Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES) - Please put sensitive content behind a spoiler
- Thread starter SurreyMackem
- Start date
Herberthall
Winger
Lord Potts
Striker
BBC verify that at least 50,000 Russians have been killed so far. This is based on evidence of the official announcements of an individula's death - known funerals - social media and a survey of military cemeteries .
Obviously the bodies of troops that have been disposed in other ways or troops who are as yet "missing" or unaccounted for can't be counted and the figure is likely to be higher than the known burrials of troops counted by the BBC .
I have always thought that the figures claimed by the Ukrianian Govenment must include the wounded. If for example 6 men are in a building and you drop a bomb on it you can't always assume that none of them have survived. Also in the heat of battle if two troops fire at one enemy soldier from different positions and he falls that can be mistakenly reported as two enemy deaths. It not like calculating the loss of Russian equiment where verification is easier as clear evidence of it often remains on the battlefield for quite sometime.
I think however whatever the actual number of Russian deaths might be it's one hell of a lot.
Obviously the bodies of troops that have been disposed in other ways or troops who are as yet "missing" or unaccounted for can't be counted and the figure is likely to be higher than the known burrials of troops counted by the BBC .
I have always thought that the figures claimed by the Ukrianian Govenment must include the wounded. If for example 6 men are in a building and you drop a bomb on it you can't always assume that none of them have survived. Also in the heat of battle if two troops fire at one enemy soldier from different positions and he falls that can be mistakenly reported as two enemy deaths. It not like calculating the loss of Russian equiment where verification is easier as clear evidence of it often remains on the battlefield for quite sometime.
I think however whatever the actual number of Russian deaths might be it's one hell of a lot.
Russia's meat grinder soldiers - 50,000 confirmed dead
In the second 12 months on the front line the body count was nearly 25% higher than in the first year.
www.bbc.co.uk
They say casualties. Not deatha.BBC verify that at least 50,000 Russians have been killed so far. This is based on evidence of the official announcements of an individula's death - known funerals - social media and a survey of military cemeteries .
Obviously the bodies of troops that have been disposed in other ways or troops who are as yet "missing" or unaccounted for can't be counted and the figure is likely to be higher than the known burrials of troops counted by the BBC .
I have always thought that the figures claimed by the Ukrianian Govenment must include the wounded. If for example 6 men are in a building and you drop a bomb on it you can't always assume that none of them have survived. Also in the heat of battle if two troops fire at one enemy soldier from different positions and he falls that can be mistakenly reported as two enemy deaths. It not like calculating the loss of Russian equiment where verification is easier as clear evidence of it often remains on the battlefield for quite sometime.
I think however whatever the actual number of Russian deaths might be it's one hell of a lot.
Russia's meat grinder soldiers - 50,000 confirmed dead
In the second 12 months on the front line the body count was nearly 25% higher than in the first year.www.bbc.co.uk
Russia could have a casualty who gets sent back out after recuperating and then becomes a casualty again.
The number of deaths though is wager my house are much higher than 50k
Wild Card
Winger
No chance deaths will be 50k.
Russia are hiding the deaths from their population so there will never be formal certificates and funerals. We have seen mobil crematoriums, bodies left to rot, contestant mobilisation (at least one large wave of it), destruction of skilled and experienced units,thousands of tech and hardware that will have more than one person in, mass grave sites in Russia, recruitment from other countries. This is from a starting point of a massive army. No way is it 50k imo. It's probably closer to 50k a qtr.
In the BBCs defence they do say confirmed to be fair.
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They also say the reality is it will be much higher
Lord Potts
Striker
Isn't the word that has always been used on the table that's pubished by Ukriane "losses" . That sounds a bit more permanent than casualties and its a little more ambigious as the figure must also include the Russian POWs that Ukriane holds (the number of whom the Ukrainians know for certain).
I am not blaming the Ukrainains though as the only people who know with any reasonable certainty how many Russsian troops have been killed and injured are the Russians themselves - and they are certainly not saying. I agree that there is probably more than 50,000 Russian dead but the total may not yet be in six figures.
Don't forget the BBC is saying "verified" - that's deaths for which their is some known evidence of.
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TexasMackem
Striker
It'll be in six figures, definitely. On the very first page of this thread Russia were admitting to 1600 deaths when the number reported by the Kyiv Independent was 10x that. This was while they were getting absolutely mullered at Hostomel among many other places where the body count was already outrageously high.
I'm pretty sure I remember a US intelligence source put the figure at around 270k a few months ago but I'm not going to try to dig up the source.
Boz33
Striker
Aye adding nukes into the mix would definitely help things
SurreyMackem
Striker
Russian losses, below average.
Blyth_Pirate
Midfield
I see the MSM dancing in delight at France not inviting Vlad for the upcoming D-day gig. They appear to have forgotten the fact that Vlad would be arrested for the war crimes committed, the same story they were dancing about only months ago, absolute wallopers the MSM.
Feed the Monster
Striker
Russian deaths will be in 6 figures, likely twice that of the Ukrainian military. The daily reported figures must include WIA and POW’s as there’s no way 500k have been killed.
Stats are usually 3-5 wounded for each fatality so 100 to 125k makes sense and tallies with the BEEB figures.
Sadly numbers Russia can easily bear as long as they are willing to sacrifice their expendable conscripts. Cannot even begin to get my head around that state of mind.
Stats are usually 3-5 wounded for each fatality so 100 to 125k makes sense and tallies with the BEEB figures.
Sadly numbers Russia can easily bear as long as they are willing to sacrifice their expendable conscripts. Cannot even begin to get my head around that state of mind.
PIDD
Full Back
It's a long read.
www.atlanticcouncil.org
Organizing for victory
In the escalating struggle against Putin's Russia, Iran, and China, The West needs a return to the clarity of Churchill and Roosevelt, who communicated clear strategic priorities to the public, industry, and the military, writes Ben Hodges.
www.atlanticcouncil.org
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Jabberwocky
Winger
At least double. Great bit of analysis to track that many but no way will they be able to cover such a giant country
Boz33
Striker
In truth I don’t put much confidence in any of the casualty figures and equipment losses being anywhere accurate. And things like Kyiv independent updates, may well do more harm than good if they are believed to be gospel on a wider scale, as it portrays Ukraine as absolutely stomping the Russians which in turn feeds into the narrative Ukraine are winning the war.
The same as any figures at all from the Ukraine side are next to impossible to get, which is great in the respect it keeps them from the Russians, but it also serves to obscure it from western public opinion where they’d put pressure on their respective govts to do more to help
in reality it’s grinding to a never ending war unless Ukraine get more support and kit from europe as they haven’t the man power to go toe to toe with the Russians long term so have to redress that with better armaments and a much deeper supply of them
The same as any figures at all from the Ukraine side are next to impossible to get, which is great in the respect it keeps them from the Russians, but it also serves to obscure it from western public opinion where they’d put pressure on their respective govts to do more to help
in reality it’s grinding to a never ending war unless Ukraine get more support and kit from europe as they haven’t the man power to go toe to toe with the Russians long term so have to redress that with better armaments and a much deeper supply of them
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bomber
Striker
Nobody on the planet expected him to be invited.
Interpol had their fingers crossed he would turn up.
