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Newcastle thread Oct and Nov 2020

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Carrick18 said:
At Champ level or Prem? Champ I agreee, but Prem none of those three are proven at all.
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Perez certainly is and some credit to Rafa for that I think. Played over 30 times for an excellent Leicester side last season. Mitrovic and Gayle are as good as you get at champ level and useful for lower end prem imo
 

rentaghost said:
Perez certainly is and some credit to Rafa for that I think. Played over 30 times for an excellent Leicester side last season. Mitrovic and Gayle are as good as you get at champ level and useful for lower end prem imo
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Spot on.
Roker Mackem said:
Well same here really. I hate it. But then I always keep tabs on what their score is.
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That’s rivalry.Watching the full 90 minutes now again is rivalry.There are plenty on here who watch every game they play whenever possible.That’s obsession.
 
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safctommie said:
Spot on.

That’s rivalry.Watching the full 90 minutes now again is rivalry.There are plenty on here who watch every game they play whenever possible.That’s obsession.
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Yeah true. In my experience living on Tyneside. Theres loads of Mags head over heels obsessed with us. Watching us on dodgy streams etc
 
mr chuckles said:
I know a lad at work who has been a ST holder at SJP for years he hated Benitez and said it was the worst football he's watched for years. He doesn't particularly like Bruce but he says the football is no worse now than it was then
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Depends what you want from football, I guess? I want to see chances created, goals scored, good passing play, clean sheets, and tackles. Last season, Bruce's Newcastle were among thee lowest (if not the lowest) in the league for all of those things.

The football under Benitez in the Premier League wasn't the cavalier, gung-ho football of Keegan, or even Robson. It was negative, pragmatic and built on a solid defence, if that's not your bag, then fair dos, but Bruce's football was both negative and shit.
rentaghost said:
I think many people would. I think the argument has never been about which one is the best manager in general. Its more about which manager has done better during their time there and highlighting the excuses given to Benitez for any given circumstance and the criticism given to Bruce in similar circumstances. Benitez loses 3-0 away to Oxford = sack the board, Bruce wins a tie away to Newport and its all his fault for only just getting through. Newcastle lose a load of games in a row under Benitez its the players fault - what he supposed to do with that shower of shite etc.

There's also different ways of getting points on the board. With Rafa its all about structure, Bruce is more concerned with allowing freedom to players such as ASM, Almiron and Shelvey which Rafa just wouldn't entertain. It means Bruce's side will get more drubbings but also win some games playing badly because of some individual quality. I don't think making your team very defensively sound at the expensive of attacking flair is the tactical brilliance some make out.


To be honest if you cant get goals out of a Mitrovic, Perez and Gayle at that level of football there must be something wrong and he couldnt really get a tune out of Perez for a lot of the season IIRC.
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I don't think that's what the argument is about. I think it's about; Newcastle fans supported Benitez, therefore he's overrated & Newcastle fans criticise Bruce, therefore he's underrated.

I've tried to move on from the comparisons between the managers, I really have. So lets be clear; Bruce isn't a good football manager because he doesn't restrict his flair players with pesky things like tactics and coaching. That makes him a bad manager. It's fine when we win, but more often than not we've looked clueless defensively, have no control in the middle, and toothless up front. Last season we were terrible and if football was played on a spreadsheet we would have been relegated.

I think making your team easy to beat to accommodate attacking flair is tactically inept. Especially when you don't set the team up to get the most out of that available attacking flair. "Give it to Maxi" isn't a tactic, it's a Hail Mary. If you want to throw caution to the wind, fine but then get more players up the pitch to give ASM some support. It's a criticism that's followed Bruce around, his teams lack a defining characteristic, they're not defensively solid, they're not interested in controlling possession, they're not dangerous up front.
 
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The Fish said:
Depends what you want from football, I guess? I want to see chances created, goals scored, good passing play, clean sheets, and tackles. Last season, Bruce's Newcastle were among thee lowest (if not the lowest) in the league for all of those things.

