Post Ashes Thread

The warthog said:
Pope and Sibley can not be ignored going forward imo, need to be looking to build a team that can bat for a long time and isn’t full of white ball bashers. Winning the last match of the series shouldn’t cloud the fact that our batting has been largely horrendous since Ireland.

Bairstow out, Denly at 3 for a year and a bit, Sibley and Burns opening and Pope at 5.
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Cant comment on Sibley, never seen him. I don't judge players on short term county averages, dont know what his strengths are, whether or not he has an obvious technical flaw that would get found out against better bowling like Jennings for example who was also picked after one very good season when he had done little before. If those that have seen him week in, week out and know his game think hes good enough then fair enough.

Pope to me looks class, has loads of time similar to Ian Bell I think. He deserves to get in the side sooner rather than later.
 


hudson88 said:
Burns - I think he’s shown the ability and temperament to go forward as our opener, good series for him - 7/10

Denly - performed well opening, would have been nice to see him get his 100 yesterday. It’s his spot for now - 6/10

Root - his inability to convert 50s is a huge concern. Could do with a decent rest now before NZ - 6/10

Stokes - iconic performance at Headingley which will be remembered for years to come. Proven himself as world class yet again, especially with the bat - 9/10

Bairstow - poor series with the bat, if he’s got the gloves he needs to be at 7 IMO - 5/10

Buttler - bounced back in the last couple of games with some decent runs, again probably done enough to deserve his place going forward - 6/10

Curran - only one game which was a huge shame as he performed well. Offers variation with his left arm bowling, and should have had more of a chance IMO -

Woakes - another in need of a rest. He could be the one to drop out when Stokes/Anderson are fit - 5/10

Archer - exciting! Disappointing bowling performance 1st innings at Old Trafford but his performances other than that have been excellent - 8/10

Leach - cult status with the bat after Headingley, and he’s bowled well enough. Decision to be made between him and Ali - 6/10

Broad - bowled superbly. Really stood up in Anderson’s absence - 8/10

Roy - should not have been in the side as an opener, superb white ball player but not a test match batsman - 4/10

Ali - hopefully finds his form and gets back in the side soon as he’s a key part of our side when on form.

Overton - strange pick. Did alright, nothing more or less but again, not test match standard.

Anderson - huge, huge miss. Hopefully we see him back in the side.

You could look at it and say we haven’t won the series because of weather at Lords and some freakish batting from an all time great. Let ourselves down with some poor selections, captaincy and batting but it’s nice to see us win today and tie the series.

I actually don’t think the side is too far off, some tweaks and fine tuning needed but what a summer!!
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Solid post.
rentaghost said:
Cant comment on Sibley, never seen him. I don't judge players on short term county averages, dont know what his strengths are, whether or not he has an obvious technical flaw that would get found out against better bowling like Jennings for example who was also picked after one very good season when he had done little before. If those that have seen him week in, week out and know his game think hes good enough then fair enough.

Pope to me looks class, has loads of time similar to Ian Bell I think. He deserves to get in the side sooner rather than later.
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There was a very good long feature on him, Crawley and the lad from Lecistershire in the Times. Recommend you seek it out, if you can get behind the paywall.

It makes you feel optimistic on Sibley and Crawley in particular. Both have piled on the records as youngsters - they're not coming from leftfield. Surrey seemed to be spitting blood about losing Sibley too.
 
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Comeback_Kenwyne said:
Solid post.


There was a very good long feature on him, Crawley and the lad from Lecistershire in the Times. Recommend you seek it out, if you can get behind the paywall.

It makes you feel optimistic on Sibley and Crawley in particular. Both have piled on the records as youngsters - they're not coming from leftfield. Surrey seemed to be spitting blood about losing Sibley too.
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Cheers for that will seek it out. Alec Stewart was praising him the other day as well but he was also certain Roy would be a success opening so I took it with a pinch of salt :lol:
 
Thought a draw was fair, England probably should of snuck it 3-2 if anything.

The one and only difference.. Steve Smith so congrats to him on retaining the Ashes for them.. He's just on a complete different level.

As far as changes go, Denly and burns done enough to stay as the openers. we need to bring in a number 3. Root needs to go back to 4.

