KP Retires

[The Rat]

They were pig sick because it was all about KP, the IPL, the big money, wanting to miss games to maximise earnings etc. Amazing that a lot of the chew on he had has been resolved now and players can now have their cake and eat it. As I said if other players had been in his position he may have found some allies. Sure he said in his book that Prior was very much against KP wanting to miss games for his own ends due to these 20/20 franchises. Apparently he got a gig in the big bash and he was lapping it up
As I’ve saud KP has an ego and it seems he’s someone who is very forthright which rubs people up the wrong way, combine that with his frustration at not being allowed to maximise his earnings and having no sympathetic ears in dressing room as the others who’d put themselves up auction had been shunned it makes for the situation we got. Could’ve and should’ve been handled much better. The fact the ECB now give the players more leeway is an acknowledgement on their part that they now know it wasn’t the right thing to do.


What team secrets?

Why are you obsessing over the IPL and that?

He played for England throughout that entire period, had absolutely nothing to do with him being dropped

Had nothing to do with him trying to get Peter Moores sacked in his first few months as captain, or texting opposition players when we are the best team in the world

Listen, if your argument is " he was our best player, just let the behaviour go" then I actually understand your argument, I don't agree, but I understand where you are coming from

what I don't get is you actually trying to defend the individual things he has done throughout his career, as they aren't defendable, and it undermines your argument.

I accept that you always wanted him picked, that is fine, but he had every right for being dropped. It was only completely and utterly down to Cook that he got a 2nd chance

Maybe in his book he should have thanked Cook instead of slagging him off, as the ECB were ready to wash their hands with him. He was given more than enough chances

He played 100 tests, was brilliant, his career wasn't cut short, people go on like he played 30 tests and was axed. Played unitl he was like 35 didn't he?

 

[Voice of fair play]

They were pig sick because it was all about KP, the IPL, the big money, wanting to miss games to maximise earnings etc. Amazing that a lot of the chew on he had has been resolved now and players can now have their cake and eat it. As I said if other players had been in his position he may have found some allies. Sure he said in his book that Prior was very much against KP wanting to miss games for his own ends due to these 20/20 franchises. Apparently he got a gig in the big bash and he was lapping it up
As I’ve saud KP has an ego and it seems he’s someone who is very forthright which rubs people up the wrong way, combine that with his frustration at not being allowed to maximise his earnings and having no sympathetic ears in dressing room as the others who’d put themselves up auction had been shunned it makes for the situation we got. Could’ve and should’ve been handled much better. The fact the ECB now give the players more leeway is an acknowledgement on their part that they now know it wasn’t the right thing to do.

Tbf I have no issue with him wanting to play in the IPL and fully agree with him wanting to play there and of course tbf to you they will have been some jealousy its human nature.

And of course he was right over that one issue.

However with KP trouble seems to have followed him throughout his career and the public and posters on here do not dislike him for that, Notts never fell out with him for that, etc etc.

While you may have a point with some islolated incidents, without the risk of repeating myself the England set obviously just had enough of him and imo there was much more too it, than jealously of the IPL.

I suspect you know that too, he must have been more trouble than he was worth.

 

[Mrjardine]

Why are you obsessing over the IPL and that?

He played for England throughout that entire period, had absolutely nothing to do with him being dropped

Had nothing to do with him trying to get Peter Moores sacked in his first few months as captain, or texting opposition players when we are the best team in the world

Listen, if your argument is " he was our best player, just let the behaviour go" then I actually understand your argument, I don't agree, but I understand where you are coming from

what I don't get is you actually trying to defend the individual things he has done throughout his career, as they aren't defendable, and it undermines your argument.

I accept that you always wanted him picked, that is fine, but he had every right for being dropped. It was only completely and utterly down to Cook that he got a 2nd chance

Maybe in his book he should have thanked Cook instead of slagging him off, as the ECB were ready to wash their hands with him. He was given more than enough chances

He played 100 tests, was brilliant, his career wasn't cut short, people go on like he played 30 tests and was axed. Played unitl he was like 35 didn't he?

