Return to the office campaign...

Harry Angstrom said:
Working from home is an okay temporary fix but it isn't a long term solution for many businesses and people.

Training, communication, nuanced interaction with colleagues, loneliness and isolation, meeting people even the mundane interactions.

Solitary confinement is a massive punishment.

Baby thrown out with bath water if everyone starts working from home.
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I tend to agree.

I do think there's a happy medium to be had though.

At any rate, I can't go back until my clients go back. Even then they might limit visitors so its home for me for the forseeable.
 


I don’t believe people will decide on the whole, it will be a business decision based on cost to the employer.
If it’s cheaper and as productive, why rent and heat a building with all the other expense that comes along.

Software that checks on people productive attitude and results will be booming.
Maybe cameras similar to a dash cam to check on people will be introduced, some people take the piss others don’t.
 
There is clearly going to be a shift to more home working not just in the private but also public sector.
Can see in future being allowed 2/3 days in office and remainder WFH.

Why should businesses paying a fortune in prime location rents not rethink their locations programme ?
 
sonofagun said:
Tbf if your job can be done from home, how long until your boss decides he can save 70% on salaries by getting people in India to do the same job?
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Because, if my experience of 'off-shoring' is anything to go by, it's false economy.

We now use a lot of Indian Project Managers, Technical Architects and Business Analysts. We spend hours every week explaining the same concepts to different people and it's draining because they simply don't get it plus we lose hours off our productivity stats. They might be cheaper, but productivity-wise they're pretty useless - If it's not straight out of PM/TA/BA '101' then you might as well forget it.

We have the same issue with the Polish test resources that are gradually replacing our in-house teams - they're cheaper per day by about a third but it takes two of them to achieve the same results that one experienced in-house tester does - again, false economy.
 
Cappuccino Kid said:
It might have been more feasible a few years ago but most larger businesses seem to operate some sort of reduced capacity/hot desking environment nowadays. Making it a lot more difficult to sort out.

The government can’t even try and set an example. I work for HMRC and the office where I am is about 50-60% desks per 100% of people. They do seem bringing more people back but more on a priority and/or wellbeing basis.

It’ll be an absolute ball ache for any business who do this to sort rota system outs, then there’s the added cost of having to deep cleaning offices daily, toilets several times a day etc. So where people have the capability to WFH, I suspect it will continue until next year now.

Albeit it is no long term solution, but it’s daft to expect people to return to work en masse when we’re entering a vulnerable period.
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I'm in the civil service with friends and family in HMRC.

It's a bit rich the government asking people to return to the office for the sake of the economy, when it has gone full throttle to remove HMRC sites from city centres.

I'm pretty sure HMRC staff who worked in Sunderland city centre pumped around a million quid a year into the local economy, but the government still didn't give a shit.
 
Harry Angstrom said:
Working from home is an okay temporary fix but it isn't a long term solution for many businesses and people.

Training, communication, nuanced interaction with colleagues, loneliness and isolation, meeting people even the mundane interactions.

Solitary confinement is a massive punishment.

Baby thrown out with bath water if everyone starts working from home.
Click to expand...
Couldn't agree more Harry. The push to make this the 'new normal' has not been thought through. Flexibility is key. But not having WFH as the only option.

We need to get people back in offices and get city centres and business that rely on it back up and running again. Not doing it will do more harm than covid.

Mind, there is no push from my government department to go back to the office. At present, unless pushed from above, it'll not be until Jan.
 
North Yorks Mackem said:
I don't expect they will be. But maybe the heads of these rail companies will have to forgo a 7 figure bonus this year.

With the clear downturn in public transport passenger numbers it might actually be the spark needed to get them to rethink their pricing, particularly peak time fares.

If I get a train before 9 from northallerton to York it can cost 28 quid. Its ridiculous. After 9 its less than 12 quid. Many people just cant afford to use that service for work purposes. Maybe now, this pricing may be changed in favour of the customer, and that can only be a good thing.

