Checked ya pension pot lately?

[offmenut]

I deliberately didn't mention the CETV amounts to see if someone would come up with a rough figure, mainly because I couldn't believe a shopfloor worker in a manufacturing company could achieve such a pot, and you are pretty damn close. Totally agree with the do you like risk comment. I'm not risk averse but would take the DB. By the way the figures aren't mine they're from a mate who works at the unmentioned company. If I was able to get that I'd be away at 55 which incidentally is 2 years today. So happy birthday to me

The issues you have, if you took that say, 650k out in 2007, we had a bull market for 10 yrs or so, and you would have been getting about 50k a Yr in interest on your fund, which is great.
However if you took it out last year, your 650 k now would be worth about 450k.

 

[Deleted member 30053]

Since when? My transfer value was higher 15 months ago than it was 3 months ago and that was with an alleged bonus to take it

The XPS index was higher 15 months ago then it was 3 months ago. Also the recent interest rate cuts only happened mid-March so 3 months ago is not relevant. I’m saying they are going up right now. The XPS index is expected to rise.

The XPS Transfer Value Index shows the estimated cash transfer value of a 64 year old member with a pension of £10,000 a year with typical inflation increases. The value changes over time with market movements.

The cetv is calculated by the amount of money needed by the fund to produce your pension at retirement age.
Lots of pension funds are in bonds which are so low now, some bonds are negative, that returns will have fallen. This would increase the cetv as you'd need more money invested in these bonds to produce the funds at retirement age.
Most funds, especially ones which have closed schemes to new employees, (which are most funds) put large amounts of the fund in gilts, which give a greater degree of certainty on the fund. An Inc in the rate of interest brings a higher return on the gilt, meaning less had to be invested.
When the rate of interest is so low, ie 0.1%, and the foreseeable future doesn't seem to think that we will see an Inc in this, as the economy will need stimulating for many yrs imo to bring it out of recession /depression, far more needs to be invested to produce the fund for when the employee retires.
So the cetv will be far higher.

Is this not correct?
How did you think the cetv was calculated?

Ive been saying CETV’s will increase!!!
You were originally saying firms would not provide them and that “it’s too volatile to calculate an accurate CETV”. I don’t believe this is the case. Sorry for any confusion and I don’t want to get into a slanging match on “whose the bestest at pensions!!!”. Playground stuff that so I’ll just apologise if any confusion was caused and leave it at that.

 

[offmenut]

The XPS index was higher 15 months ago then it was 3 months ago. Also the recent interest rate cuts only happened mid-March so 3 months ago is not relevant. I’m saying they are going up right now. The XPS index is expected to rise.

The XPS Transfer Value Index shows the estimated cash transfer value of a 64 year old member with a pension of £10,000 a year with typical inflation increases. The value changes over time with market movements.


Ive been saying CETV’s will increase!!!
You were originally saying firms would not provide them and that “it’s too volatile to calculate an accurate CETV”. I don’t believe this is the case. Sorry for any confusion and I don’t want to get into a slanging match on “whose the bestest at pensions!!!”. Playground stuff that so I’ll just apologise if any confusion was caused and leave it at that.

No bother.
Tbh, I'm just speaking from my works point of view, who have stopped opting out of the pension fund atm for the reasons I gave.
There are obviously many more who allow it if you say this to be true.

 

[Deleted member 30053]

No bother.
Tbh, I'm just speaking from my works point of view, who have stopped opting out of the pension fund atm for the reasons I gave.
There are obviously many more who allow it if you say this to be true.

Aye no probs mate! I was on a conference call yesterday with our Group CEO, Investment Director, Head of Pensions amongst others and the message was that a combination of rising transfer values (for reasons discussed earlier) together with a far more favourable entry point into the market compared to a few weeks ago means its probably the best time ever for clients to consider this. That’s their message not mine.

 

[Deleted member 14766]

I’m very close to retirement. So close to retirement that I may not return to work after the current crisis is over

So I have no time to recover the losses I’m currently experiencing. Many of those currently in difficulty are being supported so that they may pull things back together in the months and years after normality is restored.

For me, and others like me, there’s no recovery. That will it for the rest of my,and my wife’s,life.

My retirement is already a very different proposition to that which I’d planned. All,in the phrase repeated by the chancellor and the pm, “through no fault of my own”

I don’t expect anything from anyone and I know there are those less fortunate. I’m jus feeling sorry for myself. I’ll get over it.