Bairstow needs to go and Buttler takes the WK position. Woakes had a bad series, but I feel he's worthy of another shot. I just love Jack Leach, I hope he doesn't lose his place. And it was about time Archer found some fire, loved his antics against Wade, shame he waited til the 5th test.

Man of the series for England.. BROAD!

overall it was hugely entertaining, and I'm gutted it's over.
 
hudson88 said:
Burns - I think he’s shown the ability and temperament to go forward as our opener, good series for him - 7/10

Denly - performed well opening, would have been nice to see him get his 100 yesterday. It’s his spot for now - 6/10

Root - his inability to convert 50s is a huge concern. Could do with a decent rest now before NZ - 6/10

Stokes - iconic performance at Headingley which will be remembered for years to come. Proven himself as world class yet again, especially with the bat - 9/10

Bairstow - poor series with the bat, if he’s got the gloves he needs to be at 7 IMO - 5/10

Buttler - bounced back in the last couple of games with some decent runs, again probably done enough to deserve his place going forward - 6/10

Curran - only one game which was a huge shame as he performed well. Offers variation with his left arm bowling, and should have had more of a chance IMO -

Woakes - another in need of a rest. He could be the one to drop out when Stokes/Anderson are fit - 5/10

Archer - exciting! Disappointing bowling performance 1st innings at Old Trafford but his performances other than that have been excellent - 8/10

Leach - cult status with the bat after Headingley, and he’s bowled well enough. Decision to be made between him and Ali - 6/10

Broad - bowled superbly. Really stood up in Anderson’s absence - 8/10

Roy - should not have been in the side as an opener, superb white ball player but not a test match batsman - 4/10

Ali - hopefully finds his form and gets back in the side soon as he’s a key part of our side when on form.

Overton - strange pick. Did alright, nothing more or less but again, not test match standard.

Anderson - huge, huge miss. Hopefully we see him back in the side.

You could look at it and say we haven’t won the series because of weather at Lords and some freakish batting from an all time great. Let ourselves down with some poor selections, captaincy and batting but it’s nice to see us win today and tie the series.

I actually don’t think the side is too far off, some tweaks and fine tuning needed but what a summer!!
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Fantastic post.
First, to appreciate the summer we’ve had. What a World Cup with the most thrilling of finales. And then the heroics of Headingley and not a bad rest of the series to boot. This summer will be talked about for ages.

Obviously I’m disappointed that we couldn’t win but I’m happy to leave with a draw and some World Test Championship points in the bank. Highlights came obviously in the form of Steve Smith in his first series of Test cricket since the debacle of South Africa and him proving why he really is on a different planet in terms of being an awe-inspiring batsman.

Stuart Broad and Jofra Archer did very well to step up in the absence of our all time highest wicket taker (hope to see him play again, I think we will) and I think Jofra will be very exciting for years to come in all formats and I’m looking forward to seeing him play against New Zealand. Broady obviously has a few years left in him - which is great because he’s shown his class continuously getting David Warner out. Woakes probably needs a rest.

At the top of the order, I reckon Burns and Denly have done enough to keep their places. Obviously you cannot drop Stokes. Bairstow and Buttler are difficult. Bairstow should be at 7 with the gloves in my opinion. Buttler probably has done enough to keep his place - maybe have a shuffle around the order though? I’d really like to see more of Sam Curran, who looked really good at The Oval with his left arm bowling - please take him to New Zealand! Jack Leach has obviously achieved cult status with the bat (all credit to him) but hasn’t been outstanding with the ball. I think they have a big decision to make between him and Ali, as Moeen is a huge part of the side when on form.

Joe Root should stay as the captain. A problem with him is his inability to convert half-centuries into centuries, but I’m thinking who else can you give it to? Perhaps a new coach will be the answer.


The Aussie bowling attack has been nothing short of spectacular, with Cummins, Hazlewood, Pattinson and Starc at Old Trafford causing us some real problems. Their top order is an issue, with Warner not at his best and Cameron Bancroft (should’ve stayed at Durham lad) and Marcus Harris looking mediocre.

Good series, and it’ll be intriguing to see what happens from here.
 
Key bowlers being absent through injury( Anderson and Wood particularly) Flipside Archer has performed extremely well for a Ashes/Test debutant.

