Uber taxi apps and their ilk.

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The taxi industry here was a complete joke. Overpriced, dodgy cars and invariably don't turn up. And some of them stunk to the point you're gagging.

Uber has been a godsend. Very professional, clean, punctual and good value.
 


monkeytassle said:
Blame central banks for this. They are lowering borrowing costs for even the most dubious entities. Pe ratios are mad.
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It is really hard to see how this ends well. The credit crunch started because of a toxic mix of easy debt, bad investments, and stupid behaviour. Central banks provided liquidity into markets to stop them collapsing, then people took that money, ran up more debt with bad investments due to stupid behaviour

monkeytassle said:
A theory I have is that central banks via cheap financing are making it easy to borrow more cash to make stiff cheaper. If you are an oil company you can finance 10y debt at 2%+a spread to produce more stuff you can sell cheaper. Same as uber. Produce more for the ease price driving wages down
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The problem I have with the "borrow more cash to make stuff cheaper" is that too many companies are using their borrowing on share buy backs, mergers and acquisitions, loading balance sheets with debt.

I think that the best we can hope for is a long slow orderly devaluation of assets - stocks, shares, houses - the risk is that oncce the decline gathers momentum there will be a rush for the exits, which will turn a decline into another crash.

Big Sharp Teeth said:
As we've already mentioned, Uber's longer term goal is to not have many drivers. It also makes a lot of use of big data and algorithms to try and ensure the right number of cars are on he streets and they're in the right places to maximise income. And remember it's not really Uber paying the drivers, the drivers are essentially paying Uber to be on their platform. They pay Uber a cut of each journey. It might not work in the long run, but it's certainly possible to see a business model there.

And let's be honest, the business models they have been up against haven't been great. I think taxi medallions in New York were going for somewhere in the region of $1m apiece due to the artificial limit on the number of taxis. It was an old fashioned way of trying to manage supply to tie in with fixed tariffs. Now there is the technology to attempt to deliver the correct supply through variable tariffs.

Even if Uber fail at least we should have a more appropriate and modern taxi service.
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I am looking forward to my robo-car. Between that and the self check out at Sainsburys I am looking forward to days when I don't have to interact directly with another human being

And you might be right about Uber - it might thrive. Or it could be the symptom of another investment bubble, whose business model has a significant element of pushing wages lower.

chr1s1973 said:
I suppose you can say that ultimately the passenger is the major (only?) source of revenue, so they are de facto having the rides subsidised. However, I'm not sure of the debt base of rival ride-sharing services and surely all firms face start-up costs? Their world-wide expansion has been prolific, let alone the un-ending legal battles they've faced.
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You might be right too. But your argument sounds a bit like my mate telling me that his channel tunnel shares were like money in the bank.
 
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Lankester Merrin said:
It is really hard to see how this ends well. The credit crunch started because of a toxic mix of easy debt, bad investments, and stupid behaviour. Central banks provided liquidity into markets to stop them collapsing, then people took that money, ran up more debt with bad investments due to stupid behaviour



The problem I have with the "borrow more cash to make stuff cheaper" is that too many companies are using their borrowing on share buy backs, mergers and acquisitions, loading balance sheets with debt.

I think that the best we can hope for is a long slow orderly devaluation of assets - stocks, shares, houses - the risk is that oncce the decline gathers momentum there will be a rush for the exits, which will turn a decline into another crash.



I am looking forward to my robo-car. Between that and the self check out at Sainsburys I am looking forward to days when I don't have to interact directly with another human being

And you might be right about Uber - it might thrive. Or it could be the symptom of another investment bubble, whose business model has a significant element of pushing wages lower.
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Point #2. Check out today. The damping ability of banks has been reduced by regulation and will cause even more horrendous price swings.
 
Lankester Merrin said:
You might be right too. But your argument sounds a bit like my mate telling me that his channel tunnel shares were like money in the bank.
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I think some of your previous posts are acurate, I kind of implied it too, they are baring a lot of cost for the ride-sharing concept to assert themselves as the primary name in the market. As such, if their revenues falter etc then they are in a tricky position.

The cost of litigation and fighting with each local, state and national governement can't be over-looked. They are the ones who've born a lot of this cost, validating the ride share concept over the traditional taxi. Whether Uber are viable or not, the legal precident has been established in many parts of the world now and the ride-sharing concept is here to stay.

