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PIF sports funding


Redandwhitedust said:
Im not convinced
Even if a European Super League comes along, theyd have to have a side that is good enough to be considered. That side isnt likely to be Newcastle anytime soon.

Of course money might get them in but theyd need huge investment to be anything but a whipping boy

So theyve either got to throw money at them now and build them up on the off chance the ESL comes along (which may or may not happen) or they fund the ESL themselves wkth something like LIVfootball which is equally unlikely


Or more realistically, they buy into a European club that would qualify for an ESL place should it come along
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Spurs
 
ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK said:
The ESL isn't happening as UEFA will just modify the Champions League again. At the minute most of the big clubs are getting the biggest chunk of the Champions League money as that "Value Pillar" using a co-efficient allows them to miss a season or even 2 but still get paid more prize money that a team in it for just a single season.

I still think that was the plan for PIF in the early days when they were looking for a PL team as it was 2018 when they first looked at the mags. They will have known that the ESL would have brought in £billions of revenue and in time more than PL & CL combined given it would be the biggest teams in Europe with all the World's best players in a single league.

With the backing of PIF a club would certainly get an invite to the ESL but it didn't happen and it's hoyed a huge spanner in the works. If the ESL had happened they'd have started with a £300m club and been into the £billions in time that's for sure. The ESL died but what made it even worse was all the rule changes since 2021 to stop rich owners just throwing money to buy success and potentially leaving a club in the shit if it doesn't pay off. That means they've got to do it the hard way, via winning things and getting regular CL footy.

The problem is with the Premier League that there's usually only 4 CL places but 6 'big' teams competing for them. In recent seasons the mags and Villa have broken into it but it's been helped by some of the big 6 clubs having bad seasons. Man Utd seem to have recovered and Chelsea will in time but Spurs at the moment could mean it's 5 teams going for 5 places. If they stay up they could well bounce back given the revenue they generate.

The mags can't do that as they get £200m less a season and without sustained success they won't bridge the financial revenue gap either. They're chasing the impossible dream as Leicester found out and in time they will fail and revert back to type.

I said in another thread, I think they'll maximise them revenue wise and jump ship to get a return on investment. As @Redandwhitedust mentions, if they sell the mags they could well look at another club in Europe that has 'easier' access to a CL place every season but hasn't yet grown to the global brand like one of the top clubs but certainly has potential.


Atletico Madrid is exactly who I thought of when writing the last paragraph in my post above.
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The problem they might have when selecting a new club is that not all fans will be as “welcoming” as those deluded spunktrumpets up the road were
 
Sassanach said:
I think the biggest risk for the Mags is if PIF decide that a club like Atletico is a more desirable horse to back. They would likely be seen as having more exposure and probability of success. PIF would like the fact they won't need to be sorting out the issues in senior management and recruitment that the Mags have now too. Those personnel require attention to detail not just money and I just don't think that is PIF's thing.

In addition to taking some of PIF's focus and funds away from NUFC, UEFA rules on multi club ownership mean there would be an active incentive NOT to pour money into the Mags.
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Valencia?
 
Could be completely wrong but I think they will just stick with the visitors rather than go in for a spurs or Atletico. Keeps them a seat at the table along with the attendant soft power, with no need to spend any big money.

PIF is just entering into a deep phase of strategic recalibration. Domestic prioritisation is now fundamental, international investments as a percentage of PIF total assets have to be decreased in order for numerous local giga-projects to advance as planned. In context, money is tight.
 
ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK said:
The ESL isn't happening as UEFA will just modify the Champions League again. At the minute most of the big clubs are getting the biggest chunk of the Champions League money as that "Value Pillar" using a co-efficient allows them to miss a season or even 2 but still get paid more prize money that a team in it for just a single season.

I still think that was the plan for PIF in the early days when they were looking for a PL team as it was 2018 when they first looked at the mags. They will have known that the ESL would have brought in £billions of revenue and in time more than PL & CL combined given it would be the biggest teams in Europe with all the World's best players in a single league.

With the backing of PIF a club would certainly get an invite to the ESL but it didn't happen and it's hoyed a huge spanner in the works. If the ESL had happened they'd have started with a £300m club and been into the £billions in time that's for sure. The ESL died but what made it even worse was all the rule changes since 2021 to stop rich owners just throwing money to buy success and potentially leaving a club in the shit if it doesn't pay off. That means they've got to do it the hard way, via winning things and getting regular CL footy.

The problem is with the Premier League that there's usually only 4 CL places but 6 'big' teams competing for them. In recent seasons the mags and Villa have broken into it but it's been helped by some of the big 6 clubs having bad seasons. Man Utd seem to have recovered and Chelsea will in time but Spurs at the moment could mean it's 5 teams going for 5 places. If they stay up they could well bounce back given the revenue they generate.

The mags can't do that as they get £200m less a season and without sustained success they won't bridge the financial revenue gap either. They're chasing the impossible dream as Leicester found out and in time they will fail and revert back to type.

I said in another thread, I think they'll maximise them revenue wise and jump ship to get a return on investment. As @Redandwhitedust mentions, if they sell the mags they could well look at another club in Europe that has 'easier' access to a CL place every season but hasn't yet grown to the global brand like one of the top clubs but certainly has potential.


Atletico Madrid is exactly who I thought of when writing the last paragraph in my post above.
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I’ve no idea what the half built new Valencia looks like now but they’re definitely one of the big four in Spain. It’d probably need pulling down and starting from scratch as modern needs and ideas in stadiums have altered since Spurs new one. The locals would be glad to see the owner gone as much as the mags were with MA but would they be as gullible?
 
