Conning the ref

[Peel Street Massif]

Completely agree with the OP.

Some rule change will come in to stop the nonsense UFC holding we are seeing in the penalty box and then everyone will moan, but the rules only come in because the players are pushing things to the extreme

 

[Pussfella]

I'm sorry, but they've got access to video replays with thousands of camera angles for every single decision, and they are still making a pigs ear of it.

They are incompetent from top to bottom, the lot of them.

Be like giving someone a calculator for basic addition and then blaming the numbers for being difficult ones to add up.

 

[me is back]

Post match VAR review looking for blatant cheating. Instant one match ban for clear and obvious cases - holding your head when no one went near it etc

 

[forever changes]

The two captains on Saturday were consistently in the ear of the ref. It was relentless

 

[me is back]

Also, how about no attackers allowed in the 6 yard box until after the corner is kicked. Stop this stupid keeper blocking

 

[Voice of fair play]

Seems pretty simplistic to me, working in ideals. Id probably look beyond why folks are shop lifting and robbing cars rather than just blaming them.

Other sports have officials that do not condone bending rules so less rules get bent despite it still be attempted, football officials are unable to stop rules being bent so they're often bent. Imo ofc.

Officials in other sports don’t have to condone or not condone it,because they happen a lot lot less in the first place because the culture miles better.

Officials don’t have to stop cheating in the first place in Golf, snooker, Darts etc because it doesn’t happen as much if at all.

And if it did the sport within itself would condemn it.

Not only does football not condemn it, it actively encourages it, and then has the cheek to blame officials for not stopping it.

I genuinely think it a ridiculous and unfair culture

 

[Sallycinamon]

The only people who can stop the cheating is the referees themselves.
Take a firm hand & play to the rules, the players would soon conform.
Foul language is a sending off offence - start with that one.

So the authorities can’t clamp down on it? Bring in retrospective bans?

Who would be criticised the most if there was 12 yellows, 3 reds and 4 penalties in a game on Sunday?

They don't have a dive button in FIFA, but they did in other games 20 years ago, so by that criteria, it's got a lot better.

As for the knives stuff, just wow.


That's an officiating thing as opposed to a player though, give penalties and cards, it'll soon stop.


It's been said since time began. Players have a responsibility to win football games; officials have a responsibility to enforce the laws of the game.

I hate that penalty thing as well, as well as the time wasting they do, but I want my keeper doing it if it works.

Here’s the scenario. 2-1 up next Sunday against Chelsea, a win ensures a top 7 finish and European football next season, anything less and it’s 10th. Chelsea awarded a pen for holding in the box at a corner. Roefs, already on a yellow for time-wasting, does his best to put Palmer off with gamesmanship. Ref issues a second yellow and sends Roefs off. Ballard has to go in goal, Palmer scores, ends 2-2 and the dream of Europe is gone.

Would you be happy with this? After all, the ref’s just done what you wanted him to do…

In golf, professionals attempt to cheat. In cricket, professionals attempt to cheat. In rugby, you get the picture. Difference is the level of officiating and consequence. You could argue that football is far more difficult to officiate, I couldnt say as im far from knowledgeable in those sports but I imagine that has its part to play in football officials getting blamed.

Im saying its footballers job to win the game within the given rules, if those rules are not enforced, i dont blame players or clubs for taking advantage.

You’ve got a very strange view on the subject mate, suppose it comes down to the morals of each individual commenting.

Football is the only sport where widespread cheating is ignored and in some instances condoned. There might be rare, isolated incidents in golf or cricket but they are immediately frowned upon, dealt with and nipped in the bud - severe bans are imposed on the culprits and the competitors are fully aware of this. Other sports are far more sporting and respect is shown by sportsmen competing. There’s pretty much no respect in football.

Post match VAR review looking for blatant cheating. Instant one match ban for clear and obvious cases - holding your head when no one went near it etc

The aspect which annoys me the most is when a player wins an appeal against a straight red for striking someone, yet nothing happens to the other player, who they are admitting cheated. O’Nein and Ivan Toney, when he was at Peterborough, springs to mind. Straight red for O’Nein for pushing him in the face, Toney went down holding his face. O’Nein appealed, video footage showed he didn’t touch his face, so he wins the appeal. Why is there no punishment for Toney?