As we are all saying, the intrinsic cheques and balances of the technology, the ease, cost and accesibility for drivers makes it a very powerful force. Maybe we'll have these driver-less cars and Uber will be able to adapt to that, as Amazon did to streaming.
 
chr1s1973 said:
The cost of litigation and fighting with each local, state and national governement can't be over-looked. They are the ones who've born a lot of this cost, validating the ride share concept over the traditional taxi. Whether Uber are viable or not, the legal precident has been established in many parts of the world now and the ride-sharing concept is here to stay.
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Perhaps that was the real prize at stake - establishing the precedent that you could have a new business model where the company and the investors bore no responsibility to the people who work for them, who become "customers" of their own employee, with Uber using their economic position ultimately to levy rent.

What frustrates me about this that the technology exists to create a huge change in how our economy operates - a fundamental transformation in the control of the means of production, distribution and exchange. A real challenge to the financialised, rent seeking capitalism which is causing so many problems for western countries. Instead we see business models which look to be the old capitalism with an app, with a business model that is based on eroding the pay and position of the workforce to squeeze out a few more dollars for private equity firms.
 
Lankester Merrin said:
Do you mean Deutsche or just banks in general?
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Just in general. Banks in the past have been shock absorbers but balance Street restrictions and stupid amounts of excess reserves means you will see more and more crazy price swings. China main stock index tolerates 8% swings daily. It's madness.
 
Frijj said:
But if the machine is proven to be safe?

If a plane fails your pilot won't save you. I bet you still fly!
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The operate word there is pilot mate.

Bob Fleming said:
The taxi industry here was a complete joke. Overpriced, dodgy cars and invariably don't turn up. And some of them stunk to the point you're gagging.

Uber has been a godsend. Very professional, clean, punctual and good value.
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Not sure where you live but I have to point out that Taxis have 2 tests a year in some areas 3, so to say they are dodgy is a bit off the mark or you are using unlicensed ones? They have spot checks throughout the year too. A good company will always turn up its how they make money. Overpriced? Its the councils set the fare tariffs not the Taxis, if you are paying too much (which i doubt) again maybe you are using unlicensed ones?
 
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Wierd Valley Mackem said:
The operate word there is pilot mate.


Not sure where you live but I have to point out that Taxis have 2 tests a year in some areas 3, so to say they are dodgy is a bit off the mark or you are using unlicensed ones? They have spot checks throughout the year too. A good company will always turn up its how they make money. Overpriced? Its the councils set the fare tariffs not the Taxis, if you are paying too much (which i doubt) again maybe you are using unlicensed ones?
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Australia. Not unlicensed no. Not really dodgy cars. More just smelly and shite compared to the much better cars I've used with Uber. And the city sets the rate here for the taxis too - but that's a pure cartel.

They pick and choose their fares. They don't bother with short fares. Used to have them accept fares via the app then cancel them leaving you stuck.

Thankfully it has led to taxis trying to up their game which was never going to happen prior to Uber and not even until the state declared Uber legal.
 
Bob Fleming said:
Australia. Not unlicensed no. Not really dodgy cars. More just smelly and shite compared to the much better cars I've used with Uber. And the city sets the rate here for the taxis too - but that's a pure cartel.

Thankfully it has led to taxis trying to up their game which was never going to happen prior to Uber and not even until the state declared Uber legal.
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Fair points there mate ive no idea why Taxis are smelly or dirty just bad practice i suppose. Its like all services if you arent presentable to your customer you arent doing your job properly.
 
monkeytassle said:
Just in general. Banks in the past have been shock absorbers but balance Street restrictions and stupid amounts of excess reserves means you will see more and more crazy price swings. China main stock index tolerates 8% swings daily. It's madness.
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It's hard to know what to worry about the most when it comes to banks. You start to want the crash to come just to get it over with
 
Frijj said:
If your car conks out, you'll likely be alright.

If your plane conks out, you're likely fucked, regardless of the pilot's ability.

You're willing to trust planes - why not driverless cars if they're proven safe?
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Ive never been in a plane without a pilot?
 
Wierd Valley Mackem said:
Ive never been in a plane without a pilot?
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I can't work out if you're misunderstanding me or taking the piss.

If a plane fucks up, that is if the machinery of the plane fucks up, your pilot will likely not be able to save you.

You're willing to put your trust in a plane to work but not a driverless car, even though the dangers are lower in a driverless car.

I don't understand your fears.

I even specifically stated to you - if they're proven safe.
 
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