RR OPINION: Cattermole Form Warrants International Recognition

[Cockney Mackem]

Cattermole getting picked by an England manager means nothing of the sort. Well not according to me anyway, everyone's opinion varies. There is no standard definition. If international class in your world includes Geoff Thomas then Cattermole is international class. If international class means you shine at that level then he is nowhere near international class.

It feels like I've typed this about 20 times now.

No but your bit about how you perform at that level contradicts with your bit about it varying by country. You could be first name on the team sheet for a poor country and get roasted every time you play. Not international class. You could be a fringe player for a better country but hold your own whenever you play - international class.

Your latter point has baffled me. As for your former point, you say "shine," I say "hold your own." The question is, would Cattermole be able to hack it against decent (top 30) international teams if he was picked?

 

[Maravilla]

The defensive side of Gerrards game is so lacking, though. The only reason he has any positional discipline these days is that his legs are completely shot. Given Englands standing in world football we'd need a defensive midfielder to emphasise the destructive part of his game first and foremost.

Was probably England's worst performer at the World Cup. Mind, him and Henderson simply can't play in a central 2.

 

[GK]

No but your bit about how you perform at that level contradicts with your bit about it varying by country. You could be first name on the team sheet for a poor country and get roasted every time you play. Not international class. You could be a fringe player for a better country but hold your own whenever you play - international class.

Your latter point has baffled me. As for your former point, you say "shine," I say "hold your own." The question is, would Cattermole be able to hack it against decent (top 30) international teams if he was picked?

I think he'd be slaughtered for poor technique. If he made a mistake on par with e.g. Villa, Hull or City away I think we'd have a new national joke on our hands.

 

[Keith S30S]

I disagree, I think he'd be slaughtered for poor technique. If he made a mistake on par with e.g. Villa, Hull or City away I think we'd have a new national joke on our hands.

Like Gerrard did against Chelsea which cost his team the title?

Lee Cattermole wouldn't shine internationally as such. He wouldn't be there for that reason. He'd be there to mop up, cover, mark, tackle, pass to more creative players, organise, drive the team on, lead etc. Only scholars of the game would see his true impact. Like Gary Neville on Sunday

 

[GK]

Like Gerrard did against Chelsea which cost his team the title?

Lee Cattermole wouldn't shine internationally as such. He wouldn't be there for that reason. He'd be there to mop up, cover, mark, tackle, pass to more creative players, organise, drive the team on, leade etc. Only scholars of the game would see his true impact. Like Gary Neville on Sunday

Exactly like Gerrard did against Chelsea which cost his team the title. Gerrard scored 14 goals that season and set up a similar amount of goals.

 

[The Cabbage]

Was probably England's worst performer at the World Cup. Mind, him and Henderson simply can't play in a central 2.

I think we'd have been hamstrung in any case due to Hodgsons ridiculous decision to play four orthodox forwards infront of them. It left Gerrard and Henderson (in the event just Jordan) with a hell of a lot of legwork to go through.

We'll never do anything till we dominate midfield. We'll never dominate midfield until we up the numbers in there. I've gone off 4-2-3-1 in a big way in the last year. Gus has got it right with the way he sets us up. Hodgson could do a lot worse than coming down and having a look.

 

[mart]

I disagree, I think he'd be slaughtered for poor technique. If he made a mistake on par with e.g. Villa, Hull or City away I think we'd have a new national joke on our hands.

He'd be slaughtered for poor technique by who? In the WC qualifiers England come up against sides that can't even muster up a full team of proffesionals. He might well struggle against some of the top sides but he'd walk into the majority of international sides.

 

[GK]

He'd be slaughtered for poor technique by who? In the WC qualifiers England come up against sides that can't even muster up a full team of proffesionals. He might well struggle against some of the top sides but he'd walk into the majority of international sides.

He'd get slaughtered by the English press and fans unfortunately and I'd hate to see it happen.

 

[Midday Sun Englishman]

England have better players in every position but other than that I see what you're saying

Jeez! Firstly, 11 best players don't necessarily make the best team - See Costa Rica, Chile and Bosnia, and playing Gerrard and Lampard together. Secondly, do you think the England team that went to Brazil would beat the Southampton team at peak form from last season? Or Swansea at peak form? What about the Sunderland team that finished 7th? The gap is not that wide and you confuse international class with "a class international". You also overestimate the quality of international football (in comparison to the Prem). Other that that, you're bang on.