Broad was excellent all series and stood up as the senior bowler (getting Warner 7 times out of 10 is canny going)

Burns has booked his ticket for the winter and looks to be a decent opener who can stick in and graft. We have to find a partner for him to open with on a consistent basis.

Root should bat at 4 and has to start getting some tons. He bowled well today and should probably bowl more than he does although I think a back injury has limited him in the past.

Bairstow has kept pretty well, must get more runs. In fairness he did act as an excellent catalyst for Stokes at Headingley but that's not a get out of jail card.

Curran looks decent and will improve with age, seems to have a good temperament, likes a battle.

With a fully fit squad we can put out a very strong team, and with the lessons that will/should have been learnt this series by the individual player particularly the batsmen the team can move forward and hopefully progress.

I'm interested to see who will replace Bayliss.

All in all a good summer for the England Cricket team, World cup win and a drawn series in the Ashes, if only the footy team were as good!
hudson88 said:
Burns - I think he’s shown the ability and temperament to go forward as our opener, good series for him - 7/10

Denly - performed well opening, would have been nice to see him get his 100 yesterday. It’s his spot for now - 6/10

Root - his inability to convert 50s is a huge concern. Could do with a decent rest now before NZ - 6/10

Stokes - iconic performance at Headingley which will be remembered for years to come. Proven himself as world class yet again, especially with the bat - 9/10

Bairstow - poor series with the bat, if he’s got the gloves he needs to be at 7 IMO - 5/10

Buttler - bounced back in the last couple of games with some decent runs, again probably done enough to deserve his place going forward - 6/10

Curran - only one game which was a huge shame as he performed well. Offers variation with his left arm bowling, and should have had more of a chance IMO -

Woakes - another in need of a rest. He could be the one to drop out when Stokes/Anderson are fit - 5/10

Archer - exciting! Disappointing bowling performance 1st innings at Old Trafford but his performances other than that have been excellent - 8/10

Leach - cult status with the bat after Headingley, and he’s bowled well enough. Decision to be made between him and Ali - 6/10

Broad - bowled superbly. Really stood up in Anderson’s absence - 8/10

Roy - should not have been in the side as an opener, superb white ball player but not a test match batsman - 4/10

Ali - hopefully finds his form and gets back in the side soon as he’s a key part of our side when on form.

Overton - strange pick. Did alright, nothing more or less but again, not test match standard.

Anderson - huge, huge miss. Hopefully we see him back in the side.

You could look at it and say we haven’t won the series because of weather at Lords and some freakish batting from an all time great. Let ourselves down with some poor selections, captaincy and batting but it’s nice to see us win today and tie the series.

I actually don’t think the side is too far off, some tweaks and fine tuning needed but what a summer!!
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Agree with this^ For a touring squad I would take Woakes.
 
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Vaughan nailed it. We need to remodel this side and learn to bat long and bat big. Some of the selections were a joke (Ali, Roy, Overton) and many fans questioned them at the time.
The warthog said:
Pope and Sibley can not be ignored going forward imo, need to be looking to build a team that can bat for a long time and isn’t full of white ball bashers. Winning the last match of the series shouldn’t cloud the fact that our batting has been largely horrendous since Ireland.

Bairstow out, Denly at 3 for a year and a bit, Sibley and Burns opening and Pope at 5.
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Spot on.

Burns
Sibley
Denly
Root
Pope
Stokes
Buttler+
Leach
Archer
Broad
Anderson (Woakes if unfit)

We also need the likes of Hain, Northeast, Ballance, Foakes, Curran and Bairstow fighting hard for places. There is too little competition for places, creating complacency. If you have a shit game you should expect to get dropped.
 
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Hoped for a win, wasn’t really convinced we would have enough batting wise after Cook retired. Anderson being ruled out was a near fatal blow that’s been hugely underplayed in the media. Archer was a revelation though. That Sunday at Headingley will go down as legendary. Happy with 2-2.
 