Because the IPL played a massive part in it all. The texting opposition players will have been all part of the frustration of the IPL situation IMO. He won’t have had anyone in the dressing room to sound off to about it.
I’m giving my take on why I think it played out the way it did, I’m not saying KP is perfect but two sides to every story and you only seem to want to hear the one in which KP is the devil.
He was 33 and it was cut short as I think we could’ve had another 2 or 3 years from him.

 

[The Rat]

Because the IPL played a massive part in it all. The texting opposition players will have been all part of the frustration of the IPL situation IMO. He won’t have had anyone in the dressing room to sound off to about it.
I’m giving my take on why I think it played out the way it did, I’m not saying KP is perfect but two sides to every story and you only seem to want to hear the one in which KP is the devil.
He was 33 and it was cut short as I think we could’ve had another 2 or 3 years from him.

I think they did very well to get 100 tests out of him, his form was fading, partly due to his knees, and his last tests he averaged just over 30 I think

while that isn't the worst in the world, with the baggage he comes with then I understand why they got rid

Personally, I would have sacked him after the texting affair, but they made the decision to bring him back, I think the criticism of Cook in particular by some, especially in the media and ex players, was very harsh, considering it was completely him that got KP back in the side.

My last point on this, as its tiring, the way he behaved after getting left out after the Ashes was absolutely ridiculous, just like childish. He isn't the first player to be left out and certainly wasn't the last.

If he had kept his mouth shut and went and played CC for a few years, I guarantee he would have been back in

Instead he hired Piers Morgan to slander the England team constantly, and wrote a book, which is the type of petty book I would write after falling out with Sweeper on here. It was just a ridiculous thing to do for a 33 year old man with 100 test caps.

Whether you agreed with his dropping or not, there was no way he could come back after that, and I never understood how people genuinely believed he could. You'd have to drop all the other senior players, which were certainly more valuable than KP. I even remember Root saying years ago that there was no way back now.

Anyway, I'm done.

 

[Buchans Boots]

......and the public and posters on here do not dislike him for that, Notts never fell out with him for that, etc etc.

As far as I was aware KP was always popular with the cricket fans of England. It was the England players and the ECB that he ended up not being popular with. As for the posters on here. IMHO there is a lot of old school naivety from some posters about the modern world that we live in. Its an era of text messaging, huge egos, big money; yet some still live in a Tom Browns Schooldays world where sportsmen play for the shirt and bite their lip, its tea at 4pm and the Pimms is chilled.

When the ECB are setting the arrogance bar at the highest you can get, a symptom of that will be arrogant players. KP was a symptom of that. However of course we have seen since time immemorial that England, whether its football or cricket do not like extreme arrogance (which couples at times with extreme talent). Goes right the way back to Shackleton hardly getting any caps for England, Clough being over looked for the England job etc.

In the end, England couldnt handle KP. Management skills lacking and it was easier to get rid, rather than manage.

 

[Voice of fair play]

As far as I was aware KP was always popular with the cricket fans of England. It was the England players and the ECB that he ended up not being popular with. As for the posters on here. IMHO there is a lot of old school naivety from some posters about the modern world that we live in. Its an era of text messaging, huge egos, big money; yet some still live in a Tom Browns Schooldays world where sportsmen play for the shirt and bite their lip, its tea at 4pm and the Pimms is chilled.

When the ECB are setting the arrogance bar at the highest you can get, a symptom of that will be arrogant players. KP was a symptom of that. However of course we have seen since time immemorial that England, whether its football or cricket do not like extreme arrogance (which couples at times with extreme talent). Goes right the way back to Shackleton hardly getting any caps for England, Clough being over looked for the England job etc.

In the end, England couldnt handle KP. Management skills lacking and it was easier to get rid, rather than manage.

Normally as you point out good players are managed and accomdated,the very fact he wasn’t suggest despite his talent,suggest only one thing to me.

And that is,they were just pig sick of him,I could go through them but throughout his careeer he is a serial faller out with people.

It must have been pretty bad and constant or else they would have kept picking him to help them win games.

