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Relegation: The silver lining

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bagpuss
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I disagree with the dig that Keane started the rot.

I'd say the preseason after we finished tenth and Bruce bought Gardner, Larson, Vaughan, Elmo, ji, mclean was when it set in. Players there are not good enough. Then O'neill/Bruce combo spent 20m on fletcher, graham and n'diaye.
 

Deggsy said:
Relegation is not a good thing don't care what anyone says, we go down we want to come back up, so if we aspire to be a PL club i'd prefer to do any rebuilding in the PL
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I agree. But if coming up is anything like the last 10 years than I don't think I'd have the stomach for it.
 
The Fish said:
Dunno. For all I know he's got 12 players lined up to fire you to the title. Free transfers, loan deals and players bought with the money from departing players. Flair doesn't get you an automatic spot, pragmatism and solid back line does. That's why Brighton will probably win it this year and we'll go up in 2nd. Neither team plays expansively, tight at the back, efficient up front, and a player or two that's too good for the Championship.
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Can't see us having the resources to bring in players of sufficient quality unfortunately. Our 12-13 players that we will be left won't be as good as the likes of lascelles, gouffran, Dummett, mitrovic etc that you were left with. You could afford real championship stand out players in Gayle and Ritchie. Them sort of fees are nowhere near we can afford. We will be lucky to pay what you paid for squad players, like Hanley and Murphy. A top 6 finish would be an unbelievable achievement next season.

Aye as you say, staying solid and playing in a functional rigid way is probably the best way of going about getting promoted. That's certainly been the trend last couple of years. I remember Bournemouth playing some good stuff when they came up though.
 
The OP could have simply said that if there is a silver lining it is "a chance to act like a savvy professional take no prisoners football club". Not since we bought all that straw have we done that.
 
Bagpuss said:
Always a glass half full kind of guy I have been having a think about the positives of this relegation.

There is only one.

For years we have been dogged with shit recruitment that has had the knock on effect of managers having to buy bang average (worse than average) journeymen "Premier league" players hoping to mould them into some kind of team that will win enough games to stay up.

For me the seeds of this debacle were set when we signed every man and his dog on top dollar to get out of the Championship under Keane. To get those players they were offered big money and long contracts (them up the road should take note).......

We took years and years to get many of them off the books which then meant new signings were also impacted in terms of fees and wages available.

This relegation will finally give us an opportunity to clear the decks and to build the club from the bottom upwards. Re-evaluate everything from the Academy through the reserves (which always seem to perform to a high standard) and then how that transition continues into the first team which is where the whole thing seems to go shit shaped.

As fans I think we need to be patient, what would be a disaster is to get rid of the dross and because of fans impatience we then end up recreating the same scenario again buying sticking plasters to try and stem the blood flow of a severed artery.

One of the biggest issues is defining our identity as a club, that has been lost and if Im honest we havent had an identity since the Keane era and Reid before that.

We need to decide what kind of club we want to be; Southampton is often held up there as a sustainable, in fact desirable model and its hard to argue with that so what makes Southampton able to develop and sign player after player, get the best out of them and then sell them on for big money without actually impacting on performances.

With the facilities we have both in terms of a fan base, an incredible stadium, a brilliant academy facility and a support most of Europe would die to emulate then everything is in place for the right person to build a club we can all be proud of.

Now the fly in the ointment. Can any of this happen under the stewardship of Moyes and Short? I would love it to happen, I would love the stability of a long term owner and a manager who creates an Everton style identity and legacy. Im just not sure Short has the desire to make it happen anymore even if he cant sell and is Moyes really the inspirational character that has the desire and drive to create another Everton? I actually dont think we will have to wait long to find out tbh as Short will not be able to sell while we are in the Championship without taking a huge financial hit and while he is in charge I dont think there is the will to pay off a very expensive 4 year contract.

The decision as fans for us is do we back Moyes knowing he is clearly going nowhere and give ourselves a chance of rebuilding or create a poisonous environment in an attempt to get rid of him but one that will also damage our chances of getting promoted. I know what we should do and what is the sensible option but at the same time Moyes simply does nothing to inspire me to think he can succeed.

