Vinicius Junior "feels less and less like playing..."

chunkyshanhawk53 said:
I always thought you were well meaning, if a bit of a fool.

In the last few weeks you’ve shown yourself to be a nasty old man. This, and the aspergers comment are absolutely horrible.
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It's your party, you can cry if you want to.
Comeback_Kenwyne said:
The lad tells his story in his own way in the media all the time.

And it turns out - he does want to talk about racism. That is his experience. As a person.

Seems to me that you are the one that doesn’t want to talk about him as a person. Or at least not in a way that allows him to speak, anyway.
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I never really knew much about Vini (apart from him being among the most dangerous strikers in the world) till last year after the Valencia game - which was particularly bad as they targeted him before the game. I was very sad and angry about what happened and asked a Madrid supporting friend why it was so. Like almost everyone you ask here ( pai) he said that Vinicius has a reputation for being provocative. I didn't know that as I don't watch Madrid, so I can't form my own opinion in that regard. All I say is what I've read here and heard from people here. Maybe they're all victim blaming, covert racists, but I doubt it.
joedurham said:
It's your party, you can cry if you want to.

I never really knew much about Vini (apart from him being among the most dangerous strikers in the world) till last year after the Valencia game - which was particularly bad as they targeted him before the game. I was very sad and angry about what happened and asked a Madrid supporting friend why it was so. Like almost everyone you ask here ( pai) he said that Vinicius has a reputation for being provocative. I didn't know that as I don't watch Madrid, so I can't form my own opinion in that regard. All I say is what I've read here and heard from people here. Maybe they're all victim blaming, covert racists, but I doubt it.
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Here =Spain.
 
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joedurham said:
It's your party, you can cry if you want to.

I never really knew much about Vini (apart from him being among the most dangerous strikers in the world) till last year after the Valencia game - which was particularly bad as they targeted him before the game. I was very sad and angry about what happened and asked a Madrid supporting friend why it was so. Like almost everyone you ask here ( pai) he said that Vinicius has a reputation for being provocative. I didn't know that as I don't watch Madrid, so I can't form my own opinion in that regard. All I say is what I've read here and heard from people here. Maybe they're all victim blaming, covert racists, but I doubt it.

Here =Spain.
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This would be the Valancia match where he was - in your description - racially abused before the game by neo-nazis?

And your Madrid supporting friend’s first reaction was that?

Aye, I’d f***ing say that was victim-blaming.

Spain has a f***ing problem. No wonder the lad wants out.
 
He's actually a very big fan of Vini, but like everyone else who watches the games, he admits the bloke is provocative. What is so difficult to accept that. When people say he's stirring up trouble, they're not justifying anything. They're just making an observation.
Kenwyne, do you not find his behaviour at the friendly on Tuesday a little strange. When people are seeing this continuously, what do you expect them to think?

Afaik he hasn't been racially abused since the Valencia game - people here have been sensitised to the problem by his tears on that occasion. ( I might be wrong - I don't read every Madrid match report - but I think that was the last case of racial abuse ).
 
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joedurham said:
He's actually s very big fan of Vini, but like everyone else who watches the games, he admits the bloke is provocative. What is so difficult to accept that. When people say he's stirring up trouble, they're not justifying anything. They're just making an observation.
Kenwyne, do you not find his behaviour at the friendly on Tuesday a little strange. When people are seeing this continuously, what do you expect them to think?

Afaik he hasn't been racially abused since the Valencia game - people here have been sensitised to the problem by his tears on that occasion. ( I might be wrong - I don't read every Madrid match report - but I think that was the last case of racial abuse ).
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I’ve just watched the video in the original OP.

I hadn’t watched it before.

The lad is crying and saying he just wants to play football.

I don’t know how you watch that and carry on like this.

10 times Real Madrid say he’s been targeted this year.

What I see is a young man trying to do his job and being racially abused.