 

[Coeus]

Officials in other sports don’t have to condone or not condone it,because they happen a lot lot less in the first place because the culture miles better.

Officials don’t have to stop cheating in the first place in Golf, snooker, Darts etc because it doesn’t happen as much if at all.

And if it did the sport within itself would condemn it.

Not only does football not condemn it, it actively encourages it, and then has the cheek to blame officials for not stopping it.

I genuinely think it a ridiculous and unfair culture

I understand you think that; I am merely suggesting it's self-perpetuating. It wouldn't happen in football if they did not allow it. That's down to the officials and lawmakers, the same as it is in other sports.

You’ve got a very strange view on the subject mate, suppose it comes down to the morals of each individual commenting.

Football is the only sport where widespread cheating is ignored and in some instances condoned. There might be rare, isolated incidents in golf or cricket but they are immediately frowned upon, dealt with and nipped in the bud - severe bans are imposed on the culprits and the competitors are fully aware of this. Other sports are far more sporting and respect is shown by sportsmen competing. There’s pretty much no respect in football.

Strange from your perspective, that's fine. I'd say yours was more childlike, as is your suggestion of morals.

 

[Voice of fair play]

I understand you think that; I am merely suggesting it's self-perpetuating. It wouldn't happen in football if they did not allow it. That's down to the officials and lawmakers, the same as it is in other sports.


Strange from your perspective, that's fine. I'd say yours was more childlike, as is your suggestion of morals.

I get what you saying mate but officials have enough to do on the field.

It’s up to those off the field to change the culture the law makers and the clubs themselves.

 

[soapster]

This attitude is the problem in my opinion.

Edit: you did say ‘within reason’ which I do agree with. Grappling etc is fine as it’s a contact sport and that’s for the ref to decide, but I think we can allow that without accepting all the pathetic conning thay goes on. I think we all know the difference.

problem is the authorities have made it harder for refs to apply the rules. How is a ref supposed to asses as to how consistent a pull is. How can the asses a shirt pull. how can they asses grappling in the box.

should be a rule to say-no holding the person. no shirt pulling at all. no grappling.

i used to get annoyed in championship, when you often seen the opposition defence line up to foul our players. often you would seen their back four or five all being yellow carded. often because our wingers especially would try to fight off a pull back and get away from the fouling defender, the ref very often played on. meaning that defender was allowed to play on without punishment. whereas if a player went to ground at slightest touch the defender was booked.

as said before some players are cheats. take fernandez on saturday after the forearm touch by our player, fernandez held 3 separate parts of his head as he dropped his arms and then replaced them again.

the media must also take a part of the blame. they are not consistant. they highlight things on a editorial basis. I think on match of the day, the commentary was so biased. their keeper made tremendous saves whereas roufes body got in the road.

when you allow slip to happen it often gets worse and worse. when you present allow a line not to be crossed and you punish offenders, players generally will not cross that line.

 

[Redandwhitedust]

Ive said for a while, in a game where players have stats for everything from "aerial duels won" and "distance covered". We should have stats for "total game delay" and call it "time spent cheating"

No player wants to be top of that league and I bet youd see players jumping up after tackles rather than punching the floor and rolling around grabbing body parts that werent touched.

The way you define injury/feigning is based entirely on when they get up. If the physio deems they need treatment they go off field to be treated for the minimum of time they spent on the floor. If its a real injury they wont mind and manager can bring on a sub. No time is added to their cheating stats.

If the player gets up and doesnt need treatment. The time is added to their stat for cheating.

Something has to be done to stop these players punching the floor and yelling and delaying the game over absolutely nowt

 

[Dobbler]

I know the refereeing has been poor this season, but one thing that seems to be underemphasised is the rampant cheating that’s going on. It’s a hard enough job as it is, but when you throw in the cheating it’s hardly surprising standards are so poor. Seems like the football world is keen to bemoan refereeing standards and VAR, when if players just played like men and didn’t try and con the ref I’m sure standards would be a lot better.

Hardly a hot take but it does me head in how much we just accept the dark arts.

It’s not new but it is shite..

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

Completely agree with the OP.

Some rule change will come in to stop the nonsense UFC holding we are seeing in the penalty box and then everyone will moan, but the rules only come in because the players are pushing things to the extreme

I've said the same for ages since it's been an issue they need to change the rule as I said this in August 2024 and it's even worse now!

