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India v England series

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rentaghost said:
I agree. It was a more difficult series for the likes of Sibley, Crawley, Pope etc than all of us would have expected with 2 of the 4 test match pitches being poor. They didn't do well and i don't mind constructive criticism but their long term prospects shouldnt be harmed because of this very difficult tour.
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Yeah its tricky for sure, I think I am disapointed a few more didn't just fight their way to a 50 or someit, which is a lot more runs in reality in those conditions

But that was an extreme of a tour as you can get, its disapointing but I dont think it has much relevance to cricket in most other places in the world, as you just dont come across that

I think the only issue for me is has that left any mental scars?
We've put a lot of investment in Crawley, Pope and Sibley and they have mostly delivered, but that was chastening tour, it was hard to watch never mind play in.
 

Separate question but should this Indian side be considered an all time great test side? Can’t argue with home record, back to back series wins in Australia as well
 
The Rat said:
I think its hard to judge him on that, was decent in Sri Lanka, sent home, and straight back in during the first over off a plane on an awful pitch, he had no chance, its been poor management all round.

He isn't on a red ball contract, so why he gets page after page on him I dont know

Sibley and Burns get paid over 3 times what Bairstow do, on red ball contracts, they are the issue.
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He wasn't that good in SL, never hit fifty. Sibley is inexperienced in these conditions and still learning, JB has played a lot of cricket on the subcontinent. I agree about Burns, I think he's proven to be shit against spin.
 
Jack Torrance said:
Separate question but should this Indian side be considered an all time great test side? Can’t argue with home record, back to back series wins in Australia as well
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Good team, theyve been awful in England, I think they are treating that so seriously, its their biggest tour for them

The good team thing annoys be a bit as they only ever go on about the old great Windies and Oz teams

But England under Strauss were a great team, and so were South Africa under Smith

I'd say on India if they win in England then yes
 
smoker said:
He wasn't that good in SL, never hit fifty. Sibley is inexperienced in these conditions and still learning, JB has played a lot of cricket on the subcontinent. I agree about Burns, I think he's proven to be shit against spin.
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few not outs in there, averaged 40 odd that series, a lot more than the others

I dont think anyone is suggesting he plays number 3 for England mind

but if Pope is our great star, I'd question why its Bairstow again who gets moved out of position when others don't.

I dont think its a big deal, there was no way they were opening with him at 3 in the Ashes was there. Its a bit of a red herring.
 
Jack Torrance said:
Separate question but should this Indian side be considered an all time great test side? Can’t argue with home record, back to back series wins in Australia as well
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Their amazing home record is largely down to wicket doctoring so no
The Rat said:
few not outs in there, averaged 40 odd that series, a lot more than the others

I dont think anyone is suggesting he plays number 3 for England mind

but if Pope is our great star, I'd question why its Bairstow again who gets moved out of position when others don't.

I dont think its a big deal, there was no way they were opening with him at 3 in the Ashes was there. Its a bit of a red herring.
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It's the revolving door of Joe Root's human shields. It would easier if he just manned up and batted three, he was an opener when he started anyway
 
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smoker said:
Their amazing home record is largely down to wicket doctoring so no
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Maybe this series but can’t remember it being an issue before. When we lost 4-0 they just batted big every test pretty much. They have tours to England and South Africa coming up - win both and they should be considered a great team
 
The Rat said:
Good team, theyve been awful in England, I think they are treating that so seriously, its their biggest tour for them

The good team thing annoys be a bit as they only ever go on about the old great Windies and Oz teams

But England under Strauss were a great team, and so were South Africa under Smith

I'd say on India if they win in England then yes
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Because the Windies and Aussie sides dominated for more than a decade.
 
smoker said:
Their amazing home record is largely down to wicket doctoring so no


It's the revolving door of Joe Root's human shields. It would easier if he just manned up and batted three, he was an opener when he started anyway
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Not this again man, Its nothing to do with "manning up"

you dont bat your best player out of position at 3

People who go about this never mention that he has batted a hell of a lot at 3 for England and averages 10 runs less, how is that good for the team??? Its not, it weakens it

Crawley made 250 batting there in his last test during the summer, we already have a number 3

Pope cant expect to play his whole career batting number 6 like, 3 out n out batsman in modern history have averaged over 40 at 6
 
Jack Torrance said:
Maybe this series but can’t remember it being an issue before. When we lost 4-0 they just batted big every test pretty much. They have tours to England and South Africa coming up - win both and they should be considered a great team
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They did it against Australia a couple of years ago. Also prepared greentops against SL. Their fans and media are ***** who cry if they lose a single game, which creates that win at any cost mentality
 
Best and most professional England side I have seen around 2010 but it was very brief. The Windies of the 80s blew everyone away for a decade including India in India when they prepared wickets like they have in this series.
 
The Rat said:
Not this again man, Its nothing to do with "manning up"

you dont bat your best player out of position at 3

People who go about this never mention that he has batted a hell of a lot at 3 for England and averages 10 runs less, how is that good for the team??? Its not, it weakens it

Crawley made 250 batting there in his last test during the summer, we already have a number 3

Pope cant expect to play his whole career batting number 6 like, 3 out n out batsman in modern history have averaged over 40 at 6
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If Root averages ten more batting at four than three, you put a batsman averaging 11 less at three than elsewhere (as seen with Lawrence), you've already cost the team. Root averages even higher at five than four but you wouldn't move Stokes up the order to accommodate this. And in JB's case they haven't stuck around long enough to protect him from the new ball, so he might as well have batted three.

Just because you're bored of it, doesn't mean it isn't a valid issue.
 
smoker said:
If Root averages ten more batting at four than three, you put a batsman averaging 11 less at three than elsewhere (as seen with Lawrence), you've already cost the team. Root averages even higher at five than four but you wouldn't move Stokes up the order to accommodate this. And in JB's case they haven't stuck around long enough to protect him from the new ball, so he might as well have batted three.

Just because you're bored of it, doesn't mean it isn't a valid issue.
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Mate its not an issue, weakening your best player is just about the worst possible thing we could do, it makes no sense. How can you watch Joe Root this year and think we need to move him?

its also never ever gonna happen and nor should it

Crawley is our number 3 anyway in norma conditions
 
Sorry but these players have proved themselves to be wanting. A close examination is needed. Everyone is up for scrutiny.
 
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