I don’t care if he’s being provocative. Put me in front of a stadium racially abusing me and in the heat of an emotional game…

I’d be more than provocative. He’s probably just trying to cope in the only way he knows.

Your lack of empathy is wild.

Hope the lad leaves Spain if your depiction of it is accurate. Class player who would light up the Premier League.
 
Comeback_Kenwyne said:
I’ve just watched the video in the original OP.

I hadn’t watched it before.

The lad is crying and saying he just wants to play football.

I don’t know how you watch that and carry on like this.

10 times Real Madrid say he’s been targeted this year.

What I see is a young man trying to do his job and being racially abused.

I don’t care if he’s being provocative. Put me in front of a stadium racially abusing me and in the heat of an emotional game…

I’d be more than provocative. He’s probably just trying to cope in the only way he knows.

Your lack of empathy is wild.

Hope the lad leaves Spain if your depiction of it is accurate. Class player who would light up the Premier League.
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The last reported racial abuse of Vini was the now infamous Valencia game. Correct me if I am wrong. His tears before the friendly came as a surprise, at least to me as I thought the racist abuse had ended. I think the bloke is under pressure because of recent reports of his club being less than happy with his behaviour ,(the Leipzig game where he throttled an opponent for no apparent reason)..
 
Comeback_Kenwyne said:
This would be the Valancia match where he was - in your description - racially abused before the game by neo-nazis?

And your Madrid supporting friend’s first reaction was that?

Aye, I’d f***ing say that was victim-blaming.

Spain has a f***ing problem. No wonder the lad wants out.
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Imagine a club over here having a neo-nazi section of their support and it being dismissed as just one of those things. :lol:
 
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You aren't allowed an opinion on how someone applies themselves if they have suffered racist abuse apparently
 
DH1 said:
You aren't allowed an opinion on how someone applies themselves if they have suffered racist abuse apparently
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And your comments deliberately misconstrued. And all the Spanish are apparently racist monsters etc

I think this thread, while supposedly being about racism, throws up undertone of xenophobia.
 
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DieselBert said:
Horrid that. Poor bairns. Hope they are ok it must be dehumanising to deal with that kind of shit
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Theres no excuse for it. My wife (no) is black. Someone spat at her in morrisons and told her to go back to her own country.

Was raging as i was working away. Soon as she described the guy i knew exactly who it was.

I heard sometime later he was injured somewhat
 
jjarra_mackem said:
Theres no excuse for it. My wife (no) is black. Someone spat at her in morrisons and told her to go back to her own country.

Was raging as i was working away. Soon as she described the guy i knew exactly who it was.

I heard sometime later he was injured somewhat
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Disgusting mate, hope your wife wasn't too shaken up by that.

I'm mixed race (half black) and I've copped the odd ignorant comment or pissed up bloke having a random go, but fortunately I've never had to deal with that personally. Honestly not sure how I'd react if I did to be honest, it's vile.
 
joedurham said:
And your comments deliberately misconstrued. And all the Spanish are apparently racist monsters etc

I think this thread, while supposedly being about racism, throws up undertone of xenophobia.
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Live in a very spanish speaking but multicultural city 4 year or so and never seen anything racist except that one time at the football. Even the lads selling the sunglasses and beach towels down the front get treat with respect which, typically they are the first to get it when on holiday elsewhere across europe. Being English in spain probably gets you the most amount of stick out of any nationality but I couldn't care less about it personally cos im not a fanny :lol:
 
DH1 said:
Live in a very spanish speaking but multicultural city 4 year or so and never seen anything racist except that one time at the football. Even the lads selling the sunglasses and beach towels down the front get treat with respect which, typically they are the first to get it when on holiday elsewhere across europe. Being English in spain probably gets you the most amount of stick out of any nationality but I couldn't care less about it personally cos im not a fanny :lol:
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Andalucía?

I've never seen anything overtly racist anywhere ,- except cops beating the living daylights out of black guys on TV - but sometimes I hear comments that make you squirm.
 
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joedurham said:
Andalucía?

