Keel Crossing [opened 18.10.25] - compendium thread

[PhilY]

Show me where the council said that
And if they did, as has been pointed out to you a million times , the project could have been delayed for one of a million unforeseen reasons.

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why do you continually ignore that they've said it'll be open in the autumn?

Because they previously said it would be the summer.

 

[tunstallhill]

You think the architect has no input on the project timeline?!

He will have input , as will dozens and dozens of different departments and sun contractors , designers (m+e , civils , structural etc...) and there will be professional planners employed throughout the project who link everything together.

You are demonstrating a blatant lack of knowledge about how these projects operate.

 

[bobster999]

No, of course not - and I didn’t say that.

Why are you creating wholly fictitious claims?

so why say this then if it's an irrelevant point

"the bridge structure has been up for 13 months and the project still isn’t complete, so it’s late."

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Because they previously said it would be the summer.

you're a knacker who probably posts on sunderland corruption

 

[dancingradio]

He will have input , as will dozens and dozens of different departments and sun contractors , designers (m+e , civils , structural etc...) and there will be professional planners employed throughout the project who link everything together.

You are demonstrating a blatant lack of knowledge about how these projects operate.

Also the main contractors website has an overview of the project where they mention the 2025 date and later than the same page they mention the 2024 date. Its almost like websites are edited by someone in the comms department who is mostly admin and not directly by the project team involved

 

[tunstallhill]

Never known an architect have any power on any project program ive seen. They can input their related timelines but the construction programme will be controlled by the main contractor and overseen by the project/program management team

Exactly..most architects have done the bulk of their work prior to the main contractor being nominated..the contractor will tender for the project based on the architects design and the clients program. They'll not commit to a program that they think is unachievable, hence why programs are updated and reworked constantly throughout pre construction and throughout the construction phase . The architect won't be involved in any of that

 

[cosmicchris00]

The entitlement. Stroll on pal wouldnt give you my seat on the bus if you had 2 broken legs

So it seems that link isn't something you're too proud of. Having now located it, that's hardly surprising.

Amid your somewhat incoherent posts insulting others and making rash statements, it seems you've posted the PR statement from the Principal Contractor.

FYI, they'll be the ones on the hook here so their wording will be very carefully chosen.

Should be intersting seeing how this pans out. I'll keep me eyes on the Technology & Construction Courts and see if and ADR companies turn up with owt.

 

[dancingradio]

So it seems that link isn't something you're too proud of. Having now located it, that's hardly surprising.

Amid your somewhat incoherent posts insulting others and making rash statements, it seems you've posted the PR statement from the Principal Contractor.

FYI, they'll be the ones on the hook here so their wording will be very carefully chosen.

Should be intersting seeing how this pans out. I'll keep me eyes on the Technology & Construction Courts and see if and ADR companies turn up with owt.

Dont fyi me ffs as though you are teaching people something, you have fun keeping your eyes on court hearings , sounds fun in between attending protests

 

[southstander]

Have you seen the construction programme ?

Because if you haven't , you can't possibly comment on how well the project is progressing

Contractors own website said they were due to finish Summer 2024. They subsequently removed the story.

There could well be many valid reasons for the delay.

I also recall that we were told the work required after the Rugby WC was “cosmetic”.

 

[PhilY]

so why say this then if it's an irrelevant point

"the bridge structure has been up for 13 months and the project still isn’t complete, so it’s late."

You missed off the part of my text where I pointed out that it was supposed to be complete by summer 2025.

you're a knacker who probably posts on sunderland corruption

I don’t know what that is and there’s no need to start being abusive. I haven’t resorted to calling you names.

 

[bobster999]

Contractors own website said they were due to finish Summer 2024. They subsequently removed the story.

There could well be many valid reasons for the delay.

I also recall that we were told the work required after the Rugby WC was “cosmetic”.

the delay with the foundations will have been the bulk of it.

 

[tunstallhill]

You must be logged on to see external links

Because they previously said it would be the summer.

"Earmarked for summer 2025" . Amazing , bet the architect was furious when he read that in summer 2024

The initial contract may well (probably ) had a summer 2025 competition date . More than likely reading that

But things on these massively complex projects can evolve and unforeseen problems always occur.

If VolkerStevin were legally bound to hand over in 'summer 2025' then they will be in some serious commercial trouble at the moment, and that would make your observation that works had slowed down to snails pace even more ludicrous

Contractors own website said they were due to finish Summer 2024. They subsequently removed the story.

That's a serious delay. And unless they can prove that the 1+ year delay is due to circumstances out of their control , they may be facing some financial problems in the near future from the client

It still doesn't explain why the works have slowed to a near halt , as claimed by some on here.

 

[dancingradio]

"Earmarked for summer 2025" . Amazing , bet the architect was furious when he read that in summer 2024

The initial contract may well (probably ) had a summer 2025 competition date . More than likely reading that

But things on these massively complex projects can evolve and unforeseen problems always occur.

If VolkerStevin were legally bound to hand over in 'summer 2025' then they will be in some serious commercial trouble at the moment, and that would make your observation that works had slowed down to snails pace even more ludicrous


That's a serious delay. And unless they can prove that the 1+ year delay is due to circumstances out of their control , they may be facing some financial problems in the near future from the client

It still doesn't explain why the works have slowed to a near halt , as claimed by some on here.

