do you believe the universe...

[Ron Seal]

There is a lot of intellectual arrogance gets spouted on these threads. We have barely scratched the surface of the universe.

For example, it’s estimated there are roughly 100 billion stars in the Milky Way galaxy. We float around one of them. To put that into perspective, if you just counted each of them a second at a time, it would take 10,000 years. Multiply that by, say, 50 billion other galaxies estimated to exist.

Trying to explain this initial singularity has been a critical problem for some of the greatest minds to have lived. Completely ruling out the existence of something/someone more intelligent involved in the process. I completely understand why agnosticism exists, but staunch atheism I don’t get.

 

[The Exile]

I'm with Douglas Adams on this one.

'In the beginning the Universe was created.This had made many people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.'

 

[yamar1]

...just spontaneously burst into existence (Big Bang style, or whatever)?

..or that it was willed into existence?

and if you believe it was willed into existence does that mean you believe in God?

I mean, do whole universes just pop into existence for no reason?

Its pointless even trying to think about it, it will only crack you up.

 

[DaveH]

While the best evidence we have is the big bang, it is a difficult concept - to imagine nothing before it.

But I think it is more likely than some wizard sitting outside what we know as the universe and with a click of their fingers makes a universe.

 

[Mr.Thunders]

Understanding the universe is like explaining the value of a forward defensive stroke to a woman,futile.

 

[Ilios]

While the best evidence we have is the big bang, it is a difficult concept - to imagine nothing before it.

But I think it is more likely than some wizard sitting outside what we know as the universe and with a click of their fingers makes a universe.

I don't think either is likely - I'm not convinced either is possible. I don't think there ever was 'nothing' because that is an inherently contradictory state, and there's no reason to there was or could be 'nothing'. As you say, there is also no reason to assume that at the beginning of the universe, prior to any intelligent agents, that there was some inexplixable, eternal, disembodied, human-like brain-in-a-vat meta-genie floating about without a lamp, just creating things ex nihilo and willing things arbitrarily.

I'm not disputing the Big Bang BTW, im disputing that there was 'nothing' before it - even that sentence doesn't make sense Because if there was nothing before it, then there was also no time. As far as we can tell, something has always existed.

 

[mcq10]

The one question we will never understand or explain.

We’ve as much chance of being in a test tube of an aliens lab, than we are of a Big Bang or god creating us.

 

[PTR]

Wouldn’t call meself a deeply religious person but thought about it year’s ago, there must be something spiritual as the science can’t explain it (possibly I’m to thick to understand), if the solar system
‘Exploded’ into life, what’s was there before and what’s on the outside of where it ends? Heard it’s never ending but that makes no sense, not sure what’s harder to get, the universe and all or Safc’s football!!

A reasonal thing to remember here is that throughout the ages, "science can't explain it, so there must be a god" has ended up with scientfic discoveries being made time after time.

Its a very poor piece of reasoning to say "we don't know yet, therefore go". "Science cannot explain this, yet" has been proved to be a far better answer.

 

[anth]

Wouldn’t call meself a deeply religious person but thought about it year’s ago, there must be something spiritual as the science can’t explain it (possibly I’m to thick to understand), if the solar system
‘Exploded’ into life, what’s was there before and what’s on the outside of where it ends? Heard it’s never ending but that makes no sense, not sure what’s harder to get, the universe and all or Safc’s football!!

that’s simply the God of the gaps argument. Just because we don’t understand it now doesn’t give the right to claim god did it with no other supporting evidence.

At one point god was the Sun/moon/planets. We figured out what they actually were so god moved onto being something else.

 

[PTR]

A reasonal thing to remember here is that throughout the ages, "science can't explain it, so there must be a god" has ended up with scientfic discoveries being made time after time.

Its a very poor piece of reasoning to say "we don't know yet, therefore go". "Science cannot explain this, yet" has been proved to be a far better answer.

reasonable, sorry.

 

[Kent_Mackem]

Wouldn’t call meself a deeply religious person but thought about it year’s ago, there must be something spiritual as the science can’t explain it (possibly I’m to thick to understand), if the solar system
‘Exploded’ into life, what’s was there before and what’s on the outside of where it ends? Heard it’s never ending but that makes no sense, not sure what’s harder to get, the universe and all or Safc’s football!!