 

[Matt Hopkins]

As I've said that I know very little about how the pension system works so be gentle

Could this be the end of folk being "allowed" to put their pots into drawdown? As I understand it if you buy an annuity the chances of getting all your money paid out is slim? but if you take a drawdown all the money in the pot is yours to do as you wish, subject to tax depending how much you drawdown ? So what's to stop providers just saying we can't recommend that you put it into drawdown, remember the 2020 crash so here's an annuity and by the way hurry up and croak so we can keep the rest of your money?
Only really asking as my companys scheme doesn't have the drawdown option so I'd have to transfer it to someone else and I can imagine it'll be "oh you need to take financial advice to do it" then I'd get the answer as above.
Just checked my pot the units are down 14% from last June so not as bad as I thought it was going to be.
As I say be gentle

 

[Deleted member 30053]

I’m very close to retirement. So close to retirement that I may not return to work after the current crisis is over

So I have no time to recover the losses I’m currently experiencing. Many of those currently in difficulty are being supported so that they may pull things back together in the months and years after normality is restored.

For me, and others like me, there’s no recovery. That will it for the rest of my,and my wife’s,life.

My retirement is already a very different proposition to that which I’d planned. All,in the phrase repeated by the chancellor and the pm, “through no fault of my own”

I don’t expect anything from anyone and I know there are those less fortunate. I’m jus feeling sorry for myself. I’ll get over it.

Genuinely don’t worry unless you were planning to buy an annuity with your fund.

All we can look at is history which tells us that when markets fall they always rise again. Your pot is not lost forever. If you want send me a PM and I can send you some reassuring literature on historic lengths of bull and bead markets. That could put your mind at rest. It’s important not to be fearful in times like this. Easier said that done but hold your nerve.

As I've said that I know very little about how the pension system works so be gentle

Could this be the end of folk being "allowed" to put their pots into drawdown? As I understand it if you buy an annuity the chances of getting all your money paid out is slim? but if you take a drawdown all the money in the pot is yours to do as you wish, subject to tax depending how much you drawdown ? So what's to stop providers just saying we can't recommend that you put it into drawdown, remember the 2020 crash so here's an annuity and by the way hurry up and croak so we can keep the rest of your money?
Only really asking as my companys scheme doesn't have the drawdown option so I'd have to transfer it to someone else and I can imagine it'll be "oh you need to take financial advice to do it" then I'd get the answer as above.
Just checked my pot the units are down 14% from last June so not as bad as I thought it was going to be.
As I say be gentle

Definitely not mate. In fact drawdown is a better option now following the fall. You’d be buying an annuity with a significantly lower fund value. Using drawdown gives the pension fund the opportunity to rise again - which if will.

This is just another stock market crash - albeit a pretty serious one and one which will talked about for years. But markets WILL recover. They always have and they always will.

 

[Tommasi]

In my mid 30s and I have no pension at all. Had a very good job the last two years and just concentrating on paying off my debt before worrying about it. At my age I don't even know if a pension is worth it, think property or a business for retirement is a better option.

 

[Deleted member 30053]

* bear markets (re above post)
At times like this we need to not let panic or fear dictate how we feel about our investments and pensions. You only lose if you sell.

There’ll obviously be people who may have needed immediate tax free cash for whatever reason who’ll be suffering now and some other exceptions but try not to let this “ruin your retirement”. Have faith in history.

I’m putting together a presentation for some of my clients next week about this where I’ll be covering some of the stuff discussed in here and I’d be happy to share it with anyone that wants it.

 

[Longy]

In my mid 30s and I have no pension at all. Had a very good job the last two years and just concentrating on paying off my debt before worrying about it. At my age I don't even know if a pension is worth it, think property or a business for retirement is a better option.

Definitely worth it mate. Property is just a form of investment, one I’m coming at from personal experience, you need to be hands in with & manage. In just under 5 years, I’ve replaced a roof, boiler & had a problem tenant. If you pay somebody to manage it for you, you’re spending your growth. If I didn’t get a new tenant in a month ago, would I be sitting 3/4/5 months with no rent, paying out council tax, water, insurance, gas & electricity. It helps if you have some knowledge & experience of the market. It’s not all home under the hammer type thing.

