4th Ashes Test - Old Trafford

[Thurston]

Here they go saying peoe.are.tired

Did the aussies not play in the world cup

I’d argue that a few could have done with a short break instead of playing them in a pointless test match against Ireland straight after a gruelling World Cup, but overall it is no excuse.

 

[safcpelaw]

Absolutely - Atherton using dirt on the ball was a notch below the Aussies but then again he wasn't banned for a year and had to face the vilification of a nation for it. The Aussies were caught and were heavily sanctioned. Comparing it to Lance Armstrong Perhaps us using sweets on the ball in 2005 is on a par with Ben Johnson and Russian systematic doping.

Just stating cheating is cheating doesn’t matter how you do it. If it gives you an unfare advantage it’s crap. I still want to punch the fuck out of maradonna and I hate Steven Taylor. Just my opinion on cheats.

 

[rentaghost]

Just stating cheating is cheating doesn’t matter how you do it. If it gives you an unfare advantage it’s crap. I still want to punch the fuck out of maradonna and I hate Steven Taylor. Just my opinion on cheats.

Do you feel like punching Michael Atherton's face every time you see him on telly? If not is it because hes 'our cheat?'

 

[safcpelaw]

Do you feel like punching Michael Atherton's face every time you see him on telly? If not is it because hes 'our cheat?'

I don’t like him and I don’t have time for anything he says.

 

[daventry cat]

we have one bowler and no batsmen that have performed throughout the 4 games.....we have got exactly what we deserved

 

[rentaghost]

I don’t like him and I don’t have time for anything he says.

Ah well - fair enough then! Personally i thin hes just about the most knowledgeable cricket pundit you are ever likely to listen to.

 

[Thurston]

Absolutely - Atherton using dirt on the ball was a notch below the Aussies but then again he wasn't banned for a year and had to face the vilification of a nation for it. The Aussies were caught and were heavily sanctioned. Comparing it to Lance Armstrong Perhaps us using sweets on the ball in 2005 is on a par with Ben Johnson and Russian systematic doping.

It’s unquestionable that these things give an unfair advantage and should rightly be condemned, but I can’t even think what the equivalent of Armstrong would be in test cricket.

It would likely be something like doping someone like Archer up to the eyeballs so he could bowl 50 over spells maintaining a consistent speed between 95-99 mph throughout. It would have to be something relatively superhuman. I can still remember Armstrong in 99 using his breaks going up a mountain ffs. That was the level of cheating he was at. That takes a lot more than a bit of sandpaper down your underpants or some sweets.

 

[toosb]

It’s not a ridiculous notion though, can still spoil their party. A draw is not a win, even if a Lords club shop replica trophy is up for grabs.

I hope they're up for it. It's massive not to lose the series.

 

[safcpelaw]

Ah well - fair enough then! Personally i thin hes just about the most knowledgeable cricket pundit you are ever likely to listen to.

Cheated at footie when I was 9 and my dad batterred me maybe why I have that stance.

 

[GordonMuchallNo1Fan]

A question as I don’t know the answer.

How many Aussies were in the World Cup squad so playing white ball like our lot? Surely their preparation wasn’t any better?

As already pointed out, only 2 played county cricket I think? What about the others?

Probably doesn't answer everything for you but;

Just looking at the Sheffield Shield last round of games

Marcus Harris played for Victoria. Peter Siddle played for Victoria, also 8 county games in england. Labuschagne played for Queensland and
has played a lot of county cricket in England. Bancroft played for Western Australia as well as Durham. Travis Head was playing for Southern Redbacks.
Paine and Wade were playing for Tasmania.

You then look at the Australia A side who were playing here getting match practice albeit at 50 over level, they have been non stop at all levels,
none of this resting them/withdrawing them that happens with our lot.

Australia played Derbyshire in a mid Ashes game, looking at who played. Harris, Khawaja, Marsh, Smith, Wade, Bancroft, Labuschagne. Siddle and Starc also featured, with the ball. It's all good practice, they seem very well drilled in all formats. I believe they also played Worcester in a red ball warm up game?

I honestly couldn't tell you the last time Roy, Butler, Root and Stokes played county red ball cricket or
practice match red ball cricket. Has Bairstow played much red ball cricket? How many red ball games has Archer played this year?

Edit - Just done a quick google. Root has played 2 games in the county championship. Denly has played 6.
Burns 8. Broad 8. Leach 8.

Harris played 10 games, 18 innings in the Sheffield Shield. Bancroft 4 games, 8 innings. Wade played 10 games, 20 innings. Head played 7 games, 13 innings. Labuschagne 9 games, 17 innings. Paine 6 games, 10 innings. Siddle 7 games, 11 innings. Lyon played 3 games.

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Probably doesn't answer everything for you but;

Just looking at the Sheffield Shield last round of games

Marcus Harris played for Victoria. Peter Siddle played for Victoria, also 8 county games in england. Labuschagne played for Queensland and
has played a lot of county cricket in England. Bancroft played for Western Australia as well as Durham. Travis Head was playing for Southern Redbacks.
Paine and Wade were playing for Tasmania.

You then look at the Australia A side who were playing here getting match practice albeit at 50 over level, they have been non stop at all levels,
none of this resting them/withdrawing them that happens with our lot.

