Banning wood burning stoves and fires

lurker said:
You’ve said wood burners are carbon neutral, and therefore vicariously said you aren’t arsed when wood particles get in peoples lungs and kill kids.
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POH is a really nice guy...I'm sure he didn't buy a wood burner because he didn't care about kids dying...just such a silly guilt trip thing to say.

Kids die in RTA's...could be more than kids dying from wood burners, so should we stop driving?
 


Gelan said:
POH is a really nice guy...I'm sure he didn't buy a wood burner because he didn't care about kids dying...just such a silly guilt trip thing to say.

Kids die in RTA's...could be more than kids dying from wood burners, so should we stop driving?
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I don’t know him personally but he seems like a nice bloke @pillars of hercules

Get yourself an economy 7 tariff and some night storage heaters lad
 
Gelan said:
POH is a really nice guy...I'm sure he didn't buy a wood burner because he didn't care about kids dying...just such a silly guilt trip thing to say.

Kids die in RTA's...could be more than kids dying from wood burners, so should we stop driving?
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In reality i've never claimed that wood burners don't cause pollution. Almost every industrial process does. I have said burning wood is carbon neutral which it is. It won't drive global warming. They are two different things.
 
lurker said:
All this global warming is getting out of hand.

We need to nip it in the bud, one solution is banning the burning of wood in the UK, a wood fire puts out more pollution than dozens of cars.

It’ll help global warming and hopefully prevent a great smog from happening over winter.
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Wood definitely does contribute to air pollution but, the carbon from wood has recently been fixed from the atmosphere, so it becomes cyclic because trees fix carbon quickly. The biggest problem is fossil fuels, oil, coal and gas.
 
pillars of hercules said:
In reality i've never claimed that wood burners don't cause pollution. Almost every industrial process does. I have said burning wood is carbon neutral which it is. It won't drive global warming. They are two different things.
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Exactly. People keep getting global warming caused by greenhouse gasses confused with air pollution in the form of carcinogenic particles from woodburners. They're two different things and then we have carbon neutral and sustainability thrown into the mix, no wonder people are confused. Household waste from our rubbish bins is classed as a renewable fuel when burned!!!
 
Market Where? said:
The vast majority will not be carbon neutral.
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The reason they are carbon neutral is that carbon has recently been taken from the atmosphere with the growth and the same amount goes back in during burning. As long as at least as many trees are replanted there is no net loss.

Pollution wise, it all depends on the type of wood, as well as the way it is seasoned and burned. The studies by DEFRA didn't distinguish between types of wood, efficiency of burn etc and are under scientific review.

In reality burning anything is never good for health or environment but we can do our best to make it as 'friendly' as possible.
 
pillars of hercules said:
The reason they are carbon neutral is that carbon has recently been taken from the atmosphere with the growth and the same amount goes back in during burning. As long as at least as many trees are replanted there is no net loss.

Pollution wise, it all depends on the type of wood, as well as the way it is seasoned and burned. The studies by DEFRA didn't distinguish between types of wood, efficiency of burn etc and are under scientific review.

In reality burning anything is never good for health or environment but we can do our best to make it as 'friendly' as possible.
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That’s if you get complete combustion. Also more importantly you are ignoring all the emissions associated with getting the wood - from harvesting to transport and possibly a large amount of emissions from fertilizer and other inputs if it’s from a commercial forest. If it’s kiln dried than that’s more emissions. It’s still almost certainly better than fossil fuel but it’s not carbon neutral.
 
lurker said:
All this global warming is getting out of hand.

We need to nip it in the bud, one solution is banning the burning of wood in the UK, a wood fire puts out more pollution than dozens of cars.

It’ll help global warming and hopefully prevent a great smog from happening over winter.
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Nah, ban coal and oil as that's the real problem.
 
Gelan said:
I'm a greenie, spent 4 years designing a generator that I gave to TESLA...people just take the piss, it's tough caring about the planet :(
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Its easy for others to criticise without knowing someones overall contribution to the environment. We all do good and bad.
Market Where? said:
That’s if you get complete combustion. Also more importantly you are ignoring all the emissions associated with getting the wood - from harvesting to transport and possibly a large amount of emissions from fertilizer and other inputs if it’s from a commercial forest. If it’s kiln dried than that’s more emissions. It’s still almost certainly better than fossil fuel but it’s not carbon neutral.
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Well lets agree that it can be carbon neutral.

I walk over the road into the woods and cut branches from trees that have fallen in storms. I use my battery chainsaw, charged using my solar panels. I do know the metals for the batteries have to be mined and the chainsaw had to be shipped etc but all we can do is do live our lives doing the least overall damage.

Unfortunately as a species we consume everything in our paths.
 
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pillars of hercules said:
Its easy for others to criticise without knowing someones overall contribution to the environment. We all do good and bad.

Well lets agree that it can be carbon neutral.

I walk over the road into the woods and cut branches from trees that have fallen in storms. I use my battery chainsaw, charged using my solar panels. I do know the metals for the batteries have to be mined and the chainsaw had to be shipped etc but all we can do is do live our lives doing the least overall damage.

Unfortunately as a species we consume everything in our paths.
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I’m not saying that it’s not very probably a better option - I’m just saying be careful. Like the whole hydrogen thing being pushed - you can create it from water and when burned it just produces water. That looks great but in reality most hydrogen is created inefficiently from gas and that which is produced from water is massively inefficient.

You have lots of other people with wood burners buying kiln dried wood transported a long distance that was grown on land that was cleared of natural forest and used shitloads of fertilizer and other agrochemicals before being harvested by diesel powered machines.
 
Market Where? said:
I’m not saying that it’s not very probably a better option - I’m just saying be careful. Like the whole hydrogen thing being pushed - you can create it from water and when burned it just produces water. That looks great but in reality most hydrogen is created inefficiently from gas and that which is produced from water is massively inefficient.

You have lots of other people with wood burners buying kiln dried wood transported a long distance that was grown on land that was cleared of natural forest and used shitloads of fertilizer and other agrochemicals before being harvested by diesel powered machines.
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I completely agree. We spent too much time focussing on price when the cost can be a completely different matter. We should be doing a lot more product life cycle analysis and putting the burden on the producer, not the people left to pick up the mess
 
pillars of hercules said:
I completely agree. We spent too much time focussing on price when the cost can be a completely different matter. We should be doing a lot more product life cycle analysis and putting the burden on the producer, not the people left to pick up the mess
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I’ve just got to do a bit on LCA for my MBA. If you would like to send me a nice referenced description of what an LCA is and what it’s used for that would be great!
 
Market Where? said:
I’ve just got to do a bit on LCA for my MBA. If you would like to send me a nice referenced description of what an LCA is and what it’s used for that would be great!
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I'll have a look through my old university stuff for you.
pillars of hercules said:
I'll have a look through my old university stuff for you.
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Market Where? said:
I’ve just got to do a bit on LCA for my MBA. If you would like to send me a nice referenced description of what an LCA is and what it’s used for that would be great!
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I've tried to PM you about LCA info. It says your inbox is full.
 
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