proven scorer at this level - Defoe. People are getting carried away, decent result against Burnley next week and we're still in the cup, looking much safer and it's lovely jubbly as Del Boy says. People forget what we did last year was just silly, getting to a cup final and keeping us up was a huge task to do for Poyet.

I'm not a happy clapper, I was extremely pissed off with yesterdays result and the lack of urgency in our team was concering, but, we've got to stick with him at least untill the end of the season. If someone can offer me a logical replacement for Poyet I may listen, untill then I think we've got to stick with him.

It'll all be alreet man

 

[dirty bristow]

Not all his fault, certainly, but where the rest of the problems lie seems all to difficult to contemplate. Sacking the manager is the easy way out and the one we'll likely take. In 12 months time, same again. The underlying problems remaining.



He knew who'd done well for him and who he felt he could work with. If he'd signed a different player the whinge would inevitably be 'Bridcutt and Buckley were desperate to come, why didn't he buy them?'

Sorry but that last bit is nonsense.

 

[The Exile]

Sorry but that last bit is nonsense.

You've been here long enough to know that it isn't.

 

[dirty bristow]

You've been here long enough to know that it isn't.

It is a made up scenario, nothing more.

 

[The Exile]

It is a made up scenario, nothing more.

Based upon years (in fact over a decade) of experience.

 

[Crammy Mackem]

He isn't in charge of player recruitment.

We keep on placing the blame for our problems at the manager's door. When do we start asking questions of the wider system? We keep on changing managers and ending up at the same place. That tells me that the problem is senior decision-making and penny-pinching. That goes for both player and manager recruitment btw.

Our board is way more subtle about it, but there's little difference between Short and Ashley's running of the clubs. Buy cheap, sell whenever we can, let the manager take all the blame, exist solely to take TV revenue.

How isn't he im charge of player recruitment like?

Wouldn't the signings of Bridcutt and Bucklry suggest he is?

Why did he come out last week and say he could have no more excuses now?

We have a good set of players, far better than Burnley, Palace or West Brom.

Even if Congerton was in charge of transfers, Poyet stated from the outset that he was happy with that set up.

He's to blame.

They all fit within the club's buying policy - they were relatively cheap.

If he'd insisted on a £20 million player would we have signed him? No. He'd have been offered a cut price alternative or nothing.

Was Jermaine Defoe cheap?
Was Jack Rodwell cheap?

 

[not spavin]

He might not be in charge as such, but who's idea was Briductt, Buckley and Scocco?
These signings suggest he does have some say.
And if he is responsible, I remain unconvinced he knows a player.

Those are fair points.

However, there's a wider issue that the failure of Bridcutt and Buckley are so important - signing like that should be about bolstering the squad, not the first team.

What really sticks in the craw is Congerton fellating himself on SAFC.com about the panic signing of Defoe on a 3.5 year contract. He should be embarrassed about his work so far, as should anyone who have had a hand in our player recruitment. That includes Poyet.

I don't know if Poyet is any good, but what I do know is that a new manager will have to work with a set of players that were assembled largely at random, and mainly on the cheap. And, on the rare occasions we've spent money, we've had out eyes taken out by the selling club. £24m for Johnson and Rodwell. £30m+ for Altidore, Graham and Fletcher. I can't think of a team that's worse in the market than us - a fact compounded by our non-producing academy. We're badly staffed throughout the club imo. Perhaps because the focus has been on weird international partnerships that seem to have nothing whatsoever with actual football.

We could sack Poyet tomorrow, and be back here again this time next year.

 

[dirty bristow]

Those are fair points.

However, there's a wider issue that the failure of Bridcutt and Buckley are so important - signing like that should be about bolstering the squad, not the first team.

What really sticks in the craw is Congerton fellating himself on SAFC.com about the panic signing of Defoe on a 3.5 year contract. He should be embarrassed about his work so far, as should anyone who have had a hand in our player recruitment. That includes Poyet.

I don't know if Poyet is any good, but what I do know is that a new manager will have to work with a set of players that were assembled largely at random, and mainly on the cheap. And, on the rare occasions we've spent money, we've had out eyes taken out by the selling club. £24m for Johnson and Rodwell. £30m+ for Altidore, Graham and Fletcher. I can't think of a team that's worse in the market than us - a fact compounded by our non-producing academy. We're badly staffed throughout the club imo. Perhaps because the focus has been on weird international partnerships that seem to have nothing whatsoever with actual football.

We could sack Poyet tomorrow, and be back here again this time next year.

I dont believe we will be here next season as it stands, again tje dark shadow of relegation has me covered in its icy grasp

 

[sunderland ranger]

I'm not defending Poyet. I'm making the point that our recruitment policy doesn't match our manager. That has been the case since Bruce's second year in charge.

Unless our recruitment policy changes, we need to bring in a manager who's happy to polish turds, forget about cup runs and scrap survival each season.