I wish they'd change the rule about corners and the ball not being in play so nowt can happen. That should be a free kick to West Ham with the shirt pull on Antonio. It just wastes time when the ref stops the corner and then tells the players to behave.

Just start giving pennas or free kicks and all the pushing/shoving/shirt pulling/holding would soon be reduced. It's a farce at times when the ref has to go over as yet again tell players to stop doing it. When the ball is placed in the quadrant then a 'foul' can be given would soon change things and the same for free kicks anarl.

Danny Murphy said the same thing just recently and it's a simple rule change that the ball is deemed in play when the ball is placed on the quadrant. That means any pulling/pushing etc can be penalised without the ref having to go over. It will drastically reduce defenders or attackers fouling each other just before the kick is taken and gaining an advantage from not being penalised as the ball wasn't in play. That's why they do it as they don't get penalised and it's now become a tactic and Arsenal are one of the better teams doing it.

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How long will it take them to realise how it would cut down on the shit that goes on every game and without fail a ref always going over "to have a word". I'm not sure how Murphy didn't know about the ball not being in play until this season but then again, it's Danny Murphy

 

[AC Mack]

In golf, professionals attempt to cheat. In cricket, professionals attempt to cheat. In rugby, you get the picture. Difference is the level of officiating and consequence. You could argue that football is far more difficult to officiate, I couldnt say as im far from knowledgeable in those sports but I imagine that has its part to play in football officials getting blamed.

Im saying its footballers job to win the game within the given rules, if those rules are not enforced, i dont blame players or clubs for taking advantage.

I really hope you don't take that approach in your every day life.

It’s like blaming the police for not been good enough to stop the shoplifters, car robbers etc rather than blaming the people actually doing it in the first place??

Not just blaming the police, but the attitude seems pretty much telling them to crack on so long as they don't get caught.

 

[Coeus]

I really hope you don't take that approach in your every day life.


Not just blaming the police, but the attitude seems pretty much telling them to crack on so long as they don't get caught.

What approach?

And why would you really hope it?

 

[ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK]

Also, how about no attackers allowed in the 6 yard box until after the corner is kicked. Stop this stupid keeper blocking

See the video in post #93 above at 5 mins as it's mentioned. This is just a huge can of worms as players can lean into the 6 yard box etc and it would be an even worse version of offside and a lot more often and more to check.

Plus they can simply go into the box once the ball is kicked. Bear in mind that Pablo was just inside the 6 yard line yet still ended up challenging Raya for the ball and fouling him. That assistant referee on MOTD Sunday who suggested it clearly didn't have a clue what he was suggesting and it's baffling that the BBC & MOTD gave him that platform to suggest it.

Simple rule, ball is in play when on the quadrant and no ref going over to have a word, he just gives what he sees. Once a few decisions are given, players will sharp learn they can't shove or hold another player to get the advantage and let go just before the kick to get away with it.

 

[AC Mack]

What approach?

And why would you really hope it?

For example: it's a person's job to earn a living, and if they can get away with theft and robbery because they don't get caught, then crack on.

Btw I'm not saying that is your approach in life, but the parallels are similar.

 

[Coeus]

For example: it's a person's job to earn a living, and if they can get away with theft and robbery because they don't get caught, then crack on.

Btw I'm not saying that is your approach in life, but the parallels are similar.

Not really similar, is it?

A footballer bending the rules in order to win a game of football, and theft and robbery.

Im glad you really hope im not a criminal though.

 

[AC Mack]

Not really similar, is it?

A footballer bending the rules in order to win a game of football, and theft and robbery.

Im glad you really hope im not a criminal though.

I never said anything about you being a criminal, I'm making a comparison with your attitude towards it. Huge difference.

 

[Coeus]

I never said anything about you being a criminal, I'm making a comparison with your attitude towards it. Huge difference.

Ok, fair enough, so to clarify, the hope is that I don't think "crack on" when I see or hear of people committing theft and robbery?

Still seems like a bit of a stretch from having a pragmatic attitude toward it not being the footballers' fault that they take what they can get. It's the way the game is officiated that's at fault.

Im pretty shocked folk on here have such zero tolerance for it, given every time we've got away with one, ive missed the hysteria.