rentaghost
Striker
You won’t find one person on here saying Rafiq has done no wrong. That’s your narrative.
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Racism at Yorkshire CCC
- Thread starter Silly Point
- Start date
The Great MES
Striker
Had a grim conversation today before the match with some of my mates who brought up what Rafiq had said 10 years ago, basically saying that cos he wasn't exactly a saint then it more or less cancels out all the shit he's had to put up with. It's as if a few stupid comments he made is tit for tat the institutialined racism that's gone on for years.
Silly Point
Striker
Had a bit of an awkward conversation with my grandad earlier, who didn't understand why the P word was offensive. I guess he's 80 odd though and not really the sort of person we should be educating for future.
Cee Jay
Striker
The racist thickies don’t quite get that.
Mackem DJ
Striker
Good point. Similarly if you say something off the cuff amongst loved ones, to those you trust (as I believe Rafiq has done), that you’d be aghast if the wider world knew you’d said, does that make you true racist? What do youze reckon?
IE if you used a slur for a chinese takeaway for example (I dont even like Chinese tbf) to the Mrs or your pal, does that make you a racist?
When he was 24 said he wanted ‘to kiss’ a bird who was texting him who (had told him she) was 17. It’s an absolute f***ing non story
. Sorry like but it is. Blatant attempt to discredit him.
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The Great MES
Striker
Its scary the amount of people who think that cos of what he said 10 years ago equates to what has gone on in the game for however amount of years. So they're both squits.
rentaghost
Striker
There also seems to be a narrative that Rafiq had publically called out various individuals as racist and it was hypocritical for him to do so given that he has sent racist messages in the past. However if YCCC had done their job properly none of these names would ever have come out in public.
1) Rafiq had suffered years of racial abuse day in day out. He had enough and made an official complaint. His main issue was with Gale, Arthur and Moxon who had contributed but as leaders had let in continue. It was under their watch. His complaint initially wasn’t listened to
2) When it got to the stage if the official enquiry Rafiq was claiming YCCC was institutionally racist. Rafiq had to produce his 57 page report which many have now read and obviously had to outline the examples of when he had been racially abused and by who. If the inquiry had done its job properly the names of Ballance, MV, Lloyd etc wouldn’t have seen the light of day. Their own inquiry unsurprisingly found out that they were not.l institutionally racist and in fact nobody had done anything worthy of a sanction.
3) Rafiq had nothing to gain by stories coming out about individuals but YCCC did. It pushed a narrative that certain individuals said bad things rather than it being centred around the organisation being institutionally racist itself.
4) It was the actions of YCCC and their failure to investigate properly that led to the parliamentary committee meeting where Rafiq told his story by then a lot of what he said then had already been leaked.
1) Rafiq had suffered years of racial abuse day in day out. He had enough and made an official complaint. His main issue was with Gale, Arthur and Moxon who had contributed but as leaders had let in continue. It was under their watch. His complaint initially wasn’t listened to
2) When it got to the stage if the official enquiry Rafiq was claiming YCCC was institutionally racist. Rafiq had to produce his 57 page report which many have now read and obviously had to outline the examples of when he had been racially abused and by who. If the inquiry had done its job properly the names of Ballance, MV, Lloyd etc wouldn’t have seen the light of day. Their own inquiry unsurprisingly found out that they were not.l institutionally racist and in fact nobody had done anything worthy of a sanction.
3) Rafiq had nothing to gain by stories coming out about individuals but YCCC did. It pushed a narrative that certain individuals said bad things rather than it being centred around the organisation being institutionally racist itself.
4) It was the actions of YCCC and their failure to investigate properly that led to the parliamentary committee meeting where Rafiq told his story by then a lot of what he said then had already been leaked.
Comeback_Kenwyne
Striker
Many people will look for any excuse not to confront the difficult truths of institutional, systemic racism that requires change.
Great post.
He has said many times he didn't want it to be about calling out individuals. Yorkshire hung some of the individuals - Ballance especially comes to mind - to dry to try and deflect the focus from themselves, which is by far the main event.
I think this is fair too. The coparison is Rafiq v Robinson. They are pretty close to equivalents.
Defend Robinson? Should mean you defend Rafiq.
