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West Indies Test Series


It’s all about opinions but averages are spread over a number of years.

I am not sure because several years ago some of when Root first started his career he scored more at 4 than 3 has too much bearing on the here and now.

I put more emphasis on form and experience and what a team needs now.

Root with his experience should and does know his game inside out so has more chance now than he may have several years ago to be successful at 3 imo.

Currently Pope is clearly struggling at 3 recently , where as Root is clearly our best player.

I am not sure how many number 3s need to fail before considering moving our best player one place in the order.
 
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Voice of fair play said:
It’s all about opinions but averages are spread over a number of years.

I am not sure because several years ago some of when Root first started his career he scored more at 4 than 3 has too much bearing on the here and now.

I put more emphasis on form and experience and what a team needs now.

Root with his experience should and does know his game inside out so has more chance now than he may have several years ago to be successful at 3 imo.

Currently Pope is clearly struggling at 3 recently , where as Root is clearly our best player.

I am not sure how many number 3s need to fail before considering moving our best player one place in the order.
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Root has batted at 3 59 times, Pope 34 times
Root didn’t do it much early in his career, he did it in tests 13, 14, 15 and then 33

That’s a significant data set
 
Voice of fair play said:
It’s all about opinions but averages are spread over a number of years.

I am not sure because several years ago some of when Root first started his career he scored more at 4 than 3 has too much bearing on the here and now.

I put more emphasis on form and experience and what a team needs now.

Root with his experience should and does know his game inside out so has more chance now than he may have several years ago to be successful at 3 imo.

Currently Pope is clearly struggling at 3 recently , where as Root is clearly our best player.

I am not sure how many number 3s need to fail before considering moving our best player one place in the order.
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Sorry marra but you arent makin much sense now and are changing the criteria

Root averaes 10 more at 4 than at 3...and Pope averages more than Root at 3, over a very smiliar number of games

No logic in moving them, it would just hurt the team.

Pope isn't failing like, he averages over 40 there.
 
MustardAndOnions said:
Sorry marra but you arent makin much sense now and are changing the criteria

Root averaes 10 more at 4 than at 3...and Pope averages more than Root at 3, over a very smiliar number of games

No logic in moving them, it would just hurt the team.

Pope isn't failing like, he averages over 40 there.
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Why is it then that people are saying he under pressure?
 
chunkyshanhawk53 said:
Root has batted at 3 59 times, Pope 34 times
Root didn’t do it much early in his career, he did it in tests 13, 14, 15 and then 33

That’s a significant data set
Click to expand...
It is tbf and think all agree his best position is 4.

But the team have been struggling at 3 for a considerable number of years now and it seems player after player is chucked in at the deep end in there and inevitably fails.

If we had good number 3s it would not even be a debate where Root bats.

For me it’s a matter of saying is Root now more capable then ever before to make that move? And is he the best option out of all the players available to bat there?

And would a possible 3 like Pope be better at 5?

And the answer to all them questions for me is yes.
 
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Voice of fair play said:
It is tbf and think all agree his best position is 4.

But the team have been struggling at 3 for a considerable number of years now and it seems player after player is chucked in at the deep end in there and inevitably fails.

If we had good number 3s it would not even be a debate where Root bats.

For me it’s a matter of saying is Root now more capable then ever before to make that move? And is he the best option out of all the players available to bat there?

And would a possible 3 like Pope be better at 5?

And the answer to all them questions for be is yes.
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How is averaging over 41 struggling at 3?
 
MustardAndOnions said:
Aye he isn't though.
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Tbf mate even if his average was lot lower you would still not move Root up as you have said that before, you would still try a untested player first.

My point is at some point a senior player should take that responsibility rather than continually throwing people in at the deep end
 
Voice of fair play said:
Tbf mate even if his average was lot lower you would still not move Root up as you have said that before, you would still try a untested player first.

My point is at some point a senior player should take that responsibility rather than continually throwing people in at the deep end
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He is the vice captain mate, played over 50 tests.

How much more senior do you want to get?

None of what you say is true here like.

If Pope cant bat here (he is doing fine btw) then he gets dropped, he isn't a kid like.

He also averaes more than Root at 3, so your point literally makes no sense.
 
Dexter said:
I know you don’t like it but Root should be batting three to protect these other lads. Ollie Pope is not a number 3, he should be at 5 with Brook at 4. I genuinely think he’d be a world beater in that position, batting three just exposes his deficiencies way too much though.
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Root has been consistently poor at three. He’s now 33 years old. He’s not suddenly going to get good at it.

I don’t really understand why he can’t do it. He seems to have the technique for it. But they’ve tried him several times there during his international career and it’s never worked. He doesn’t even have that good a track record of doing it for Yorkshire. So much of batting is in the head. It might just be that he thinks he’s a shit number three so he is a shit number three. But he’s not going to snap out of it at his age even if that’s all it is.

Pope by contrast actually has a decent record at number three compared with his overall numbers. Possibly the first to achieve that since Trott (can’t be bothered to check). He’s not got a great test record in any position. But if he is in the team at all, and as vice captain is going to be, it might as well be at three.
 
MustardAndOnions said:
Pennington supposed to be getting called up

Pressure on Pope like for me, I know he gets the odd score but he just gets too many low scores and just all over the place early in innings

India next year and then Aussies do we trust him to be consistent?
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Agree. Just not consistent enough for me a not a natural number 3. Tries to score too quickly at the start of an innings when conditions and situation need a more refined approach
 
Fleagle said:
Root has been consistently poor at three. He’s now 33 years old. He’s not suddenly going to get good at it.

I don’t really understand why he can’t do it. He seems to have the technique for it. But they’ve tried him several times there during his international career and it’s never worked. He doesn’t even have that good a track record of doing it for Yorkshire. So much of batting is in the head. It might just be that he thinks he’s a shit number three so he is a shit number three. But he’s not going to snap out of it at his age even if that’s all it is.

Pope by contrast actually has a decent record at number three compared with his overall numbers. Possibly the first to achieve that since Trott (can’t be bothered to check). He’s not got a great test record in any position. But if he is in the team at all, and as vice captain is going to be, it might as well be at three.
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Same for me

If we wanted a new number 5 it certainly wouldn’t be pope for me

It would be smith or someone younger
 
It’s quite frustrating the amount of injuries we have to bowlers I was hoping we’d get to have more of a look at this summer. I really like Josh Tongue in particular although he seems really injury prone.

Not sure if Cook is going to be available given he missed Essex’s game against Durham?

Pennington could be worth a look at. Tall and quick enough.
 
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