Teachers and workloads

[Deleted member 35923]

Like nurses, teachers are being penalised for being in an industry based on caring. It's quite sad really.

Unlike nurses, the general public are quite unsympathetic towards the issues they face. As another poster mentioned, when industrial action was taken, the media were overwhelmingly against the teachers, parents certainly were (again, based on the belief that teachers have a cushy number with hours and holidays) and the government were not listening. It was pure divide and rule from Gove and the Tories and it worked a treat at the time for them.

 

[Charmless Man]

Some Kids and parents think they know better than teachers.
Some Kids think they can get away with playing up because teachers have limited disciplinary tactics.
Some parents don't back up teachers
Some parents don't discipline their kids at all and leave it to school to do it

The list goes on...

Have to say, there shouldn’t be a blanket rule that say parents must side with teachers.

I remember a particular maths teacher in year 7 who for whatever reason had it in for me - and accused me of writing graffiti on a textbook which I categorically didn’t do. She wouldn’t listen and just decided it was me based on absolutely no evidence (she didn’t even number the textbooks so she’d know who had which one).

Basically resulted in me feigning sickness for her lessons on a few occasions that year. I’d have a miraculous recovery when it was time to go to Science or English. Felt totally unable to bring it up with my parents as I suspected they’d side with the teacher (whether this is correct or not I don’t know).

Result was I was set back quite a bit in maths and it was the one subject I really struggled with. Compounded by having a very inept teacher the folllowing year who just used to face the board an write stuff on it

 

[pillars of hercules]

If only it was just the newly qualified who end up working for less than mimimum wage

Then the unions should take legal action against the employer

 

[JL1985]

Depends on what you teach. Modern Studies would be difficult as the teacher would have to keep up to date with all the latest politics and it changes virtually every day. Maths would be fairly easy, 7x7 is 49 - it was 500 years ago and will be in 500 years time, Nothing changes.

 

[The Muffin Man]

A diminishing sense of parental responsibility has a lot to answer for in making the teaching profession increasingly challenging.

Aye, when you have parents kicking off because you stay behind to give their child 1 to 1 tuition because they were struggling with a certain key maths concept in class....One parent actually said "the school is shit, if teachers did their job properly the child wouldnt have to be punished by staying on detention to do extra"........Despite explaining it was not detention and the child worked really hard but was struggling with this one concept the parents refused to let the child have any more after school help.....

This is teachers giving up their own time to focus on the needs of their child when they have maybe 400 others they teach and the reaction is anger. This extra 20 to 30 minutes tuition means getting home 20 to 30 minutes later for your own family but you do it because it matters and will help that child. Then rather than appreciation you get abused for it.

 

[The Voice Of Reason]

Ofsted have done more harm than good in my opinion

'What if we all boycotted Ofsted inspections?'

 

[The Muffin Man]

Depends on what you teach. Modern Studies would be difficult as the teacher would have to keep up to date with all the latest politics and it changes virtually every day. Maths would be fairly easy, 7x7 is 49 - it was 500 years ago and will be in 500 years time, Nothing changes.

I did a maths conversion course (upskilling to allow me to teach maths) and it has changed beyond belief......The way it is taught is completely different to the way it was taught 20 years ago and the content is far more advanced at every level.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

Unlike nurses, the general public are quite unsympathetic towards the issues they face. As another poster mentioned, when industrial action was taken, the media were overwhelmingly against the teachers, parents certainly were (again, based on the belief that teachers have a cushy number with hours and holidays) and the government were not listening. It was pure divide and rule from Gove and the Tories and it worked a treat at the time for them.

There is no need for industrial action. Teachers should just work their contracted hours. The wheels would come off the monitoring but the kids would still receive an education. (Probably a better one if the teachers could concentrate on what they went into the profession for)

 

[Tomma]

I would say the opposite is the case. Parents are much more engaged in their child's education than in the past. I would say parents expectations of their child's expected achievements is an added pressure.

I respect your opinion but can’t agree with it.
I’ve seen it change over the last 22 years in ways that are desperately worrying.
Instead of focusing 100% on learning, inspiring kids to be inquisitive and creative etc there is an increasing need for teachers to ‘parent’. Not in all cases, granted, but the lack of cultural ambition, the ability to communicate effectively, to play and to self direct is wildly lacking amongst many.
My opinion is that these skills should be learnt in the home predominantly.
Sadly the ‘being allowed play all night on your Xbox and go to the chippy for tea’ culture is worsening in my experience.

 

[The Muffin Man]

Then the unions should take legal action against the employer

They do, the public will not support industrial action and teachers get slagged off for not caring.........I was going to apply with a non teaching post recently, it meant a pay cut of thousands on what I was earning as a teacher. It was however 37 hours a week as opposed to 65 to 70.......When I worked it out it meant I was getting paid £2 an hour for the marking I did. How is it right that teachers spend more time marking than actually teaching in a normal week?