Totally agree mate. And good point about the environment.

People will return in greater numbers to offices when they have confidence in doing so. But at the same time there needs to be acceptance that they arent going to return in the numbers we had pre covid. Think we'll more people splitting time between office and home in the future. And ultimately I think it'll be a very good thing.
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I agree but I doubt it. If anything they'll probably put the fares up to try and recover some of the money they are losing!
Cee Jay said:
There is clearly going to be a shift to more home working not just in the private but also public sector.
Can see in future being allowed 2/3 days in office and remainder WFH.

Why should businesses paying a fortune in prime location rents not rethink their locations programme ?
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This will be why they are panicking. All their investments will be tanking.
 
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West_Winger said:
It isn’t his responsibility, it’s his employers. The High Street has been dying for decades because landlords charge stupid money and the government has allowed businesses to build out of town shopping centres instead. Bus use has been dropping for years as well. The train industry is almost entirely subsidised by the government anyway. All this pandemic has done is accelerate a process that has been well under way long before now.
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could not be more wrong, bus use is increasing year on year in all cities . As for trains , again wrong, the most notable being grand central, 100% a commercial company.

I work for the biggest transport company in Europe .
 
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The King of Um said:
I think the reason a lot of office staff will continuing from working at home for at least part of the week if their employers allow is nothing to do with Covid, but because working at home makes their lives better in a number of ways.

I'm lucky, I live within two miles of where I work, but when people are paying 3-5k a year to be treated like cattle on over-crowded, often delayed trains for an hour or more at each end of the day, it's going to feel like a release. People will save money to spend on what they want, rather on what they have to do. Most of us spend money/time on making our houses nice places to be, and I'm fine spending more time in it. A 3/2 or 4/1 model would suit me just fine, and in my employer that's looking increasingly likely.

I do feel deeply sorry for everyone losing their jobs, but I don't think there's any moral obligation to prop up a particular business model. If Pret have two shops twenty yards from each other in one street, then any shift in the way people work is going to screw them, but that's not a reason not to change how we live and work. Some of the rhetoric is getting a little 'moral duty' too, and I wonder how many of the people using that tone buy off Amazon, or visit out of town retail parks, or book their holidays direct online to save money rather than go through a travel agents, or use self-service tills in supermarkets, or try on or get advice in shops but buy cheaper online...
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These are precisley the sort of moments that change the habits and patterns of life.

Just like the moment that changed the previous status qou around work and labour practices and shifted the economy away from predominantly blue collar manual labour vocations towards office professions.

What I find weird is that there are people who have seen multiple such shifts talking as though a change in the economy and working practices is somehow unthinkable or impossible
Chalks said:
could not be more wrong, bus use is increasing year on year in all cities . As for trains , again wrong, the most notable being grand central, 100% a commercial company.

I work for the biggest transport company in Europe .
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Cities yeah. Not everyone lives in a city though. If you live outside of a city in the UK bus travel is a lottery to put it generously.
 
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sonson said:
These are precisley the sort of moments that change the habits and patterns of life.

Just like the moment that changed the previous status qou around work and labour practices and shifted the economy away from predominantly blue collar manual labour vocations towards office professions.

What I find weird is that there are people who have seen multiple such shifts talking as though a change in the economy and working practices is somehow unthinkable or impossible

Cities yeah. Not everyone lives in a city though. If you live outside of a city in the UK bus travel is a lottery to put it generously.
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The push for carbon neutral will mean city centres as Newcastle are showing will stop cars being used . Electric buses are increasing, public transport will be used more and more.
 
Gaggoears said:
A couple of months ago the R number was everything according to the expert scientist and gov.
Weird how it is not mentioned anymore.
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Especially given the fact that the number of cases is currently higher than the number of cases in March, where at that point, the number was sufficient for the country to go into lockdown. (I appreciate the number of tests has increased significantly too and numerous other measures are in place, which will have some bearing, but still.)
 

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