Australia played Derbyshire in a mid Ashes game, looking at who played. Harris, Khawaja, Marsh, Smith, Wade, Bancroft, Labuschagne. Siddle and Starc also featured, with the ball. It's all good practice, they seem very well drilled in all formats. I believe they also played Worcester in a red ball warm up game?

I honestly couldn't tell you the last time Roy, Butler, Root and Stokes played county red ball cricket or
practice match red ball cricket. Has Bairstow played much red ball cricket? How many red ball games has Archer played this year?

Edit - Just done a quick google. Root has played 2 games in the county championship. Denly has played 6.
Burns 8. Broad 8. Leach 8.

Harris played 10 games, 18 innings in the Sheffield Shield. Bancroft 4 games, 8 innings. Wade played 10 games, 20 innings. Head played 7 games, 13 innings. Labuschagne 9 games, 17 innings. Paine 6 games, 10 innings. Siddle 7 games, 11 innings. Lyon played 3 games.

Thanks

 

[chunksafc]

Probably doesn't answer everything for you but;

Just looking at the Sheffield Shield last round of games

Marcus Harris played for Victoria. Peter Siddle played for Victoria, also 8 county games in england. Labuschagne played for Queensland and
has played a lot of county cricket in England. Bancroft played for Western Australia as well as Durham. Travis Head was playing for Southern Redbacks.
Paine and Wade were playing for Tasmania.

You then look at the Australia A side who were playing here getting match practice albeit at 50 over level, they have been non stop at all levels,
none of this resting them/withdrawing them that happens with our lot.

Australia played Derbyshire in a mid Ashes game, looking at who played. Harris, Khawaja, Marsh, Smith, Wade, Bancroft, Labuschagne. Siddle and Starc also featured, with the ball. It's all good practice, they seem very well drilled in all formats. I believe they also played Worcester in a red ball warm up game?

I honestly couldn't tell you the last time Roy, Butler, Root and Stokes played county red ball cricket or
practice match red ball cricket. Has Bairstow played much red ball cricket? How many red ball games has Archer played this year?

Edit - Just done a quick google. Root has played 2 games in the county championship. Denly has played 6.
Burns 8. Broad 8. Leach 8.

Harris played 10 games, 18 innings in the Sheffield Shield. Bancroft 4 games, 8 innings. Wade played 10 games, 20 innings. Head played 7 games, 13 innings. Labuschagne 9 games, 17 innings. Paine 6 games, 10 innings. Siddle 7 games, 11 innings. Lyon played 3 games.

They also changed to Duke balls for the second half of the tournament according to Jim maxwell on TMS today

 

[King Kareoke]

I love JA, keep in mind though, he’s 37 years old.

Younger players should be stepping up and overtaking him at this specific point in his career, anyway. That is the normal way with these things.

It wasn't making excuses I just think the main difference is Smith and the Change bowlers - with Jimmy that may have evened us out a bit

 

[rubberface]

Australia were by far the better TEAM.

 

[Sack Fatto]

Why don’t we just admit that we have been beaten by a better team? Their bowling attack is frightening and they have the 21st Century Bradman. We need to rebuild from the grassroots.

 

[Voice of fair play]

They played 2/3 warm up games and then another game between the last test and this one.

Meanwhile next summer our team will warm up by playing 16.4 over cricket

That’s exactly what all touring sides do whatever country you in!

If we were in Australia we would have warm up games in between, so it’s a moot point.

We let them come over and play county cricket to get their eye in. No rules broken but it makes no sense to me. They were far better prepared than we were.

Wish people would stop making it sound like some grand plan of theirs and a mistake by us for their players to get county practice.

They was 2!

Bancroft who was useless.

And Labuschange who was not even picked and was only in the side because Smith got knock on the head.

This argument that they planned by getting county practice is complete bollocks.
Or and there was Siddle who played one game.

 

[hudson88]

That’s exactly what all touring sides do whatever country you in!

If we were in Australia we would have warm up games in between, so it’s a moot point.

Our warm up games when we tour are always slated to be fair, usually 2/3 day games against poor opposition. They’ve turned up playing 4 day games against county sides.

But my point is that we played 1 four day match against Ireland where we rested a fair few players. We’ve had next to no red ball cricket, and it’s shown.

 

[TopCat]

Do you feel like punching Michael Atherton's face every time you see him on telly? If not is it because hes 'our cheat?'

Totally different situation.

Why don’t we just admit that we have been beaten by a better team? Their bowling attack is frightening and they have the 21st Century Bradman. We need to rebuild from the grassroots.

Those 2 sentences don't add up. If they are such an amazing team and it's no shame losing to them, why do we suddenly need a grassroots rebuild?
What we need to do is start picking the best players for each position and get the red ball season aligned to the test schedule

 

[Paddy O'Dors]

I love JA, keep in mind though, he’s 37 years old.

Younger players should be stepping up and overtaking him at this specific point in his career, anyway. That is the normal way with these things.

I want to say we've got an excellent replacement in Archer, but think he's a bit of a show pony tbh.

 

[Voice of fair play]

Our warm up games when we tour are always slated to be fair, usually 2/3 day games against poor opposition. They’ve turned up playing 4 day games against county sides.

But my point is that we played 1 four day match against Ireland where we rested a fair few players. We’ve had next to no red ball cricket, and it’s shown.

The best players in their team play regular white ball cricket for example Smith and Cummins.

So although I see your point, isn’t wasn’t their red ball practice that made the difference, it’s was the skill of Smith and Cummins who had been playing white ball cricket.