Business, could be fantastic. You may build something you love, are proud of & are great at. How many people are loosing their businesses right now? If you’d had a conversation about their business going pop at Christmas, they’d have laughed in your face. Today is a very drastic example, but it happened.

Pension, if you invest, you’re getting tax relief straight away. Free money in growth or back in your pocket through salary sacrifice or into your pot from HMRC. If you’re employed, you’ll get matched contributions from your employer. Free money. You’re mid 30s, you’re not allowed to draw it for 20 years. That’s 20 years if growth. If you had £100k invested today & it averaged 7% return, which is easily do able, you’d have £400k at 55 with compound interest.

There’s loads of good reasons to do a pension. I think sometimes people get caught up in it & think it’s complex. It’s basically a long term investment with loads of perks addd.

 

[Deleted member 14766]

Genuinely don’t worry unless you were planning to buy an annuity with your fund.

All we can look at is history which tells us that when markets fall they always rise again. Your pot is not lost forever. If you want send me a PM and I can send you some reassuring literature on historic lengths of bull and bead markets. That could put your mind at rest. It’s important not to be fearful in times like this. Easier said that done but hold your nerve.


Definitely not mate. In fact drawdown is a better option now following the fall. You’d be buying an annuity with a significantly lower fund value. Using drawdown gives the pension fund the opportunity to rise again - which if will.

This is just another stock market crash - albeit a pretty serious one and one which will talked about for years. But markets WILL recover. They always have and they always will.

I have a defined contribution pot with supposed ‘low risk’ (cos of my age) options and a pot that’s a consolidation of previous transfers. They’ve both been hit to the extent that I’ve moved the majority of one and all of the other into cash funds. I’ve got another couple of defined benefits schemes from former and current employment- one of which I’ve been fucked over by misquotes and late pension penalties (they amended the percentages without telling me). I retire in 4 months and my advisor will transfer whatever is left, in a timely fashion, to a drawdown pension that I’ll supplement with the two pots I mentioned earlier. Any ‘recovery’ won’t benefit me at all as I’ll be retired by then and dependent upon amounts in a pension that’s been set up with amounts I have now plus amounts that are already predefined. I’m fucked.

 

[Tommasi]

Definitely worth it mate. Property is just a form of investment, one I’m coming at from personal experience, you need to be hands in with & manage. In just under 5 years, I’ve replaced a roof, boiler & had a problem tenant. If you pay somebody to manage it for you, you’re spending your growth. If I didn’t get a new tenant in a month ago, would I be sitting 3/4/5 months with no rent, paying out council tax, water, insurance, gas & electricity. It helps if you have some knowledge & experience of the market. It’s not all home under the hammer type thing.

Business, could be fantastic. You may build something you love, are proud of & are great at. How many people are loosing their businesses right now? If you’d had a conversation about their business going pop at Christmas, they’d have laughed in your face. Today is a very drastic example, but it happened.

Pension, if you invest, you’re getting tax relief straight away. Free money in growth or back in your pocket through salary sacrifice or into your pot from HMRC. If you’re employed, you’ll get matched contributions from your employer. Free money. You’re mid 30s, you’re not allowed to draw it for 20 years. That’s 20 years if growth. If you had £100k invested today & it averaged 7% return, which is easily do able, you’d have £400k at 55 with compound interest.

There’s loads of good reasons to do a pension. I think sometimes people get caught up in it & think it’s complex. It’s basically a long term investment with loads of perks addd.

Unfortunately in the industry I work in there's no employee contributions so it would be basically be all on me.

 

[Deleted member 30053]

I have a defined contribution pot with supposed ‘low risk’ (cos of my age) options and a pot that’s a consolidation of previous transfers. They’ve both been hit to the extent that I’ve moved the majority of one and all of the other into cash funds. I’ve got another couple of defined benefits schemes from former and current employment- one of which I’ve been fucked over by misquotes and late pension penalties (they amended the percentages without telling me). I retire in 4 months and my advisor will transfer whatever is left, in a timely fashion, to a drawdown pension that I’ll supplement with the two pots I mentioned earlier. Any ‘recovery’ won’t benefit me at all as I’ll be retired by then and dependent upon amounts in a pension that’s been set up with amounts I have now plus amounts that are already predefined. I’m fucked.