The football under Benitez in the Premier League wasn't the cavalier, gung-ho football of Keegan, or even Robson. It was negative, pragmatic and built on a solid defence, if that's not your bag, then fair dos, but Bruce's football was both negative and shit.

I don't think that's what the argument is about. I think it's about; Newcastle fans supported Benitez, therefore he's overrated & Newcastle fans criticise Bruce, therefore he's underrated.

I've tried to move on from the comparisons between the managers, I really have. So lets be clear; Bruce isn't a good football manager because he doesn't restrict his flair players with pesky things like tactics and coaching. That makes him a bad manager. It's fine when we win, but more often than not we've looked clueless defensively, have no control in the middle, and toothless up front. Last season we were terrible and if football was played on a spreadsheet we would have been relegated.

I think making your team easy to beat to accommodate attacking flair is tactically inept. Especially when you don't set the team up to get the most out of that available attacking flair. "Give it to Maxi" isn't a tactic, it's a Hail Mary. If you want to throw caution to the wind, fine but then get more players up the pitch to give ASM some support. It's a criticism that's followed Bruce around, his teams lack a defining characteristic, they're not defensively solid, they're not interested in controlling possession, they're not dangerous up front.
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Yet still he gets you more points per game in the top flight than the tactical magician Benitez. 😂
 
Scunny Dan said:
Yet still he gets you more points per game in the top flight than the tactical magician Benitez. 😂
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:lol: With that attacking line up? You'd want to f***ing hope he would better the points return.

The point, which has always been my point, is that Steve Bruce isn't a good football manager and no other Premier League club would have given him a job.
 
The Fish said:
:lol: With that attacking line up? You'd want to f***ing hope he would better the points return.

The point, which has always been my point, is that Steve Bruce isn't a good football manager and no other Premier League club would have given him a job.
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Don't like Bruce particularly, but always had Benitez down as half politician, and Newcastle fans hero worship of the greedy git galled me. Suckered you in like Diamond Joe Quimby mate, all it took was praising the City and slagging your owner.
 
Scunny Dan said:
Don't like Bruce particularly, but always had Benitez down as half politician, and Newcastle fans hero worship of the greedy git galled me. Suckered you in like Diamond Joe Quimby mate, all it took was praising the City and slagging your owner.
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Dunno, plenty of managers talk up the city and whatnot. More to it than just that. Have to produce on the pitch, that's why we didn't take to Dalglish, Gullit, Souness, Allardyce, McClaren. Benitez played to the crowd, but he delivered and, in my opinion, could have delivered more if he'd been given more control.

But he's gone now and we're stuck with Steve f***ing Bruce.
 
Scunny Dan said:
Don't like Bruce particularly, but always had Benitez down as half politician, and Newcastle fans hero worship of the greedy git galled me. Suckered you in like Diamond Joe Quimby mate, all it took was praising the City and slagging your owner.
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Shhh man, there's only Sunderland supporters have that opinion of Benitez. The mags on here keep telling us, so it must be true.

You're wasting your time with the poster you are replying to, he's still tucked up in his rafa duvet cover.
 
The Fish said:
Dunno, plenty of managers talk up the city and whatnot. More to it than just that. Have to produce on the pitch, that's why we didn't take to Dalglish, Gullit, Souness, Allardyce, McClaren. Benitez played to the crowd, but he delivered and, in my opinion, could have delivered more if he'd been given more control.

But he's gone now and we're stuck with Steve f***ing Bruce.
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Who’s doing a better job than Rafa
 
The Fish said:
:lol: With that attacking line up? You'd want to f***ing hope he would better the points return.

The point, which has always been my point, is that Steve Bruce isn't a good football manager and no other Premier League club would have given him a job.
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Isn't about time you stopped banging the Benitez drum he's long gone and all your doing is repeating yourself
 
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