Is 1% rise in NHS enough?

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pavarotti1980 said:
Who determines what is "valuable work"?
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good point
tunstallhill said:
yep, the best way to deal with that is to keep everyone rooted at the bottom. keep that jackboot firmly planted on their faces. if you give to one, they'll all want it!

a disgusting post

the country can afford it, there has been a lot of posts on the subject over the last week or so on here, links to studies and evidence from respected and experienced economists showing how 'national debt' and 'public spending' works. and how much of their pay rise actually ends up back in the treasury through taxes and other spending by the beneficairy

its not a race to the bottom for fucks sake. stop falling into the tory's trap
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where did I say keep everyone at the bottom.

I have never said that at all

I am not falling in any trap, I just wonder why one group of workers think they are more deserving than another group.
 
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soapster said:
good point

where did I say keep everyone at the bottom.

I have never said that at all

I am not falling in any trap, I just wonder why one group of workers think they are more deserving than another group.
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where do the nurses say they are more deserving than anyone else? simply wanting to be paid what you think the value of your work deserves isn't related in any way to what anyone else gets paid. its a very simple concept.

if every working person in the country stood their ground and backed every other working person in the country, then we could ALL be paid more, or have better workers rights, more public spending on the likes of the police and the nhs, less corruption in politics, less tax dodging multi billion pound companies... you know, things that would help all working people. 2

saying that the nurses aren't more deserving of a pay rise than, say, teachers, just means that nurses cant get a pay rise until teachers do. but then someone will say, well how are teachers more deserving than police? so they wait, until the police are due a pay rise, then someone pops up and says 'hang on, surely the armed forces are more deserving than the police?' so the police wait. and when it comes to public spending, how comes so-and-so town is getting a new road built, when another town is needing a new bus station built.. lets just not build anything as its impossible to say who is more deserving

all the while, the standard of living for the working people of this country goes down

so yes, you have fell into their trap by spouting this nonsense.
 
Roaring Chubby said:
we have a poster in this thread with 5 years experience on 39k. People will progress differently, like most careers.
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We do however they aren't a staff nurse. Sure they said nurse practitioner/specialist nurse which attracts a higher banding due to additional qualifications and responsibilities such a prescribing, running specialist clinics etc.

The comparison is based on lowest level qualified nurse v lowest ranked cop
 
tunstallhill said:
where do the nurses say they are more deserving than anyone else? simply wanting to be paid what you think the value of your work deserves isn't related in any way to what anyone else gets paid. its a very simple concept.

if every working person in the country stood their ground and backed every other working person in the country, then we could ALL be paid more, or have better workers rights, more public spending on the likes of the police and the nhs, less corruption in politics, less tax dodging multi billion pound companies... you know, things that would help all working people. 2

saying that the nurses aren't more deserving of a pay rise than, say, teachers, just means that nurses cant get a pay rise until teachers do. but then someone will say, well how are teachers more deserving than police? so they wait, until the police are due a pay rise, then someone pops up and says 'hang on, surely the armed forces are more deserving than the police?' so the police wait. and when it comes to public spending, how comes so-and-so town is getting a new road built, when another town is needing a new bus station built.. lets just not build anything as its impossible to say who is more deserving

all the while, the standard of living for the working people of this country goes down

so yes, you have fell into their trap by spouting this nonsense.
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explains it all Red Ken
 
pavarotti1980 said:
We do however they aren't a staff nurse. Sure they said nurse practitioner/specialist nurse which attracts a higher banding due to additional qualifications and responsibilities such a prescribing, running specialist clinics etc.

The comparison is based on lowest level qualified nurse v lowest ranked cop
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fair enough, the post I responded to didn’t mention that in fairness. Comparing nurse pay to cop pay is probably a road to nowhere anyway!
 
Sir Lancelot said:
It depends.

My daughter is on Band 5 which is the same Band as most nurses.

Under Agenda for Change each NHS job is put into appropriate bands depending on qualifications. So a newly qualified nurse will start at the bottom increment of Band 5. A pharmacist will start at the bottom of Band 6.

Each year on the anniversary of them starting work on that Band they get an increment as a reward for gaining experience. When they get to the top of their band they can either stick and just get the normal annual pay rise which for this year is 1% (so far). Or they can apply for a more senior job at a higher band level, so a staff nurse might get a ward manager job, or go into a more specialised field of work which warrants a pay rise.