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Erm, yes as only a racist (or at best, an ignorant person) would ever think to use a slur. Often, it is the language people use in such private family settings which reveals the most about their character.
Mackem DJ
Striker
Sound.
GordonMuchallNo1Fan
Striker
Disagree. Robinson isn't going around branding folk racist/shouting loud wanting to change things.
rentaghost
Striker
Good point. Similarly if you say something off the cuff amongst loved ones, to those you trust (as I believe Rafiq has done), that you’d be aghast if the wider world knew you’d said, does that make you true racist? What do youze reckon?
IE if you used a slur for a chinese takeaway for example (I dont even like Chinese tbf) to the Mrs or your pal, does that make you a racist?
When he was 24 said he wanted ‘to kiss’ a bird who was texting him who (had told him she) was 17. It’s an absolute f***ing non story
. Blatant attempt to discredit him.
Robinson hasn’t been the victim of absolutely horrendous systematic day to day racism and it was YCCC that leaked the stories re Ballance, Vaughan etc. so how can you have more sympathy fir Robinson who has done the same as Rafiq but not had to go through the horrendous experiences that Rafiq has? Whatever you type as a reply deep down only you knows the answer to that.
What an absurd take
GordonMuchallNo1Fan
Striker
You're again trying to play the race card. What has happened with Rafiq is disgusting, I've been very vocal how it has been handled but he hasn't helped himself at all with his posts about Jewish people. If Robinson prior to this coming out started some anti racism campaign then his posts came to the public attention I'd say "what a knacker...". Had the Jewish posts been the only thing to this, I'd have defended Rafiq no problem. He's done some good things calling it out but has let himself down massively in my opinion. I hope to see change but I don't forsee him been at the forefront of that campaign now.
rentaghost
Striker
Rafiq didn’t really start an anti race campaign he made a complaint about the vile abuse he had received over years and how it hadn’t been dealt with by YCCC. Because no one listened he has had to take another route through social media, Charles dobell etc just to get heard. In fact if YCCC had handled his complaint properly none of us would ever have heard of the roles of MV, Ballance, Bresnan, Lloyd, Hakes etc. It would have been sorted out as it should have been fairly for Rafiq. I do agree with your last para re him not being at the forefront and like Robinson and he has to deal with his mistakes of the past and be a better person in the future. I just don’t understand you being much more sympathetic to Robinson who has done the same as Rafiq but hasn’t had the same horrendous experiences.
Tadger
Striker
Agreed.
People using this as an excuse to discredit the historical instances of racism are doing so cynically.
If the man himself turns out to be a creepy fucker all it does it harm the messenger rather than the message.
Ive told jokes about Jews before. I’m not anti-Semitic.
No more than I’m a nonce for telling jokes about Jimmy Savile.
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Tadger
Striker
I’ve said terrible shit over the years among mates. I meant none of it.
I just don’t see the point in raking over peoples historic private conversations. It serves no purpose other than to extort grovelling apologies to satisfy people who view getting outraged as some kind of hobby.
This is of course assuming that it wasn’t criminal behaviour or harassment.
Comeback_Kenwyne
Striker
Because he hasn't been the victim of ten years worth of racism.
Are we seriously saying that only those who are pure as the driven snow have the right to kick off about being the victim of some of the stuff Rafiq had experienced? Or that only people who are never hypocritical are allowed to speak on topics?!
I guess the utter silence from everyone would be a silver lining, but this a f***ing absurd position.
Thought experiment time. Invert it: imagine if Robinson were not picked for England now, not picked for rest of his career. Nobody knew why, he kept racking up the wickets in the county game. And then it turned out that this was because the suits at the ECB had an agenda against him because of the embarrassment it had caused them. And loads of high profile people, England captains etc. were in on it.
That would be unfair and discriminatory behaviour. Would we say - sorry Ollie, you can't kick off about it because you sent some racist tweets when you were a bairn?! Would we fuck..
I don't necessarily disagree with this tbf, but it's a fine line between this position and the momentum being lost, or Yorkshire getting even remotely off the hook. And Rafiq still deserves all the tribunal money that is almost certainly coming his way, and the likes of Vaughan etc. still deserve their punishments.
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There's so much what about shit thrown around these days it appears that two wrongs do indeed now make a right
