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Second Test - England v West Indies (Old Trafford)

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chunkylover53 said:
It’s a fair challenge. And he hasn’t kept badly.

43 tests in now. Averaging just over 31. Is it dreadful? No. But we have options. And I’m afraid he doesn’t look like influencing many tests.

Tim Paine is widely assumed to be a dreadful option, he averages more than Jos now
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I think the problem is that he doesn't appear to know his role. When he came back into the team in 2018 (as a specialist no.7!) Ed smith talked about him bringing his white ball game to test matches and being the "flashing blade" to finish off the innings. The issue is, that he isn't doing that. He seems to be trying to play "properly" and he just doesn't have the technique for that game against the red ball. I'd rather he came in and just swung his arms. Scratching around for 15 or 20 runs isn't doing anyone any favours. He looks mentally shot
Steak Pie said:
Does Jos have a brother at all?
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Yeah. Gerard. But he's an actor
 

TopCat said:
I think the problem is that he doesn't appear to know his role. When he came back into the team in 2018 (as a specialist no.7!) Ed smith talked about him bringing his white ball game to test matches and being the "flashing blade" to finish off the innings. The issue is, that he isn't doing that. He seems to be trying to play "properly" and he just doesn't have the technique for that game against the red ball. I'd rather he came in and just swung his arms. Scratching around for 15 or 20 runs isn't doing anyone any favours. He looks mentally shot

Yeah. Gerard. But he's an actor
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Fully agreed.
 
chunkylover53 said:
It’s a fair challenge. And he hasn’t kept badly.

43 tests in now. Averaging just over 31. Is it dreadful? No. But we have options. And I’m afraid he doesn’t look like influencing many tests.

Tim Paine is widely assumed to be a dreadful option, he averages more than Jos now
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31.7 vs 31.1, that’s nothing to be fair and Paine is clearly judged to be doing enough by the Aussies to be in the side and be captain. Jos also has a far superior record in the one day stuff.

Can’t argue that we have options though. Unlike most I don’t have anything against any of the main 3. I’d be happy to see whichever one play and hopefully do well.

Based on something Jimmy said I have a slight suspicion that Foakes may not be as popular with some players as you’d expect and that that could be part of the reason he’s not had more opportunities. Could be miles out of course.
 
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Salem Street South said:
31.7 vs 31.1, that’s nothing to be fair and Paine is clearly judged to be doing enough by the Aussies to be in side and be captain. Jos also has a far superior record in the one day stuff.

Can’t argue that we have options though. Unlike the most I don’t have anything against any of the main 3. I’d be happy to see whichever one play and hopefully do well.

Based on something Jimmy said I have a slight suspicion that Foakes may not be as popular with some players as you’d expect and that that could be part of the reason he’s not had more opportunities. Could be miles out of course.
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To be clear, Jos is a superb one day player. I will never ever ever doubt that

You missed my point on Paine, he’s widely assumed to be a joke as a test batsman. And his record still stacks up with Buttler. He is also captain for well....reasons
 
chunkylover53 said:
To be clear, Jos is a superb one day player. I will never ever ever doubt that

You missed my point on Paine, he’s widely assumed to be a joke as a test batsman. And his record still stacks up with Buttler. He is also captain for well....reasons
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I take your point, but my point is he may be considered a joke by many but the Australians obviously don’t. They are persisting with him. For more reasons than just his average.
TopCat said:
What did he say?
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Bit of a throwaway comment about not appreciating him saying in a tweet that his heart sank when Jimmy came out to bat in SL with him when he was in the 90s or on 99 or something along those lines. Might be something, might be nothing. But the tone of it left me wondering whether Foakes was perhaps seen as a bit big time yet for what he’d achieved thus far.
 
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Salem Street South said:
I take your point, but my point is he may be considered a joke by many but the Australians obviously don’t. They are persisting with him. For more reasons than just his average.

Bit of a throwaway comment about not appreciating him saying in a tweet that his heart sank when Jimmy came out to bat in SL with him when he was in the 90s or on 99 or something along those lines. Might be something, might be nothing. But the tone of it left me wondering whether Foakes was perhaps seen as a bit big time yet for what he’d achieved thus far.
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Would be disappointed if a senior player such as Anderson took the hump about a comment as innocent as that mind. Nothing to do with Jos playing for Lancashire I wonder...
 
Bowlers for the next test is a much more crucial issue than WK imo. Anderson needs to come in but for who?
Broad, Woakes and curran all did enough to keep their place.
 
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The Breen Machine said:
Would be disappointed if a senior player such as Anderson took the hump about a comment as innocent as that mind. Nothing to do with Jos playing for Lancashire I wonder...
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I’d be more disappointed if county biases had anything to do with it to be honest, but I really don’t think it was anything like that.

It could be nothing & Jimmy is known for being a bit curmudgeonly shall we say, but I did think it illustrated a mild peeve that Foakes was perhaps being disrespectful of a senior team member in speaking out of turn slightly and wondered whether it was an isolated incident or an indication of a wider attitude problem.
 
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