The ref (see PGMOL thread)

[Baz]

I thought you would be more knowledgeable of the difficulty having seen this happen season after season year after year

Maybe this particular ref had a bad game on Saturday and missed a couple, perhaps some were on the blind side of him or people in his way, could be any number of reasons

What’s the alternative reason?

That someone from Australia purposely gave Middlesbrough decisions and Sunderland not?

What possible reason would he do that?

Please, STOP trying to defend him. There is no defence of that "refereeing" performance we all witnessed on Saturday.

That is just complete nonsense this ridiculous the ‘ ref wants to be the star of the show’ without knowing that person and not even hearing them utter one word is ignorant in the extreme.

It's not though. Far too many ref's think they are some kind of celebrity these days and seem to revel in being an absolute bellend and being centre of attention.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Could there be any retrospective judgement on coburn assaults both the elbow and the headbutt

If they aren't mentioned in the referee's report, yes.

 

[Billy Batts]

Please, STOP trying to defend him. There is no defence of that "refereeing" performance we all witnessed on Saturday.

It's not though. Far too many ref's think they are some kind of celebrity these days and seem to revel in being an absolute bellend and being centre of attention.

Like talking to a brick wall, which ironically is like talking to a ref. They might aswell have a palm in your face while you talk.

 

[makumstu]

Please, STOP trying to defend him. There is no defence of that "refereeing" performance we all witnessed on Saturday.

It's not though. Far too many ref's think they are some kind of celebrity these days and seem to revel in being an absolute bellend and being centre of attention.

The move to professional referees was supposed to improve the standard of refereeing, as @Voice of fair play has said mistakes have always been made, yet we are still seeing the same mistakes week in week out.

However now we find ourselves with referees wanting to remain relevant following retirement as they no longer have a day job to fall back on. VAR has been introduced and has just added to the gravy train and extend the time they can spend officiating by sitting in a studio somewhere, still making the same mistakes.

The speed and the intensity of games has increased somewhat, unfortunately refereeing standards have not. When you've got Howard Webb as Chief Refereeing Officer, the man who lost total control of the World Cup Final in 2010 tells you all you need to know about the PGMOL gravy train.

 

[Voice of fair play]

Please, STOP trying to defend him. There is no defence of that "refereeing" performance we all witnessed on Saturday.

It's not though. Far too many ref's think they are some kind of celebrity these days and seem to revel in being an absolute bellend and being centre of attention.

So you think they some kind of celebrity without even hearing them speak??

 

[Baz]

So you think they some kind of celebrity without even hearing them speak??

Yes

 

[The Great MES]

That is just complete nonsense this ridiculous the ‘ ref wants to be the star of the show’ without knowing that person and not even hearing them utter one word is ignorant in the extreme.

What other explanation is there then? If it's just down to ineptitude then they shouldn't be reffing in the first place.

 

[Voice of fair play]

The move to professional referees was supposed to improve the standard of refereeing, as @Voice of fair play has said mistakes have always been made, yet we are still seeing the same mistakes week in week out.

However now we find ourselves with referees wanting to remain relevant following retirement as they no longer have a day job to fall back on. VAR has been introduced and has just added to the gravy train and extend the time they can spend officiating by sitting in a studio somewhere, still making the same mistakes.

The speed and the intensity of games has increased somewhat, unfortunately refereeing standards have not. When you've got Howard Webb as Chief Refereeing Officer, the man who lost total control of the World Cup Final in 2010 tells you all you need to know about the PGMOL gravy train.

I can’t believe you missing the blinding obvious in the above mate.

The speed and intensity has increased but human eyes have remained the same.

A ref below the premier league has exactly the same tools they had 100 years ago his eyes, so of course the same mistakes that were made years ago will continue to be made whether they professional or not.

 

[makumstu]

So you think they some kind of celebrity without even hearing them speak??

Well you can't read the list of "Employees" at PGMOL without having a suspicion that there is a bit of jobs for the boys (and girls) going on.

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As PGMOL are owned and funded by the Premier League, Football League and the FA you can't tell me that is a healthy way for officials to be appointed. It should all be run by the national association, but now that they're professionals that isn't possible as they can't afford the levels of wages needed without the input of the Leagues. The control of referees should be totally independent to any competition that they officiate in as there is enough pressure on them without having to worry about upsetting their paymasters or rocking the boat.

Sometimes it looks like they have a script to follow and are nothing more than a WWE / WCW referee there to tick things over but ultimately make sure it goes to plan.

 

[Voice of fair play]

What other explanation is there then? If it's just down to ineptitude then they shouldn't be reffing in the first place.

The answer is totally simple, a human eye alone is not sufficient tools to do the job to the standard you want, year after year, season after season, different generations of refs show same mistakes been made.

What other conclusion can be made with all the years of evidence?

 

[Georgewhitt]

If a player doesn't foul Clarke he won't get booked. If he does foul Clarke he won't get booked. No idea what happened with Dan Neil but it was cleared what happened to Jack Clarke. Tell me if I'm wrong and how I'm wrong.