If the money is in drawdown it’s in the market so it can rise as long as its invested. That’s the message. Remain invested and markets will recover. Putting money into cash at or near the bottom means you then give up the future gains on ride back up.

How much did your low risk fund fall by out of interest? In percentage terms.

 

[offmenut]

I have a defined contribution pot with supposed ‘low risk’ (cos of my age) options and a pot that’s a consolidation of previous transfers. They’ve both been hit to the extent that I’ve moved the majority of one and all of the other into cash funds. I’ve got another couple of defined benefits schemes from former and current employment- one of which I’ve been fucked over by misquotes and late pension penalties (they amended the percentages without telling me). I retire in 4 months and my advisor will transfer whatever is left, in a timely fashion, to a drawdown pension that I’ll supplement with the two pots I mentioned earlier. Any ‘recovery’ won’t benefit me at all as I’ll be retired by then and dependent upon amounts in a pension that’s been set up with amounts I have now plus amounts that are already predefined. I’m fucked.

It's always a risk taking it out into a cash fund.
Very few take out and put in at the right moment.
If a vaccine was found tommow the markets would rise 10% or more (Imo) immediately.
Really, the best to do for all funds is to remain in. All losses will recover at some point. 5 months ago you didn't have anyone mentioning the 2008 crash and saying it fucked them up.
This could well be a quicker recovery than that crash , and in 3 or 4 yrs time the fall will have had little impact on how your fund would have performed.
Hopefully!

 

[legend7]

I have a final salary frozen 15 years ago, transfer value went up again dramatically when I got one in November but think I'm only allowed 1 every 12 months so dont how that would work after this last month or so?
Been thinking about transferring as if I die my beneficiaries only get my contributions not the pot apparently, currently only 2.5% of transfer value.
Just turned 50 so bit of a dilemma with it rising nearly 20% last year.
Any advice appreciated.

 

[Deleted member 30053]

It's always a risk taking it out into a cash fund.
Very few take out and put in at the right moment.
If a vaccine was found tommow the markets would rise 10% or more (Imo) immediately.
Really, the best to do for all funds is to remain in. All losses will recover at some point. 5 months ago you didn't have anyone mentioning the 2008 crash and saying it fucked them up.
This could well be a quicker recovery than that crash , and in 3 or 4 yrs time the fall will have had little impact on how your fund would have performed.
Hopefully!

This 100%

I have a final salary frozen 15 years ago, transfer value went up again dramatically when I got one in November but think I'm only allowed 1 every 12 months so dont how that would work after this last month or so?
Been thinking about transferring as if I die my beneficiaries only get my contributions not the pot apparently, currently only 2.5% of transfer value.
Just turned 50 so bit of a dilemma with it rising nearly 20% last year.
Any advice appreciated.

You can get another one but if it’s the second one within a 12 month period there’s usually a charge for it. Normally £200-300. PM me for info .

 

[Deleted member 14766]

It's always a risk taking it out into a cash fund.
Very few take out and put in at the right moment.
If a vaccine was found tommow the markets would rise 10% or more (Imo) immediately.
Really, the best to do for all funds is to remain in. All losses will recover at some point. 5 months ago you didn't have anyone mentioning the 2008 crash and saying it fucked them up.
This could well be a quicker recovery than that crash , and in 3 or 4 yrs time the fall will have had little impact on how your fund would have performed.
Hopefully!

Too late. It’s done. Couldn’t risk it dropping any further. It’s going into a prudential pension and needs to be no lower than a certain level in July

 

[Hair Flick]

* bear markets (re above post)
At times like this we need to not let panic or fear dictate how we feel about our investments and pensions. You only lose if you sell.

There’ll obviously be people who may have needed immediate tax free cash for whatever reason who’ll be suffering now and some other exceptions but try not to let this “ruin your retirement”. Have faith in history.

I’m putting together a presentation for some of my clients next week about this where I’ll be covering some of the stuff discussed in here and I’d be happy to share it with anyone that wants it.

We might be better off going back to trading beads, firewater and beaver furs.

 

[Al]

I managed to actually retire about 1 week before all this shit started to get real

 

[Longy]

I managed to actually retire about 1 week before all this shit started to get real

How’s not being part of the rat race & your new found freedom treating you?! Hope you didn’t have a bucket list you wanted to start straight away?!