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hudson88 said:
Burns - I think he’s shown the ability and temperament to go forward as our opener, good series for him - 7/10

Denly - performed well opening, would have been nice to see him get his 100 yesterday. It’s his spot for now - 6/10

Root - his inability to convert 50s is a huge concern. Could do with a decent rest now before NZ - 6/10

Stokes - iconic performance at Headingley which will be remembered for years to come. Proven himself as world class yet again, especially with the bat - 9/10

Bairstow - poor series with the bat, if he’s got the gloves he needs to be at 7 IMO - 5/10

Buttler - bounced back in the last couple of games with some decent runs, again probably done enough to deserve his place going forward - 6/10

Curran - only one game which was a huge shame as he performed well. Offers variation with his left arm bowling, and should have had more of a chance IMO -

Woakes - another in need of a rest. He could be the one to drop out when Stokes/Anderson are fit - 5/10

Archer - exciting! Disappointing bowling performance 1st innings at Old Trafford but his performances other than that have been excellent - 8/10

Leach - cult status with the bat after Headingley, and he’s bowled well enough. Decision to be made between him and Ali - 6/10

Broad - bowled superbly. Really stood up in Anderson’s absence - 8/10

Roy - should not have been in the side as an opener, superb white ball player but not a test match batsman - 4/10

Ali - hopefully finds his form and gets back in the side soon as he’s a key part of our side when on form.

Overton - strange pick. Did alright, nothing more or less but again, not test match standard.

Anderson - huge, huge miss. Hopefully we see him back in the side.

You could look at it and say we haven’t won the series because of weather at Lords and some freakish batting from an all time great. Let ourselves down with some poor selections, captaincy and batting but it’s nice to see us win today and tie the series.

I actually don’t think the side is too far off, some tweaks and fine tuning needed but what a summer!!
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I think you've undersold Leach with a 6 - I think he's bowled solidly - but no disagreements from me otherwise.

Archer restricted to an 8 for me more for his batting than his Old Trafford bowling, too
 
rentaghost said:
Cant comment on Sibley, never seen him. I don't judge players on short term county averages, dont know what his strengths are, whether or not he has an obvious technical flaw that would get found out against better bowling like Jennings for example who was also picked after one very good season when he had done little before. If those that have seen him week in, week out and know his game think hes good enough then fair enough.

Pope to me looks class, has loads of time similar to Ian Bell I think. He deserves to get in the side sooner rather than later.
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I remember watching Sibley open the batting in a low key one day game at the Riverside for Surrey when he was about 18. He stood out straight away actually reminded me of Nicky Peng at the same age.
It looks nailed in both he and Pope will tour with England this winter.
I reckon all the major players this summer will be tested from yours or certain series this winter. Stokes especially!
 
smoker said:
Vaughan nailed it. We need to remodel this side and learn to bat long and bat big. Some of the selections were a joke (Ali, Roy, Overton) and many fans questioned them at the time.

Spot on.

Burns
Sibley
Denly
Root
Pope
Stokes
Buttler+
Leach
Archer
Broad
Anderson (Woakes if unfit)

We also need the likes of Hain, Northeast, Ballance, Foakes, Curran and Bairstow fighting hard for places. There is too little competition for places, creating complacency. If you have a shit game you should expect to get dropped.
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That tail is the stuff of nightmares. Some people won't want to hear it: but I'd be doing everything to get Ali back in form and in the team.

Starting with the obvious decision to take Saqlain Musthtag off his ridiculous consultant contract and give him a full-time job - he's the only specialist coach that seems to have made a discernible difference in recent years.

By the way, the idea that selecting Ali for Edgbaston, who was the leading calendar wicket-taker in Test Cricket at the time, is utterly absurd. If anything, the selectors showed a ruthless streak taking him out when they did. People will say - oh he was out of form, but not with the ball he wasn't. Absurd hingsight-ism.

What I would say about your team is the batting line up to Buttler is exactly right and picks itself tbh. Can't for the life of me understand why people would disagree, but they will.
 
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Still gutted about hameed, looked the real deal in India, sound technique and shot selection.
Wouldn't mind durham taking a punt on him tbh.

Australia won because smith batted like Bradman and Cummins bowled like McGrath with Hazlewood supporting and england batted like muppets against Lyon in the 1st test. Labashagne provided good batting support.
Australia were carried by 2 batsman and 2 seamers.
Unfortunately they out performed the 2 batsman and 2 bowlers that carried our team (stokes, burns, archer broad).
If only for good weather at lord's you never know how the series would have gone
 
smoker said:
Vaughan nailed it. We need to remodel this side and learn to bat long and bat big. Some of the selections were a joke (Ali, Roy, Overton) and many fans questioned them at the time.