I'm sorry but are you seriously suggesting poyet had nothing to do with Gomez bridcutt Buckley and scocco?
I agree are squad is poor but team selection tactics and motivation failings are exacerbating the problem. Needs to go.

 

[not spavin]

How isn't he im charge of player recruitment like?

Wouldn't the signings of Bridcutt and Bucklry suggest he is?

Why did he come out last week and say he could have no more excuses now?

We have a good set of players, far better than Burnley, Palace or West Brom.

Even if Congerton was in charge of transfers, Poyet stated from the outset that he was happy with that set up.

He's to blame.

So he's to blame. Let's assume that's right.

Who do we bring in who'll do better? And who makes the decision? Why do you think the people who chose Poyet will choose better this time?

Aren't we better off figuring out why we keep on coming back to the same issue, season after season?

I'm sorry but are you seriously suggesting poyet had nothing to do with Gomez bridcutt Buckley and scocco?
I agree are squad is poor but team selection tactics and motivation failings are exacerbating the problem. Needs to go.

No, I'm not saying that.

 

[sunderland ranger]

So he's to blame. Let's assume that's right.

Who do we bring in who'll do better? And who makes the decision? Why do you think the people who chose Poyet will choose better this time?

Aren't we better off figuring out why we keep on coming back to the same issue, season after season?

To do nothing isn't an option. Perform or go. He's not performing.

 

[not spavin]

I dont believe we will be here next season as it stands, again tje dark shadow of relegation has me covered in its icy grasp

It's looking pretty grim if out January business begins and ends with Defoe.

Even if Defoe recaptures his Spurs form, he'll only be good for 5 goals or so. He hasn't ever been prolific in this league.

 

[Deano]

I'm not going to spend half my life regurgitating the same list of players. They were named yesterday on another thread.

You did. Cattermole, Johnson, Larsson, O'Shea, Brown. Along with Defoe and Pantilimon, five of our best players. Not quite sure why you're picking on them when the problem clearly lies elsewhere

 

[dirty bristow]

It's looking pretty grim if out January business begins and ends with Defoe.

Even if Defoe recaptures his Spurs form, he'll only be good for 5 goals or so. He hasn't ever been prolific in this league.

Burnley, west Brom and Qpr will be licking their lips at coming to us

 

[GipseT]

you are right he should go while he can get a better job this team and scouts just suck... or

 

[not spavin]

To do nothing isn't an option. Perform or go. He's not performing.

Who would you bring in? I can't think of anyone. Pulis is good at turd polishing, I suppose. That's what we're in the market for, if we're honest with ourselves. A turd polisher who'll keep Short's TV money coming with minimum fuss.

Burnley, west Brom and Qpr will be licking their lips at coming to us

The only thing that'll save us is the amount of crap teams in the league. It's amazing that we're still just 16th, we've barely got out of 1st gear all season.

 

[Crammy Mackem]

So he's to blame. Let's assume that's right.

Who do we bring in who'll do better? And who makes the decision? Why do you think the people who chose Poyet will choose better this time?

Aren't we better off figuring out why we keep on coming back to the same issue, season after season?



No, I'm not saying that.

I'm defending no one, I appreciate what Ellis Short has done for this club, keeping us afloat in the wake of Drumavilles financial crisis and continuing to underwrite large debts while investing money as and when we can.

That doesn't meant I don't think he's made major mistakes. I don't particularly agree with a Director of Football nor some of the managerial appointments.

What can't be denied is under Poyet our style of play has been largely atrocious. It's all well and good trying to be solid to beat, but football is more than that. If we go a goal down, every one might aswell go home.

There are other managers who have done a good job, turning losing sides in to winning teams without huge investment. Look at Pulis at Palace, Dyche at Burnley, Monk at Swansea.

 

[Sweeper]

Sorry but that last bit is nonsense.

It's not like - it's spot on.

 

[not spavin]

I'm defending no one, I appreciate what Ellis Short has done for this club, keeping us afloat in the wake of Drumavilles financial crisis and continuing to underwrite large debts while investing money as and when we can.

That doesn't meant I don't think he's made major mistakes. I don't particularly agree with a Director of Football nor some of the managerial appointments.

What can't be denied is under Poyet our style of play has been largely atrocious. It's all well and good trying to be solid to beat, but football is more than that. If we go a goal down, every one might aswell go home.

There are other managers who have done a good job, turning losing sides in to winning teams without huge investment. Look at Pulis at Palace, Dyche at Burnley, Monk at Swansea.

Pulis walked because of lack of investment, Monk walked into a well run club, Burnley are below us (only just, granted).

I'm not pro-Poyet. My point is that if we sack him and think our problems are over, we're kidding ourselves. I'd rather keep Poyet and turn the focus on the rest of the set up, than sack him and pretend everything's great.