He'd get slaughtered by the English press and fans unfortunately and I'd hate to see it happen.

This is, sadly, your correct point. That's why it's best if he isn't called up and we benefit from his non-injury.

 

[lurker]

I see they're putting OPINION on these now, good.

 

[mart]

He'd get slaughtered by the English press and fans unfortunately and I'd hate to see it happen.

You may well be right but England were absolutely desperate for someone like Cattermole in Brazil. The amount of time and space allowed for the likes of Pirlo was embarrassing.

 

[SAFCMarc]

Exactly like Gerrard did against Chelsea which cost his team the title. Gerrard scored 14 goals that season and set up a similar amount of goals.

Around 10 of which were penalties and he took all set pieces. A job he is not needed for with England, but he has retired anyway...

There is only currently one better defensive midfielder than Cattermole and that is Barry. The problem we have is we need to build for the future should shouldn't be picking 34 year olds.

 

[nordic]

I think he should be called up name a player who plays his position who is English and better at playing in that position

 

[pwsafc]

Hodgson

as well as he is playing for us...its simply not a role Hodgson plays..so he has no need for a Lee Cattermole or any other player of that type

and lets be honest...his tackling, is hard and at role fair...but it wouldnt be tolerated at international level, where a defender breaking wind is enough to knock a player over.

Hodgson does play that
[Qcourse iTE="GingerNick, post: 18506720, member: 508"]as well as he is playing for us...its simply not a role Hodgson plays..so he has no need for a Lee Cattermole or any other player of that type

and lets be honest...his tackling, is hard and usually fair...but it wouldnt be tolerated at international level, where a defender breaking wind is enough to knock a player over.[/QUOTE]

of course its a role Hodgson plays, he played Gerrard and Henderson protecting the back 4

 

[Keith S30S]

Exactly like Gerrard did against Chelsea which cost his team the title. Gerrard scored 14 goals that season and set up a similar amount of goals.

Gerrard has a lot of attributes to play the holding role but he doesn't have the pace or discipline to do it. His other attributes make up for his poor positioning etc.

When Gerrard and players of his ilk and age were in there pomp Catts would have had no chance. Those days are long gone.

 

[Perryqhill]

I'd say he was good final third, he was nowt special like pretty much everyone else for the majority of it in my opinion.

Fundamentally though it comes down to your point above. If Cattermole is England class that says far more about where England is at, in a bad way, then it suggests Cattermole is England's Michael Essien



Sorry, bad day

I think the melt down on here when he was about to be sold in January spoke volumes. IMO he started well and maintained a decent standard. He did get caught out a few times in the system, most notably in the cup at Hull and he had a spastication away to Hull too, but overall he had a good season and a very good end.

Eh?

Speaks for itself, try reading it. You seem to be changing the criteria of 'international class' to suit.

 

[hank williams]

Is he hell..............

Don't talk so much fuch rubbish

Don't talk so much fuch rubbish

Yes
I was a cattermole detractor on here

But he won me over

What's Wilshere done

 

[Banks]

Players have had much better spells than Cattermole and aren't being picked.

Huddlestone and Livermore had better seasons

Jack Cork had a better season as did Shelvey. Considering England don't use a Cattermole type player, why does he get a callup.

 

[Keith S30S]

Players have had much better spells than Cattermole and aren't being picked.

Huddlestone and Livermore had better seasons

Jack Cork had a better season as did Shelvey. Considering England don't use a Cattermole type player, why does he get a callup.

Because they need leaders after 2 major retirements and also to protect a poor back four who conceded 4 in 2 games agaist average teams very recently?

Cork scored his first goal in over 3 years tonight. Livermore is also average. The other 2 don't play defensive midfield.

 

[Banks]

Because they need leaders after 2 major retirements and also to protect a poor back four who conceded 4 in 2 games agaist average teams very recently?

Cork scored his first goal in over 3 years tonight. Livermore is also average. The other 2 don't play defensive midfield.

England havent played with a player of Cattermoles ilk since Hoddles England with Ince/Batty.

He doesn't suit the system Hodgson wants to play. To replace Gerrard in that system, Huddleton and Cork are much better fits, they take care of the ball well. Cattermole is the best combative midfielder in that list but we don't play combative midfieders in Englands system.

He is way down the list in that he doesn't suit Hodgsons system and he hasn't played well for long enough. If he carrys on his form until Easter fair play but he hasn't played well for 6 consecutive games yet.