Spot on.

Burns
Sibley
Denly
Root
Pope
Stokes
Buttler+
Leach
Archer
Broad
Anderson (Woakes if unfit)

We also need the likes of Hain, Northeast, Ballance, Foakes, Curran and Bairstow fighting hard for places. There is too little competition for places, creating complacency. If you have a shit game you should expect to get dropped.
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How was picking Mo Ali a joke? He'd taken the most test wickets in the previous 12 months and totally out bowled Nathan Lyon

He is a quality test cricketer who constantly gets good playersout and deserves more respect here

I agree with your team,although everyone picking Sibley has never seen him play I bet
 
Other than Roy, who was out of his depth opening, I don't think there were many who were terrible and should be discarded. As has been pointed out, we lost because Smith was brilliant. There will be a couple of spaces going for the winter tours, I'd be tempted to chuck Lewis Gregory's name into the mix of those already mentioned.
 
I think what people don't give credit to, lack of patience or whatever, is how much ODI cricket the all format players have played, and how little time they have had to practice red ball

Root, Bairstow, Buttler, Stokes, Roy, Ali

Some have performed better than others, some will be better at adapting, but its effected all of them, they are are all (bar Roy) proven red ball players, but they ain;t robots, some of them before the Ashes hadn't played a red ball game in 6 months, how can they be expected just to go and start from ball one

What I want to see now is players rested for ODI series, given the chance to play county games, or even 4 day games abroad in preperation for tests

Its been totally ignore last 4 years, rightly so, but now is priority

Is it any coincidence that Jos Buttler looked the part in the last 2 games rather than the first 2? no.

Mo Ali had the most wickets in the world in the previous 12 months, in the world!! then he has an extended time off, no red ball games for months, and he is bowling on day 1 of an Ashes, its hard for him just to turn it on like.

I feel like fans just want an automatic world class ODI and test side without any thought of how hard it is to achieve that. Players get criticised far too much for me.
 
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I would still consider Sam Northeast as well as Sibley or Pope to boost our batting.
A mate of mine was at Hampshire v Sussex last week where Pope played superbly in tough conditions, but he said Northeast was at least as good in getting 70-odd.
Northeast is a bit older but he has great captaincy experience, and I think the question of the captaincy will be rearing its ugly head again before long.
 
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Comeback_Kenwyne said:
That tail is the stuff of nightmares. Some people won't want to hear it: but I'd be doing everything to get Ali back in form and in the team.

Starting with the obvious decision to take Saqlain Musthtag off his ridiculous consultant contract and give him a full-time job - he's the only specialist coach that seems to have made a discernible difference in recent years.

By the way, the idea that selecting Ali for Edgbaston, who was the leading calendar wicket-taker in Test Cricket at the time, is utterly absurd. If anything, the selectors showed a ruthless streak taking him out when they did. People will say - oh he was out of form, but not with the ball he wasn't. Absurd hingsight-ism.

What I would say about your team is the batting line up to Buttler is exactly right and picks itself tbh. Can't for the life of me understand why people would disagree, but they will.
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I definitely agree with Ali mind, as a major concern with that team is Buttler or even Stokes been stranded not out for a low score which I hate.

As your point about the top 7 picking itself and been such a obvious selection, tend to disagree slightly.

Can see how it’s balanced and people in correct position so defintely see where you coming from.

But two of them players are anything but proven and may or may not be a success, but impossible to tell at the moment, so do fail to see how you suggesting it’s such a obvious selection on that basis.
 
Voice of fair play said:
4


I definitely agree with Ali mind, as a major concern with that team is Buttler or even Stokes been stranded not out for a low score which I hate.

As your point about the top 7 picking itself and been such a obvious selection, tend to disagree slightly.

Can see how it’s balanced and people in correct position so defintely see where you coming from.

But two of them players are anything but proven and may or may not be a success, but impossible to tell at the moment, so do fail to see how you suggesting it’s such a obvious selection on that basis.
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I think Sibley's numbers after his two centuries this week (one a double) starting to become impossible to ignore.

He's at near 42 for career average now, with nearer 70 than 60 for the season. He's 23 and should be looked at on those numbers. Might not work, but they are better numbers than anyone but Burns has put up to win a crack.
 

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