I've never seen anything overtly racist anywhere ,- except cops beating the living daylights out of black guys on TV - but sometimes I hear comments that make you squirm.
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Alicante, despite what people's Pre judgements are (due to benidorm being 30 mins away) it is a very Spanish speaking city without doubt.

Seen the police kick the living shit out of 5 black Swedish lads on holiday here cos they beat a Danish fan within an inch of his life after the England Denmark game. He was put on life support after, was a few year back now. Think that's cos they nearly killed the lad rather than becuase of the colour of their skin like, but you just reminded me of it.
 
DH1 said:
Alicante, despite what people's Pre judgements are (due to benidorm being 30 mins away) it is a very Spanish speaking city without doubt.

Seen the police kick the living shit out of 5 black Swedish lads on holiday here cos they beat a Danish fan within an inch of his life after the England Denmark game. He was put on life support after, was a few year back now. Think that's cos they nearly killed the lad rather than becuase of the colour of their skin like, but you just reminded me of it.
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Well, maybe they deserved a slap.
 
aupaalaves said:
You also need to remember that la liga has tried to meet with Vini Jr several times to discuss the issue and how they can work together to eradicate it. However, the player never turned up to the meetings.
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I'm sorry but I don't see how it's the responsibility of Vini Jr to discuss solutions to racism that he is the victim of.

It's la liga's responsibility to stop it and enforce punishments for the clubs and fan bases who do it.

To use a recent fan issue - would you think it reasonable for the Turkish FA to meet the Fenerbahce players to solve the problem of fans attacking them at Trabzonspor?

It's the responsibility of the clubs and the league to provide a safe environment for players and any club that can't do that should be punished.

Victims don't need to be involved to discuss "working together to eradicate it".
 
FlashGordon said:
I'm sorry but I don't see how it's the responsibility of Vini Jr to discuss solutions to racism that he is the victim of.

It's la liga's responsibility to stop it and enforce punishments for the clubs and fan bases who do it.

To use a recent fan issue - would you think it reasonable for the Turkish FA to meet the Fenerbahce players to solve the problem of fans attacking them at Trabzonspor?

It's the responsibility of the clubs and the league to provide a safe environment for players and any club that can't do that should be punished.

Victims don't need to be involved to discuss "working together to eradicate it".
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For the last time.

Vini Jr isn't being targeted for insults/abuse because of the colour of his skin. It's because of his onfield conduct which even his Madrid teammates and even president Florentino Perez aren't too happy about.

Unfortunately, the insults/abuse he receives (like many other players in every country) lead to a minority of bellends who stoop to a low level and make racist comments.

Whenever offensive or racist chants happen, La Liga fines the club involved, the club identifies the people involved, ban them and then hands them over to the authorities for prosecution.

The vast majority of Spanish fans just like English/Italian /French fans behave accordingly but sadly there's always a minority.

Racism in Spain, England, France and Italy isn't a cultural thing, It's an educational issue and goes far beyond football.
 
aupaalaves said:
For the last time.

Vini Jr isn't being targeted for insults/abuse because of the colour of his skin. It's because of his onfield conduct which even his Madrid teammates and even president Florentino Perez aren't too happy about.

Unfortunately, the insults/abuse he receives (like many other players in every country) lead to a minority of bellends who stoop to a low level and make racist comments.

Whenever offensive or racist chants happen, La Liga fines the club involved, the club identifies the people involved, ban them and then hands them over to the authorities for prosecution.

The vast majority of Spanish fans just like English/Italian /French fans behave accordingly but sadly there's always a minority.

Racism in Spain, England, France and Italy isn't a cultural thing, It's an educational issue and goes far beyond football.
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I responded specifically to your comment that Vini Jr has been invited to meetings with La Liga which he has refused to, which you seemed to think held some significance.

If La Liga fines, bans and prosecutes, why are they asking Vini Jr to attend meetings to "work together to eradicate it" and why do you think it's significant that he isn't attending?
 

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