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2nd test - England v South Africa

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Mainze said:
Here is the list anyway of his ton+ scores.

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I have to disagree on the ability to win matches point. He is one of the few batsmen we have who can take the game away from the opposition, and normally very quickly. He is a world class player in all formats of the game and a genuine match winner. But anyway its just my opinion, yep this one is all over, its a must win for us next!
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So thats six series and there will be a fair few innings where he has recorded scores of 75+ in amongst that as well.
 

Aberdeen Angus said:
So thats six series and there will be a fair few innings where he has recorded scores of 75+ in amongst that as well.
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...and currently our leading strike bowler too :lol:
 
sonson said:
Fair enough, but others have done it over decades, Kp certainly hasn't. Unquestionably an excellent batsman but I place the ability to win matches over technique, and there have probably been 7 or 8 batsman in the last ten years better than that than KP.

As an aside, I've no idea why they don't just call it a day here, clearly no-one is going to win.
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Yes, because he only made his debut 7 years ago and due to the wait while qualifying will only have a career about 10 years long. And in that time....

Second only to BRADMAN in runs scored in his first 25 Tests
Fastest player to 5,000 runs in the history of Test cricket. By anyone. Ever.
Average of just shy of 50
Century conversion rate of about 40%
Invented a new shot

Apart from a run in 2009/10 when he was struggling with his achilies and well off the boil, he has consistantly been England's best bat, and easily one of top 5 bats in the world.

Shouldn't even be a debate about how good he is.
 
Steak Pie said:
Yes, because he only made his debut 7 years ago and due to the wait while qualifying will only have a career about 10 years long. And in that time....

Second only to BRADMAN in runs scored in his first 25 Tests
Fastest player to 5,000 runs in the history of Test cricket. By anyone. Ever.
Average of just shy of 50
Century conversion rate of about 40%
Invented a new shot

Apart from a run in 2009/10 when he was struggling with his achilies and well off the boil, he has consistantly been England's best bat, and easily one of top 5 bats in the world.

Shouldn't even be a debate about how good he is.
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I've never said he isn't good. I agree that he's one of the best 5 in the world. My point has always been though if he was able to get in more often he would be the best. The best batsman consistently get in and stay in, KP dosen't, he gets out easily or dominates an innings. Yes, it's his temprament which allows him to win matches, but it's also that temprament which means that he tends to get out cheaply if not. Whereas the best batsman of the past decade have never been an easy wicket for more than a few isolated test and regulalry posted huge scores otherwise. KP dosen't do that. I think he could, were it not for ego, I don't think, if he worked on getting in more often, that he would lose his instinct to go after an attack once settled. And if he did, then there are about ten who have played in the same era who don't, hence they are better batsmen. He is a slave to his whim, whereas others have mastered this, to better affect.
 
sonson said:
I've never said he isn't good. I agree that he's one of the best 5 in the world. My point has always been though if he was able to get in more often he would be the best. The best batsman consistently get in and stay in, KP dosen't, he gets out easily or dominates an innings. Yes, it's his temprament which allows him to win matches, but it's also that temprament which means that he tends to get out cheaply if not. Whereas the best batsman of the past decade have never been an easy wicket for more than a few isolated test and regulalry posted huge scores otherwise. KP dosen't do that. I think he could, were it not for ego, I don't think, if he worked on getting in more often, that he would lose his instinct to go after an attack once settled. And if he did, then there are about ten who have played in the same era who don't, hence they are better batsmen. He is a slave to his whim, whereas others have mastered this, to better affect.
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But Pietersen does post regular big scores and its been shown in the group of stats posted only a few replies ago. I think we will just have to agree to disagree :lol:
 
sonson said:
I've never said he isn't good. I agree that he's one of the best 5 in the world. My point has always been though if he was able to get in more often he would be the best. The best batsman consistently get in and stay in, KP dosen't, he gets out easily or dominates an innings. Yes, it's his temprament which allows him to win matches, but it's also that temprament which means that he tends to get out cheaply if not. Whereas the best batsman of the past decade have never been an easy wicket for more than a few isolated test and regulalry posted huge scores otherwise. KP dosen't do that. I think he could, were it not for ego, I don't think, if he worked on getting in more often, that he would lose his instinct to go after an attack once settled. And if he did, then there are about ten who have played in the same era who don't, hence they are better batsmen. He is a slave to his whim, whereas others have mastered this, to better affect.
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I don't really understand your point.

You can see he's got a huge average, massive scores, match winning and saving innings, broken records for the amount of runs he scored and consistantly done it against the best in the world.

But that's not good enough?

Baffling IMO, but there you go.
 
Steak Pie said:
I don't really understand your point.

You can see he's got a huge average, massive scores, match winning and saving innings, broken records for the amount of runs he scored and consistantly done it against the best in the world.

But that's not good enough?

Baffling IMO, but there you go.
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It's good, but when it's reasonable to believe that he could be even better it's frustrating. It's hardly a controversial point within the world of cricket.

A result still looks very unlikely, but we could have been in a winning position with Swann. Finn and Bresnan not really done enough with ball or bat to warrant to leaving him out.
 
Mr Redknapp said:
Gerrin Broady Kallis gone 8-)
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If we can skittle the tail before tea we've got an outside chance of winning this. I think Warne was being tongue in cheek when he talked about opening with Pietersen and Prior, but putting one of them up there can't be any harm.
 
Andy.SAFC said:
If we can skittle the tail before tea we've got an outside chance of winning this. I think Warne was being tongue in cheek when he talked about opening with Pietersen and Prior, but putting one of them up there can't be any harm.
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Be very hard to knock the runs off in one session like :-(:lol:
 
If we get them out quick enough we open with Pietersen and Prior. Not only are they are two main aggressors, they're on form. I'd also hide Trott's bat or lock him in the toilet.
 
That catch was probably just as hard, if not harder because he was in his follow through, than the two difficult ones he's dropped at slip
 
Declared! Woof! Wasn't expecting that but from a psychological point it's genius. Steals some of the momentum/initiative.
 
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