If there was serious bother between volkerstevin and the council the rugby opening wouldnt have been sorted smoothly for 20 odd k. That doesnt signal a broken down relationship to me

 

[PhilY]

"Earmarked for summer 2025" . Amazing , bet the architect was furious when he read that in summer 2024

That’s just one story. The timeline from the council itself was consistently ‘summer 2025’ until the back end of 2024.

I see that you’ve declined to acknowledge that the project is now late.

If VolkerStevin were legally bound to hand over in 'summer 2025' then they will be in some serious commercial trouble at the moment

That’s kind of my point.

Do you work for the Council, if you don’t mind me asking? You seem very defensive on a fairly simple point that the project is running late and me wondering if (as a Sunderland council tax payer) we’re at cost risk - as well as the disappointment of the project not yet being complete - and the puzzlement at the lack of activity/progress currently and the lack of a fixed completion date.

 

[tunstallhill]

That’s just one story. The timeline from the council itself was consistently ‘summer 2025’ until the back end of 2024.

I see that you’ve declined to acknowledge that the project is now late.


That’s kind of my point.

Do you work for the Council, if you don’t mind me asking? You seem very defensive on a fairly simple point that the project is running late and me wondering if (as a Sunderland council tax payer) we’re at cost risk - as well as the disappointment of the project not yet being complete - and the puzzlement at the lack of activity/progress currently and the lack of a fixed completion date.

No I work for a construction company who deliver £50million + projects regularly. I'm site based..

I've never once said that it isn't "late" , I've never once said it's on time either. It depends what is defined in the construction program. The handover date was clearly "summer 2025" at the start, but we don't know whats gone on between then and now.

I'm not sure what scenario there would be where the main contractor delaying a project like this could the client at a "cost risk " ? What do you mean by that.

They aren't delivering a football stadium ready for a new season, or a supermarket ready for the Christmas period

But even if we accept that the project is delayed, why on earth would works have slowed down on site as you keep claiming ? Who would benefit from that ?

 

[dancingradio]

No I work for a construction company who deliver £50million + projects regularly. I'm site based..

I've never once said that it isn't "late" , I've never once said it's on time either. It depends what is defined in the construction program. The handover date was clearly "summer 2025" at the start, but we don't know whats gone on between then and now.

I'm not sure what scenario there would be where the main contractor delaying a project like this could the client at a "cost risk " ? What do you mean by that.

They aren't delivering a football stadium ready for a new season, or a supermarket ready for the Christmas period

But even if we accept that the project is delayed, why on earth would works have slowed down on site as you keep claiming ? Who would benefit from that ?

The only thing ive heard on this thread that sounds about right is that a supplier went bust and new materials had to be sourced. Shit happens

 

[cosmicchris00]

The only thing ive heard on this thread that sounds about right is that a supplier went bust and new materials had to be sourced. Shit happens

I literally told you this in post 4863

 

[tunstallhill]

The only thing ive heard on this thread that sounds about right is that a supplier went bust and new materials had to be sourced. Shit happens

Yep , happens all the time. If it's a specialist product and/or a high volume of a product, it can play havoc with programs

I seem to remember when that tanker got jammed in the Suez canal, a uPVC window manufacturer was waiting for a type of chemical or additive and couldn't get the supply of it, played havoc with their order book and subsequent projects who were relying on windows to be fitted to open up the next phases of work. I'm sure people would have been looking over the fence going "look at them lazy / thick bastards , just stopped work, wouldn't have happened if I was the project manager"

 

[PhilY]

I'm not sure what scenario there would be where the main contractor delaying a project like this could the client at a "cost risk " ? What do you mean by that.

There a dozens of ways there could be cost risk for the client under some contract structures.

They aren't delivering a football stadium ready for a new season, or a supermarket ready for the Christmas period

Erm, I know.

But even if we accept that the project is delayed, why on earth would works have slowed down on site as you keep claiming ? Who would benefit from that ?

I’m not suggesting that any one party is benefitting, but I am wondering if the clear and obvious slowing down of progress is indicative of something to be concerned about. There is very rarely a single issue which creates a delay; it’s much more common for there to be a number of interlinking factors.

 

[Mackem00]

Hello Councillor, it’s nice of you to join the thread. ().

It might make a difference to the party (or parties) that are carrying cost risk! I just hope it’s not council tax payers.

In any event, despite the project architect expecting the project to have been completed for nearly a year by now, I recognise that the Council has consistently said that it would be complete by ‘Summer 2025’.

Now, while I would assume that that vague timeframe would have naturally included a decent contingency for delay (which council wouldn’t want to be in a position to actually deliver earlier than the public timeframe if things had gone well) we can all agree that we’re now in Autumn, the bridge structure has been up for 13 months and the project still isn’t complete, so it’s late.

Hopefully it can be completed sooner rather than later.

It will be a big positive for the City and I’m looking forward to my first walk across it.

You saying that we can all agree it is late doesn't mean we all agree that it's late. It's just you waffling on without any knowledge or background on the subject.

 

[PhilY]

You saying that we can all agree it is late doesn't mean we all agree that it's late. It's just you waffling on without any knowledge or background on the subject.

It is late. We’re not in Summer anymore, are we?

There might be perfectly sound and reasonable reasons for the delay, but to say ‘it is late’ isn’t an opinion, it’s just counting.