Tribunal nears end for man who lost job offer over views on homosexuality
- Thread starter HerdnMulhall
- Start date
Looks like a legitimate issue for the employer to make a call on. If you're working in a social care setting, then thinking a large cohort of the vulnerable people you look after are sinners based on their sexuality isn't helpful or likely to be in the interests of the people in your care.
If he worked pulling pints or fixing cars or whatever, it wouldnt be an issue though. Maybe he'd be better off doing something else.
If he worked pulling pints or fixing cars or whatever, it wouldnt be an issue though. Maybe he'd be better off doing something else.
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0verlord44
Winger
aye thats bollocks to me like
“As a Christian, I do not see any conflict in working with and for people from the LGBT community.
“That said, there is a distinction between respecting and loving the person and yet lovingly and respectfully disagreeing with their views and/or behaviours.”
seems a reasonable response
JonMc
Striker
If he was a welder then I would expect some common sense. As a social worker I can see how his views might be a tad problematic.
Not sure how respectful he is when he describes them as sinners. He seems to hold discrimatory views so it follows he may discriminate in his actions too. As I say, in my view it would be reasonable for an employer in that kind of setting to make a call on this. It seems relevant.
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From the employer's point of view though, the question is that although he can say that, will he live it and not give in to the temptation to proselytise or make judgements or give advice based on his religious beliefs, not what's best for the client.
It's not his job as a mental health support worker to 'respectfully disagree' with the service-users' sexuality.
zinedine
Striker
In a gay bar.
SpiritofBurnden
Winger
Steeeeed
Winger
I don't think it's right to punish an idea or a belief; that's quite a slippery slope. It's how that idea or belief manifests itself where the potential problems could come.
If a work placed discussion on same sex marriage came up and he said due to his religious beliefs he thinks it's a sin I wouldn't have a problem with it particularly. If he's just randomly going to start to admonish service users then that's obviously a huge problem.
If a work placed discussion on same sex marriage came up and he said due to his religious beliefs he thinks it's a sin I wouldn't have a problem with it particularly. If he's just randomly going to start to admonish service users then that's obviously a huge problem.
Dash riprock
Central Defender
So does that mean those that think those that Twoc are thieves and theft is a sin shouldnt work in youth offending then ?
Or that prison social workers shouldnt think rape or fraud for example is a sin ?
Or child protection workers shouldnt think abusing kids is a sin .
As social workers ( which i was ) we help people regardless of whether we agree with their life choices. Its difficult sometimes but its a skill developed much as barristers can defend guilty people.
Its a slippery slope when you start to demand certain opinions out of those that administer the relationship between state and individuals. All ok when youre in accord with the Zeitgeist and wont need anyone who is willing to fight the state but what if youre not and all you have is state graded thinkers ?
Dash riprock
Central Defender
Wouldnt last two minutes
Eh? Not sure how homosexuality is comparable to being a rapist or a child abuser. Or the relevance of rehabilated twokkers working with youth offenders. Not sure what a state graded thinker is either. I take it you are one those free thinkers using their eyes and ears?
Sexual orientation is a protected characteristic. This bloke holds what appear to be discriminatory views i.e. homosexuals are all sinners. I can see why an employer in this field would be concerned and think they should be able to make their own call on whether to employ him or not. I'm not demanding anything, and I didn't mention the state.
Dash riprock
Central Defender
I know you didnt but social workers are agents of the state but also expected to challenge the state when their training suggests the state is not acting fairly . If you make them all think certain things in order to work you lose their ability to do that . They will just be functionaries of the state , not lying between it
All those examples you give are something that people do. The views that this man holds are about what people are. That's a very important distinction. Being gay isn't a life choice.
TexasMackem
Striker
The article says the employer found out about his views on homosexuality when they became aware of a Facebook argument. I think it's less to do with his personal beliefs and more to do with the advocacy of his stance in a public setting, possibly associating his opinions with the new employer. I'd have no second thoughts on binning his application on that basis personally.
Dash riprock
Central Defender
Yes i was merely trying to illustrate that social workers work quite comfortably with those they would judge in discrete thought.
Its brought me to think what of Muslim social workers ? They must think a good many western behaviours are haram , or extreme feminist social workers many of whom have made a study of disliking and distrusting men due to no other characteristic but sex , that must distort child protection proceedings ?
Perhaps they all just stick their professional head on as this chap undoubtedly would.
Thats probably it to be fair. Facebook should be a no no for all social workers.
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Steeeeed
Winger
It's an interesting case for sure. One protected characteristic versus another protected characteristic.
Kid Galahad
Striker
Yeah it's a strange one, would a for instance LBGTQ liberal/lefty social worker give the same level of care and support to someone who had forthright religious views as to another member of the public with similar values as themselves? I'm not one bit religious but I'm sure you're allowed to be in everyday life (no matter how weird it makes you look!) so I think it's a difficult one, would make discussions in the canteen or on nights out a bit more lively too