To go back to my daughter, this year she reaches the top of Band 5. This is the pay rates for Band 5.

Band 5

<1 year experience £24,907
1-2 years £24,907
2-3 years £26,970
3-4 years £26,970
4-5 years £27,416
5-6 years £27,416
6-7 years £30,615
7+ years £30,615

Examples of roles at band 5 (includes many newly qualified clinical professionals) - operating department practitioner (ODP), podiatrist, learning disability nurse, therapeutic radiographer, practice manager

As you can see she has completed 6 years of service and her current pay is £27,416. From April she will receive £30,615 an increase of just over £3000. On top of this she will receive at least 1% from the annual pay offer. So her pay rise this year is already over £60 per week.

Assuming that the demand for 12.5% is actually granted that would give her another £3750 per year. Effectively another £60 per week.

So the question would appear to be, do you think that giving some NHS staff a pay rise of up to £120 per week is acceptable under current financial conditions.

Obviously those on lower grades won’t get so much and those on higher grades could get more but I’ve taken a middle ranking person for the example.
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I'm glad you've posted the breakdown as I believe it'll help a lot of people's understanding.

I just wanted to highlight - especially after that idiot MP aired their shite opinion that nurses are well-paid - that my level of qualification is the same as a nurse, i.e. a bachelor's degree, but my very first job after graduating (2014) was £35k. Granted, that may be unusual but considering the work nurses do, the fact they've already got approx. a year's experience gained as part of their studies AND they work shifts I'd suggest £25k is a below-par starting point and it doesn't grow in line with other vocations that require similar qualifications.
 
Ciro_DiMarzio said:
Aye. Specialised area of nursing. 🤷‍♂️
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offmenut said:
😀😀

A midwife is a nurse on the nurses payscale on the nhs.
If nurses get a pay rise , midwifes will, as , like I said, they are on the same pay scale.
They are on the same pay scale as they are nurses.

That's a big leap there marra.
The 2020 budget and emergency budget put loads of money into the nhs, incresesd spending, writing off debt, (which had been accumulated through years of austerity)
The nhs saves money compared to private systems like in the usa.I think even the tories know that. The pandemic has shown we need the nhs more than ever. And I think the vast majority of the public would agree.

And porters and maintenance can easily socially distance in their job.
Nowhere near the same risk as a nurse.
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they aren’t mate, nurses are band 5, midwives are band 6.

Midwives have a more autonomous role than nurses
 
Zinedine Kilbane said:
they aren’t mate, nurses are band 5, midwives are band 6.

Midwives have a more autonomous role than nurses
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Midwives are considered to have extra knowledge and skills that is why they are band six. Any nurse who extends her knowledge and applies for a band six job will also be paid at band six.

The bands are just a way of describing where you start your career, not where you end it. So a nurse could start at band five and work up to band 8a or just stay at band five. It just depends on how they want to progress their career.

For most, staying by the patient bedside means not progressing up the bands. Those who want management, admin, teaching, research and supervisory aspects to their job could go to band eight.
 
why can’t there be an independent pay review to weight everything up and decide what’s fair? With things like nursing/teaching/coppers it gets too politicised and drawing comparisons to other professions isn’t neccasarily fair to either side of the debate.
 
Roaring Chubby said:
why can’t there be an independent pay review to weight everything up and decide what’s fair? With things like nursing/teaching/coppers it gets too politicised and drawing comparisons to other professions isn’t neccasarily fair to either side of the debate.
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I think there are independent review boards which in the case with nurses recommend 2.1% last year.
There definitely is with the police (and more than likely armed forces) as its illegal for them to take strike action.
 
www.spectator.co.uk

Why NHS workers shouldn't get a pay rise

The Government in the person of Rishi Sunak won a surprisingly positive public response to what was essentially a tax-raising Budget this week. Within 24 hours though, the same government had spectacularly lost the PR contest by recommending a 1 per cent pay rise for NHS staff across the board...
www.spectator.co.uk www.spectator.co.uk
I think they should get a pay rise, however there are many many other professions that also deserve a pay rise and who won't get the press or the public support they should.
 
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