Poll: so should it have been a penalty?

[Exapno Mapcase]

If the ref had any doubts it wasn't a pen. He watched it umpteen times and then turned back to check again. He had doubts so no pen. But these things have happened already in this tournament. Think it was the Spain v Russia game or somebody else, maybe Portugal vIran when the pen was questionable but given after VAR. They have to justify the technology and if the ref is told to look he already knows those scrutinising him think it's a pen

 

[Pseudonym Number 1]

82 people so far showing that they haven't got a clue about the games rules.

 

[rapscallion]

The Ghana official looked the better but had two games or so and then ghosted, but todays gadgy missed an evident corner, as well.

I say yes anyway.
I'm not keen on wingnut Perisic on my telly.

 

[happy feet]

Yes, his arm went to the ball.

 

[Jack Torrance]

It shouldn't be really. It has to be deliberate. How many times do you see a player deliberately handle the ball in a game? Once in a blue moon.

Agreed but then there is a set of guidelines that the refs are told to look out for stuff like unnatural position of arm, distance ball has travelled etc. It needs a lot more clarification

 

[DufraisFTM]

Agreed but then there is a set of guidelines that the refs are told to look out for stuff like unnatural position of arm, distance ball has travelled etc. It needs a lot more clarification

It definitely needs more clarification. I've just posted the laws and it specifically says the position of the hand does not necessarily mean an offence so I'm not sure where this unnatural position thing comes from.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

82 people so far showing that they haven't got a clue about the games rules.

Tell me the rule.

Quote it

 

[Onlyfoolsrushin]

Nope but I don't blame the ref. I think the handball rule is the most ambiguous rule in football

I don't believe the law is ambiguous, its pretty straightforward, it is personal interpretation which makes it difficult, as shown by the poll. Its a law decided by opinion.

 

[AC Mack]

did croatia gain an advantage from it?......... probably

If the ball strikes you on the arm from 1 yard at a 100mph you might gain an advantage. That doesn't make it a penalty.

 

[Daniels]

Yes clearly bats he ball away. It’s hand to ball not ball to hand.

 

[AC Mack]

I agree, I think Perisic knew what he was doing. You might say it's harsh but it shows you can't take these risks these days with VAR...which is a good thing.

He didn't take a risk, the ball just hit his arm. If VAR/a ref is going to penalise you for that then you're screwed.

 

[Uncle D]

Proves that var doesn't work.

 

[AC Mack]

Eh?
It says "deliberate" which is pretty clear to me



Then it wasnt a penalty

I'm with you that it wasn't a penalty, but the 'deliberate' wording shouldn't be taking quite so literally. There are some other factors to consider.

 

[MunkyHeed]

Don't think his hand was in a natural position. Pen for me.

The law around 'deliberate' is daft and needs changing though. Who ever 'deliberately' handles the ball in the penalty area?!

I think the law should be around whether the ball gets deflected off the arm denying a goalscoring opportunity. Irrelevant whether deliberate, in a natural position or anything (unless it's 100% by your side, or held behind the back like defenders are doing now).

 

[ScottishMack]

Definitely not a penalty. Don’t know what the ref was thinking! Shame for Croatia, they did really well and maybe if they did not need to chase the game they wouldn’t have been picked off on the counter. It was a game changer.

 

[Deleted member 6694]

I thought he brought his hand down on it when he realised that Umtiti had missed it. One particular angle made it look fairly blatant. Not sure it's 'clear and obvious' but it's far from the howler that people are saying either imo.

It was Matuidi who was in front of him

Here are 3 of the rules relevant to this incident as the 4th and 5th are nowt to do with it. Page 98 here https://football-technology.fifa.com/media/1245/lotg_17_18_en.pdf

1. the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
2. the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
3. the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an offence

Perisic jumps up with both his arms in the air and then his arms naturally drop simultaneously so is it really breaking rule 1 given his arm was moving in the direction you'd expect after jumping? Go back and watch Matuidi's arms as they swing in exactly the same way as he also put both arm up to jump and then swung them down naturally.

Given that just about everyone would have expected Matuidi to get the header then there is no way you'd expect the ball to continue the path it did so it was an unexpected ball at short distance and in just a few milliseconds of time for rule 2.

So isn't so all this talk about deliberate etc is a load of shite? Many have missed the fact (as shown in the replay behind the line where the linesman stands for a penna) that Perisic shut his eyes just as the ball got to Matuidi. How can it be deliberate when he could barely even see where the ball was going after the expected header didn't even happen?

If anyone was going to handle the ball deliberately in Perisic's position (given real time speed, not some misleading slow mo making it look like he had seconds) then they'd have left a hanging arm up in air to block the expected header. Now again add in that Perisic closed his eyes and flinched before the ball hit his hand then can you really say that it should have been a penna?

If that was against England then I'm pretty sure this poll would be high 90's for no.

 

[MCFC]

Yes.. Not that I think he actually aimed to handball it

 

[Jack Torrance]

It definitely needs more clarification. I've just posted the laws and it specifically says the position of the hand does not necessarily mean an offence so I'm not sure where this unnatural position thing comes from.

You hear pundits and commentators mention it all the time but you're right its not in the rules.
The penalty today was harsh but there's been worse handballs given in the tournament

 

[TexasMackem]

If the ref had any doubts it wasn't a pen. He watched it umpteen times and then turned back to check again. He had doubts so no pen. But these things have happened already in this tournament. Think it was the Spain v Russia game or somebody else, maybe Portugal vIran when the pen was questionable but given after VAR. They have to justify the technology and if the ref is told to look he already knows those scrutinising him think it's a pen

It had all the hallmarks of a classic Howard Webb performance. I mentioned it in the match thread.

Before the Greizmann free kick which lead to the first goal, there was an incident where he clearly gave France the advantage following a foul on one of their players, but Croatia won it back and had an effort on goal themselves - which he allowed. France were furious, but in true Howard Webb style, he 'evened things up' with the poor free kick decision.

The penalty decision showed a lack of control by the referee, but favour was eventually given to the bigger side. I can't accept that a deliberate handball decision was correct considering how close the France player was and what's at stake. Not in a million years for me.

 

[hillbilly]

Stone cold pen for me, hand to ball and Persic is an ugly twat.