Sorry for the war and peace but at some point we have to start looking beyond this debacle of a season.
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cracking post @Bagpuss well said bonny lad.
 
Thing is we now have to rid the dross moyes has brought in after allardyce had started the cull . I wouldn't trust this bloke with another penny .
 
buster said:
I'm not looking forward to the JCL's jumping on the promotion band wagon assuming we reach such heady heights , fuckers didn't bother their arses this season when the chips were down , watch them flock back in their thousands.
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If Im your typical 30 year fan I think youre underestimating just how seething with the club many are. It'll take more than a few wins versus second rate shite.
 
The last 5 seasons has been like watching the same, shite film over and over and over again. It only gets decent for the last 10 mins, then it starts again and it's absolutely dreadful.

At least when we go down, whether it's good or bad, at least it's a different storyline to what we have had for years.
 
I'm looking forward to it I really am. I don't expect us to be cruising like Brighton if we have Moyes as manager but I'm fed up with just going to the match and going through the motions

Change is as good as a rest. I'm hoping to get my appetite for it back.
 
Bagpuss said:
Always a glass half full kind of guy I have been having a think about the positives of this relegation.

There is only one.

For years we have been dogged with shit recruitment that has had the knock on effect of managers having to buy bang average (worse than average) journeymen "Premier league" players hoping to mould them into some kind of team that will win enough games to stay up.

For me the seeds of this debacle were set when we signed every man and his dog on top dollar to get out of the Championship under Keane. To get those players they were offered big money and long contracts (them up the road should take note).......

We took years and years to get many of them off the books which then meant new signings were also impacted in terms of fees and wages available.

This relegation will finally give us an opportunity to clear the decks and to build the club from the bottom upwards. Re-evaluate everything from the Academy through the reserves (which always seem to perform to a high standard) and then how that transition continues into the first team which is where the whole thing seems to go shit shaped.

As fans I think we need to be patient, what would be a disaster is to get rid of the dross and because of fans impatience we then end up recreating the same scenario again buying sticking plasters to try and stem the blood flow of a severed artery.

One of the biggest issues is defining our identity as a club, that has been lost and if Im honest we havent had an identity since the Keane era and Reid before that.

We need to decide what kind of club we want to be; Southampton is often held up there as a sustainable, in fact desirable model and its hard to argue with that so what makes Southampton able to develop and sign player after player, get the best out of them and then sell them on for big money without actually impacting on performances.

With the facilities we have both in terms of a fan base, an incredible stadium, a brilliant academy facility and a support most of Europe would die to emulate then everything is in place for the right person to build a club we can all be proud of.

Now the fly in the ointment. Can any of this happen under the stewardship of Moyes and Short? I would love it to happen, I would love the stability of a long term owner and a manager who creates an Everton style identity and legacy. Im just not sure Short has the desire to make it happen anymore even if he cant sell and is Moyes really the inspirational character that has the desire and drive to create another Everton? I actually dont think we will have to wait long to find out tbh as Short will not be able to sell while we are in the Championship without taking a huge financial hit and while he is in charge I dont think there is the will to pay off a very expensive 4 year contract.

The decision as fans for us is do we back Moyes knowing he is clearly going nowhere and give ourselves a chance of rebuilding or create a poisonous environment in an attempt to get rid of him but one that will also damage our chances of getting promoted. I know what we should do and what is the sensible option but at the same time Moyes simply does nothing to inspire me to think he can succeed.

Sorry for the war and peace but at some point we have to start looking beyond this debacle of a season.
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I really want to like your post but this season has killed it for me.
 
ErichZann said:
We need to come back at the first attempt, and will do imo
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Good luck with that.

Personally as I've been here a while now I've grown very fond of Sunderland, but I fear you may be in for a shock.

We've built over 6 years to get here, Huddersfield the same, Leeds are run by twats and they are there in the mix, them up the road kept most of their team, Reading are strong, Sheffield Wednesday shouldn't be ignored, Fulham were the best team I've seen at he Amex his season.
Then you have Derby, Villa, Norwich, QPR, and Forest.

It will be a huge ask.
 
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