 

[MattyM 09/109]

The big concern for me though is the timing of the stage and whether it is a locked one. I think '11' is too early and I would like to see opportunities for the pupils to switch pathways dependent upon progress/motivation/aptitude.

Yeah that is my concern too BUT the point is to try to move teaching resource to where it can be best used. It means some kids are gonna be fucked over but maybe not as many as are being fucked over by being stuck in disruptive schools with overworked teachers looking after too many students of different abilities and engagement.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

I respect your opinion but can’t agree with it.
I’ve seen it change over the last 22 years in ways that are desperately worrying.
Instead of focusing 100% on learning, inspiring kids to be inquisitive and creative etc there is an increasing need for teachers to ‘parent’. Not in all cases, granted, but the lack of cultural ambition, the ability to communicate effectively, to play and to self direct is wildly lacking amongst many.
My opinion is that these skills should be learnt in the home predominantly.
Sadly the ‘being allowed play all night on your Xbox and go to the chippy for tea’ culture is worsening in my experience.

Maybe at the very low end of the scale that is the case.

 

[Tomma]

Aye, when you have parents kicking off because you stay behind to give their child 1 to 1 tuition because they were struggling with a certain key maths concept in class....One parent actually said "the school is shit, if teachers did their job properly the child wouldnt have to be punished by staying on detention to do extra"........Despite explaining it was not detention and the child worked really hard but was struggling with this one concept the parents refused to let the child have any more after school help.....

This is teachers giving up their own time to focus on the needs of their child when they have maybe 400 others they teach and the reaction is anger. This extra 20 to 30 minutes tuition means getting home 20 to 30 minutes later for your own family but you do it because it matters and will help that child. Then rather than appreciation you get abused for it.

I agree fully and share the experience.
I’m sure like you I could quote many a tale, but the one that sticks in my mind is recently having to buy a kid breakfast before they went into an exam.

 

[The Muffin Man]

There is no need for industrial action. Teachers should just work their contracted hours. The wheels would come off the monitoring but the kids would still receive an education. (Probably a better one if the teachers could concentrate on what they went into the profession for)

The contract is very clever. It states something along the lines of "31.5 hours per week plus whatever is needed outside of those hours to fulfill the requirements of the role"

If you worked your 31.5 hours you would be banged through competency procedures and sacked within a term.

 

[Tomma]

Maybe at the very low end of the scale that is the case.

It’s not as low as many would think. I’m afraid it’s starting to become the norm rather than the exception.

 

[pillars of hercules]

Unlike nurses, the general public are quite unsympathetic towards the issues they face. As another poster mentioned, when industrial action was taken, the media were overwhelmingly against the teachers, parents certainly were (again, based on the belief that teachers have a cushy number with hours and holidays) and the government were not listening. It was pure divide and rule from Gove and the Tories and it worked a treat at the time for them.

I get that. That's why I suggested an assessment of how many hours you actually do, obviously include the time spent of filling out the assessment .

From a parent's point of view any strike action disrupts their lives so you're obviously not going to get sympathy going down that route. Working to rule would be a better answer, stopping back for an hour after school hours then everyone leaving at the same time, doing nothing else until the next day. Its slower but would bring the system to it's knees without pissing off the people who you really need support from.

 

[The Muffin Man]

I agree fully and share the experience.
I’m sure like you I could quote many a tale, but the one that sticks in my mind is recently having to buy a kid breakfast before they went into an exam.

Aye, that and washing kids uniform in school, providing showers and deodorants because parents wont/cant pay for them and the child is getting grief off other kids for stinking, we have done the lot.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

The contract is very clever. It states something along the lines of "31.5 hours per week plus whatever is needed outside of those hours to fulfill the requirements of the roll"

If you worked your 31.5 hours you would be banged through competency procedures and sacked within a term.

Do you opt out of the Working Hours directive? What are the expected levels of hours needed to fulfil the role?

The Contract expects you to work 70 hours a week? This would be illegal and open to challenge surely?

It’s not as low as many would think. I’m afraid it’s starting to become the norm rather than the exception.

Bairn went to a large Newcastle comp and the lids were fine.

 

[Deleted member 35923]

Depends on what you teach. Modern Studies would be difficult as the teacher would have to keep up to date with all the latest politics and it changes virtually every day. Maths would be fairly easy, 7x7 is 49 - it was 500 years ago and will be in 500 years time, Nothing changes.

This is genuinely meant with absolutely no disrespect to you whatsoever, but this post probably highlights the lack of awareness of what is required in the teaching profession.

 

[pillars of hercules]

They do, the public will not support industrial action and teachers get slagged off for not caring.........I was going to apply with a non teaching post recently, it meant a pay cut of thousands on what I was earning as a teacher. It was however 37 hours a week as opposed to 65 to 70.......When I worked it out it meant I was getting paid £2 an hour for the marking I did. How is it right that teachers spend more time marking than actually teaching in a normal week?

It's not. I dont actually believe teachers should be marking. Someone else should be paid to do it. I think we should have a massive investment in education.