Hot Since 82 said:
Saudi's withdrawing from Golf entirely and scaling back on all overseas investments, be it sport or otherwise. Their government has just recorded an $80B annual budget deficit, losing a few billion on golf is clearly now totally unacceptable. Given the bigger geo-political situation as well as the myriad of costly infrastructure and major project commitments in Saudi. Additional to the need to keep their own youthful population entertained locally with F1 and boxing etc. Are PIF likely to spend / commit to the £2-3B required for a new stadium in some far flung backwards outpost, with little to no financial return and nothing added to the social and cultural dividend of Saudi's own people.

Under various freedom of information requests NCC confirmed fairly recently that they have not received any planning applications from nufc. Based on the size of the backlash against the leazes park idea it wouldn't look anything like plain sailing to get it done. Theres an online petition supporting the protection of the park and opposing the prospect of it being bulldozed with around 30,000 signatures, the pro stadium petition has 4,000.

You must be logged on to see external links
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I've signed the petition to save a valued public green space and wildlife haven from greedy outsiders plans to destroy it. I'd strongly advise all people with a moral compass to sign too.
 
Hot Since 82 said:
Could be completely wrong but I think they will just stick with the visitors rather than go in for a spurs or Atletico. Keeps them a seat at the table along with the attendant soft power, with no need to spend any big money.

PIF is just entering into a deep phase of strategic recalibration. Domestic prioritisation is now fundamental, international investments as a percentage of PIF total assets have to be decreased in order for numerous local giga-projects to advance as planned. In context, money is tight.
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The mags wont stand for that. Could turn sour very quickly.

No big spend in summer, a big name or two leaves, a bad start to the season and it'll be PIF Out and "wor flags" withdrawing their support for a despotic regime that has no place in football.
 
ozcat said:
Now all but confirmed that LIV Golf is winding up.

Saudis have lost USD 1.1 billion on it since inception.

Reports also that Staveley is working on a new consortium (probably US figures mostly) to purchase a club, Newcastle are a possible target, as are West Ham. Tottenham will also attract interest given they’d be so undervalued right now.
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I doubt spurs will be undervaluedd in the mental world of football.
relegation or not, levy wanted 1bn for his share of the place and thats only about 25%.
The massive value in spurs is the stadium, already built and on favourable loan terms no doubt, which also makes millions every home game, plus all the nfl and rest of the events they stage and location of course so fans can be charged a massive premium
 
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Zen Den said:
Doesn’t seem to be any evidence of PIF selling atm; so far only mild suggestions to the contrary. They want the Mags to be an investment not a sinkhole. Never know though! Interested to see if and how they finance the new stadium/refurb.
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Seems to me that the aim now is to maximise revenue and reduce spending.

For me it looks like they’re tidying up the business ready for a sale.
 
Hot Since 82 said:
Could be completely wrong but I think they will just stick with the visitors rather than go in for a spurs or Atletico. Keeps them a seat at the table along with the attendant soft power, with no need to spend any big money.

PIF is just entering into a deep phase of strategic recalibration. Domestic prioritisation is now fundamental, international investments as a percentage of PIF total assets have to be decreased in order for numerous local giga-projects to advance as planned. In context, money is tight.
Click to expand...
Their dream of hosting the WC is like an albatross round their necks, currently, in terms of other sportswashing ventures imho.

They've got 8yrs to bring about a lot of change to their country in terms of football infrastructure, tourism and associated accommodation and facilities, social attitudes and even dare I say it education.

My understanding is that the majority of the Saudi people form the most conservative population within the Sunni Gulf region, that they've got the most draconian religious laws and it's quite an insular society outside the very wealthy.

Qatar has been a lot more "open" to outside influence than KSA and they still held their WC on their own terms while having to accommodate fans from very different cultures. Not many people I speak to thought that Qatar was a great WC and there's a distinct possibility it'll be an even harder balancing act for the Saudis.

The WC is going to be the focus for money and their attention not a far away mags.
 
Hot Since 82 said:
Saudi's withdrawing from Golf entirely and scaling back on all overseas investments, be it sport or otherwise. Their government has just recorded an $80B annual budget deficit, losing a few billion on golf is clearly now totally unacceptable. Given the bigger geo-political situation as well as the myriad of costly infrastructure and major project commitments in Saudi. Additional to the need to keep their own youthful population entertained locally with F1 and boxing etc. Are PIF likely to spend / commit to the £2-3B required for a new stadium in some far flung backwards outpost, with little to no financial return and nothing added to the social and cultural dividend of Saudi's own people.

Under various freedom of information requests NCC confirmed fairly recently that they have not received any planning applications from nufc. Based on the size of the backlash against the leazes park idea it wouldn't look anything like plain sailing to get it done. Theres an online petition supporting the protection of the park and opposing the prospect of it being bulldozed with around 30,000 signatures, the pro stadium petition has 4,000.

You must be logged on to see external links
Click to expand...
I wonder how many of those announced infrastructure gigaprojects actually turn out to be commitments. The Asian Winter Games were awarded to Trojena in the Neom project a while back, but they seem to have realised that is like announcing Narnia as the venue and walked back from it now. Half the stuff they have announced is pie in the sky nonsense that will never happen (but no one dares say no to the gaffer's flights of fancy) .
 
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