That’s the classic and common “I don’t understand it therefore God did it” Gid of the Gaps argument.

There’s nothing wrong with not knowing something. It doesn’t necessarily mean there has to be a supernatural answer. Scientists prefer to work at answers rather than accepting the lazy and comforting way out.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

I think that whatever the universe is, it is beyond human comprehension, like trying to imagine a 3D world if you’re a 2D object.

Why is it beyond human comprehension. There has been a lot of progress in our understanding of what and how over the last 100 years.

There is still a lot we don't know and some things we will probably never know.

But I think it has been proven beyond doubt that the Big Bang happened and the universe has not been around for ever.

Totally agree.
It also doesn't help that I watched Hannah Fry's mysterious world of maths this afternoon, about infinity.
I find the concept of infinity difficult to comprehend at the best of times.
But then she mentioned the concept of infinity plus one.

There is an infinity of numbers
There is also an infinity of odd numbers and an infinity of even numbers.
That one took me a while

 

[Kent_Mackem]

Completely ruling out the existence of something/someone more intelligent involved in the process. I completely understand why agnosticism exists, but staunch atheism I don’t get.

So I didn’t rule it out. The option is still on the table. However there is no evidence for it at all and it has to be a less likely explanation. Simpler explanations are more likely.

“Staunch atheism” is just the default position of not accepting a man-made explanation without any evidence. The “staunch” only applies to being tired of the laziness. I don’t think anybody has ever stated that “a creator definitely does not exist”.

 

[Iballistic George]

"all we are is dust in the wind" Bill and Ted

 

[Frijj]

Why is it beyond human comprehension. There has been a lot of progress in our understanding of what and how over the last 100 years.

There is still a lot we don't know and some things we will probably never know.

But I think it has been proven beyond doubt that the Big Bang happened and the universe has not been around for ever.

There is an infinity of numbers
There is also an infinity of odd numbers and an infinity of even numbers.
That one took me a while

Try and imagine a four, five or six dimensional object. Tell me what it looks like.

 

[PTR]

So I didn’t rule it out. The option is still on the table. However there is no evidence for it at all and it has to be a less likely explanation. Simpler explanations are more likely.

“Staunch atheism” is just the default position of not accepting a man-made explanation without any evidence. The “staunch” only applies to being tired of the laziness. I don’t think anybody has ever stated that “a creator definitely does not exist”.

Indeed. There's absolutely no evidence that the big bang wasn't created by some sort of power that we have no idea about.

 

[Temp0101]

Indeed. There's absolutely no evidence that the big bang wasn't created by some sort of power that we have no idea about.

There's absolutely no evidence that Father Christmas doesn't exist, or the 15000 + Gods that have been worshiped, that we know about, from the 1% of recorded Human history; the burden of proof is on the claimant which is what science is trying to do and, so far, the 'big bang' is the best objective scientific theory we have. Let's not forget that only 200 years ago the world's most eminent scientists all assumed that God created each living thing on the planet, we now know for a fact that isn't the case. Go back a bit further and the world was assumed to be flat.

 

[EchoMan]

It’s the bit after the Big Bang I don’t get. Are we supposed to believe that we came from dust and gas to what we have now by pure chance selection over a very long time period. Not sure Darwin was right.

And please don’t post about monkeys and typewriters.

 

[Harry Angstrom]

Try and imagine a four, five or six dimensional object. Tell me what it looks like.

What six dimensional objects are in our universe?

Indeed. There's absolutely no evidence that the big bang wasn't created by some sort of power that we have no idea about.

What created the power, that there is no evidence of, that may have created the universe?

 

[PTR]

There's absolutely no evidence that Father Christmas doesn't exist, or the 15000 + Gods that have been worshiped, that we know about, from the 1% of recorded Human history; the burden of proof is on the claimant which is what science is trying to do and, so far, the 'big bang' is the best objective scientific theory we have. Let's not forget that only 200 years ago the world's most eminent scientists all assumed that God created each living thing on the planet, we now know for a fact that isn't the case. Go back a bit further and the world was assumed to be flat.

haha, I agree entirely.
Have you seen my other posts on even just this thread? Or even my sig!

What created the power, that there is no evidence of, that may have created the universe?

Of course.
Every god got it powers from someone better than them. SuperGod.


Are people really arguing with me for not being atheist enough? Me!