Andy Burnham

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mackemquaker said:
People are not simply dying because people are breaking the rules everywhere. Saying that might make you feel good to blame everyone. I'd love you to give an appraisal of why The Black Death wiped out a third of Europe. Probably reckon it was because of mediaeval peasants not following the rules.
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People are breaking the rules and that is why people are dying.

You will not catch this disease if you follow the rules. Wear your mask in public. Social distance from anybody not in your household. Wash your hands. Don't touch your face.

Easy. If you do those three things please explain how you can catch the disease.

Whether or not the person who dies broke the rules is debatable and unprovable. But people breaking the rules is the key problem.
 


Punished is maybe the wrong word but the gov clearly want to put a negative spin on burnham simply because he had a legitimate stand against their policy in October

burnham has generally been supportive of gov action for covid especially early on.

It’s worth noting the gov essentially implemented all the support he campaigned for when the restrictions went nationwide
 
Brian Griffin said:
People are breaking the rules and that is why people are dying.

You will not catch this disease if you follow the rules. Wear your mask in public. Social distance from anybody not in your household. Wash your hands. Don't touch your face.

Easy. If you do those three things please explain how you can catch the disease.

Whether or not the person who dies broke the rules is debatable and unprovable. But people breaking the rules is the key problem.
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People don't care, I notice more and more not wearing masks anymore. Social distancing is a thing of the past now.

They'll sharp care when someone in the family dies or they lose their job when lockdown part 3 comes in the new year.
 
Jap Stammer said:
You sure about that? I don't think it's quite that cut and dried.

It's an airborne virus - you could follow all the rules you like but still catch it if you happen to walk into a patch of air where it's lingering.
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If you're wearing your mask indoors you'd be very unlucky.

Outdoors is it even possible?
 
Brian Griffin said:
If you're wearing your mask indoors you'd be very unlucky.

Outdoors is it even possible?
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The masks don't stop everything - either breathing in or out - they merely mitigate the risk.

Chances of picking it up outdoors are massively reduced but not impossible.

It's not as easy as saying 'follow the rules and you'll be ok'. Effectively, you're saying that everyone, literally everyone, who has caught Covid has done so because they didn't follow the rules, and that's not right.
 
Tin Soldier said:
We are being punished here in Manchester because he stood up to the Govt. Liverpool rates now higher and rising but because they cowed to demands stay in T2. Many pubs there flout the ‘substantial’ meals rule to get people in to drink. They provide a menu to sit with !!
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The rate in Greater Manchester is 158 per 100,000. The rate in all of Tyne and Wear (bar South Tyneside) is less than that and we are in tier 3.

Bristol got put in tier 2 with a rate of 120. If that was the target you were well short. That's facts not bias.
 
Keith S30S said:
The rate in Greater Manchester is 158 per 100,000. The rate in all of Tyne and Wear (bar South Tyneside) is less than that and we are in tier 3.

Bristol got put in tier 2 with a rate of 120. If that was the target you were well short. That's facts not bias.
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What's the over 60's figures Keith?
I thought that the over 60's catching and dying from it were also forming part of the reason that we are still in tier 3 alongside the capacity of the hospitals to keep up with the admittance of Covid cases.
 
I bet it raised a few eyebrows when I scouser went to become leader in Manchester but he’s really fought the corner and reasonably well too. Don’t think we will ever see an elected leader of the country with a regional accent mind but he’s better than Starmer
 
cornish mackem said:
I bet it raised a few eyebrows when I scouser went to become leader in Manchester but he’s really fought the corner and reasonably well too. Don’t think we will ever see an elected leader of the country with a regional accent mind but he’s better than Starmer
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I think Mancs and Lancastrians who traditionally dislike scousers know a good man when they see one - they ll forgive !
 
Brian Griffin said:
People are breaking the rules and that is why people are dying.

You will not catch this disease if you follow the rules. Wear your mask in public. Social distance from anybody not in your household. Wash your hands. Don't touch your face.

Easy. If you do those three things please explain how you can catch the disease.

Whether or not the person who dies broke the rules is debatable and unprovable. But people breaking the rules is the key problem.
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Were the thousands who died in care homes breaking the rules? 20% approx of Covid patients in hospital who caught it did so in hospital, were they all breaking the rules or was it the nurses and other hospital staff breaking the rules? was the spouse who got it off their other half while sleeping together breaking the rules? It's very insulting and naive to think you can only catch it if you break the rules. If someone catches HIV have they broken some rules? By your definition if someone is really ill with flu they must have broken some sacred rule.
 
Keith S30S said:
The rate in Greater Manchester is 158 per 100,000. The rate in all of Tyne and Wear (bar South Tyneside) is less than that and we are in tier 3.

Bristol got put in tier 2 with a rate of 120. If that was the target you were well short. That's facts not bias.
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Most of Greater Manchester ( central / south ) is round about Bristol levels. Burnham wanted to split into boroughs IF the whole of Manchester was not moved to Tier 2 .

I live in Stockport (Tier 3) - and can get on a train and 2 minutes later be in East Cheshire (Tier 2) - which actually has a higher rate than us.
 
Keith S30S said:
The rate in Greater Manchester is 158 per 100,000. The rate in all of Tyne and Wear (bar South Tyneside) is less than that and we are in tier 3.

Bristol got put in tier 2 with a rate of 120. If that was the target you were well short. That's facts not bias.
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It’s not just numbers, the ability of the system to cope in an area influences tiers too.
we wouldn’t need anywhere near the numbers you have elsewhere down here. We have one and a bit hospitals with little capacity. We would saturate the system very quickly with our higher than average age too
 
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SteveB said:
Most of Greater Manchester ( central / south ) is round about Bristol levels. Burnham wanted to split into boroughs IF the whole of Manchester was not moved to Tier 2 .

I live in Stockport (Tier 3) - and can get on a train and 2 minutes later be in East Cheshire (Tier 2) - which actually has a higher rate than us.
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Burnham doesn't get to decide just like we didn't. The bottom line is it was marginal and they've erred on the side of caution. With the Christmas 5 day thing around the corner it's probably the correct call.
 
Keith S30S said:
Burnham doesn't get to decide just like we didn't. The bottom line is it was marginal and they've erred on the side of caution. With the Christmas 5 day thing around the corner it's probably the correct call.
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The gov know they have mis calculated the 5 day Christmas window but won’t admit a mistake . The unfortunate consequence is that they now don’t believe they have any scope to downgrade any tiers which is a bit underwhelming for areas which have made huge improvements in their case numbers and were promised less restrictions if lower cases delivered
 
box2box said:
The gov know they have mis calculated the 5 day Christmas window but won’t admit a mistake . The unfortunate consequence is that they now don’t believe they have any scope to downgrade any tiers which is a bit underwhelming for areas which have made huge improvements in their case numbers and were promised less restrictions if lower cases delivered
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The 4 nations of the UK have all allowed Xmas to go ahead even though 2 are planning lockdowns.

The reason is they all know they can't stop or police people gathering at Xmas. If they tried they'd make themselves look both powerless and stupid.
 
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