 

[Mrjardine]

Tbf I have no issue with him wanting to play in the IPL and fully agree with him wanting to play there and of course tbf to you they will have been some jealousy its human nature.

And of course he was right over that one issue.

However with KP trouble seems to have followed him throughout his career and the public and posters on here do not dislike him for that, Notts never fell out with him for that, etc etc.

While you may have a point with some islolated incidents, without the risk of repeating myself the England set obviously just had enough of him and imo there was much more too it, than jealously of the IPL.

I suspect you know that too, he must have been more trouble than he was worth.

The thing is we have no idea exactly what he did that was so bad. Not one person has been able to come out and say it so I have no idea how anyone can have such a negative opinion of him.
He fell out with Jason Gallian, as far as I’m aware he had no fall out at Hampshire as he was never there, no issues at Surrey whatsoever and he’s been very well received by the various franchises he’s played for.
English people are very suspicious off arrogance/confidence and seem much more comfortable with the quiet almost apologetic attitude that some adopt. People like Bruno more popular than Lewis, Coe more popular than ovett, boycott unpopular, even Brian Clough wasn’t everyone’s cup of tea. Me personally I like arrogance/confidence providing it’s backed up. He obviously spoke his mind and ruffled feathers which again isn’t a very English characteristic.
From what we know he did very little wrong really, he called his captain in a text, big deal. There was no evidence of real secrets being given away either.
He wanted to be treat differently due to the IPL and IMO that didn’t sit well with lads who weren’t deemed to be good enough. Ironic that IPL lads are treat differently now.
One more thing that people conveniently ignore with the nasty KP. He went on record as saying he didn’t understand why the IPL were ignoring our players for second rate Aussies, going into bat for his teammates in public. Whenever wickets were taken or centuries scored he was always in the thick of the celebrations and happy.
Until someone can tell me what he did that was so bad I fail to see how anyone can have that much of an issue with him.

 

[Voice of fair play]

The thing is we have no idea exactly what he did that was so bad. Not one person has been able to come out and say it so I have no idea how anyone can have such a negative opinion of him.
He fell out with Jason Gallian, as far as I’m aware he had no fall out at Hampshire as he was never there, no issues at Surrey whatsoever and he’s been very well received by the various franchises he’s played for.
English people are very suspicious off arrogance/confidence and seem much more comfortable with the quiet almost apologetic attitude that some adopt. People like Bruno more popular than Lewis, Coe more popular than ovett, boycott unpopular, even Brian Clough wasn’t everyone’s cup of tea. Me personally I like arrogance/confidence providing it’s backed up. He obviously spoke his mind and ruffled feathers which again isn’t a very English characteristic.
From what we know he did very little wrong really, he called his captain in a text, big deal. There was no evidence of real secrets being given away either.
He wanted to be treat differently due to the IPL and IMO that didn’t sit well with lads who weren’t deemed to be good enough. Ironic that IPL lads are treat differently now.
One more thing that people conveniently ignore with the nasty KP. He went on record as saying he didn’t understand why the IPL were ignoring our players for second rate Aussies, going into bat for his teammates in public. Whenever wickets were taken or centuries scored he was always in the thick of the celebrations and happy.
Until someone can tell me what he did that was so bad I fail to see how anyone can have that much of an issue with him.

I am sorry like, but imo although he was dead right about the IPL, he wasn't going into bat for England players he was doing it for himself.

By the time he got dropped all the issues with the IPL had been sorted more or less.

I will give you your point with the IPL as a whole I agree with you.

But don't accept any of your comparisons as all irrevlant, I don't dislike him for his arrogance as agree once again that if you can back it up,arrogance in sport is good to see,

Ali been the great example, perceived by some as the greatest of all and loved.

You hit the nail on the head nobody knows exactly what went on behind closed doors, but I just simply can't get away
With him been dropped when clearly good enough.

The very fact he did says everything to me and tells a massive story, and I don't think for one moment it was beacuse of jealousy.

 

[Ageing trundler]

Couldn't bring myself to read Swann's book but I'm guessing he never addressed the issue. Interesting to see what Cook, Broad and Anderson have to say when they retire.