Neil didn't get a yellow because Clarke got fouled. He got a yellow for gobbing off about Clarke being fouled.
There's a difference marra.

 

[Voice of fair play]

Yes

It’s not short of ridiculous people make that assumption without knowing that persons personality

 

[makumstu]

I can’t believe you missing the blinding obvious in the above mate.

The speed and intensity has increased but human eyes have remained the same.

A ref below the premier league has exactly the same tools they had 100 years ago his eyes, so of course the same mistakes that were made years ago will continue to be made whether they professional or not.

No I didn't miss that, if that's the best we are going to get, then what is the point of them being professional? They were as good when they were getting a £60 match fee and expenses rather than a £70k basic plus match fees and expenses.

PGMOL has created a closed shop, that is what I am saying is the issue here.

The answer is totally simple, a human eye alone is not sufficient tools to do the job to the standard you want, year after year, season after season, different generations of refs show same mistakes been made.

What other conclusion can be made with all the years of evidence?

Even when they have been given the technology and ability to review and replay things frame by frame, they are making the same mistakes. So your argument about the human eye isn't 100% valid for all leagues.

 

[soapster]

That is just complete nonsense this ridiculous the ‘ ref wants to be the star of the show’ without knowing that person and not even hearing them utter one word is ignorant in the extreme.

the quote though, and others like it, are complete tangents and are stupid remarks, but reality should be to concentrate on what actually happened on the pitch and ignore the comments. they dont help anything.

The DN thing, is we dont actually know what he said. As what he did or did not is part of this complaint, then the FA should release the audio (if mikes were live, or if they picked up what was said). Either DN is mistaken to what he actually said or the referee is mistaken as to what he thought DN said. Both now have credibility issues and it may be easily cleared up.

I dont think the referee was able to see the clear elbow to the throat challenge on Ballard. I am also very sure that the 4th office and the west stand official would of had a clear view. Let us have the audio for that as well.

Peoples reputations are on the line.

Precedence has already been set for the releasing of the audio for Liverpool.

Bet the authorities dont do this though

 

[Voice of fair play]

No I didn't miss that, if that's the best we are going to get, then what is the point of them being professional? They were as good when they were getting a £60 match fee and expenses rather than a £70k basic plus match fees and expenses.

PGMOL has created a closed shop, that is what I am saying is the issue here.

The point been mate, is years and years of evidence going back like? Forever!!!

Shows that mistakes will still be made with just using the same tools they had a 100 years ago!

You can make refs fitter, pay them more, do what ever you like.

But real time decisions made with one look, one angle, and spilt second to decide with just the human eye will always mean mistakes will be made nothing is more certain.

In the same way you could pay footballers a million pounds a week as opposed to a 100 pound a week, you will still not stop centre forwards missing open goals or keepers or defenders making mistakes.

the quote though, and others like it, are complete tangents and are stupid remarks, but reality should be to concentrate on what actually happened on the pitch and ignore the comments. they dont help anything.

The DN thing, is we dont actually know what he said. As what he did or did not is part of this complaint, then the FA should release the audio (if mikes were live, or if they picked up what was said). Either DN is mistaken to what he actually said or the referee is mistaken as to what he thought DN said. Both now have credibility issues and it may be easily cleared up.

I dont think the referee was able to see the clear elbow to the throat challenge on Ballard. I am also very sure that the 4th office and the west stand official would of had a clear view. Let us have the audio for that as well.

Peoples reputations are on the line.

Precedence has already been set for the releasing of the audio for Liverpool.

Bet the authorities dont do this though

Yeah would not disagree with that makes sense.

Nothing wrong with more transparency at all

 

[soapster]

The answer is totally simple, a human eye alone is not sufficient tools to do the job to the standard you want, year after year, season after season, different generations of refs show same mistakes been made.

What other conclusion can be made with all the years of evidence?

the human eye if working correctly is a magnificent piece of kit.

The problem we have here is how the brain interpretates the information it receives from the eye.

 

[makumstu]

the quote though, and others like it, are complete tangents and are stupid remarks, but reality should be to concentrate on what actually happened on the pitch and ignore the comments. they dont help anything.

The DN thing, is we dont actually know what he said. As what he did or did not is part of this complaint, then the FA should release the audio (if mikes were live, or if they picked up what was said). Either DN is mistaken to what he actually said or the referee is mistaken as to what he thought DN said. Both now have credibility issues and it may be easily cleared up.

I dont think the referee was able to see the clear elbow to the throat challenge on Ballard. I am also very sure that the 4th office and the west stand official would of had a clear view. Let us have the audio for that as well.

Peoples reputations are on the line.

Precedence has already been set for the releasing of the audio for Liverpool.

Bet the authorities dont do this though

Thats the issue, PGMOL are a closed shop and it is only in the recent light of high profile mistakes that they have started to release audio and have "employees" speak to the media. Referees are still banned from speaking to the media.

It seems people were all for the ref being interviewed after a game and at least in this instance he has been able to put his side of things across, instead we all just sit in the dark and wonder if the report that is given in is provided just to match what they want to to be said (as per currently denied accusations by Mark Halsey).

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[Voice of fair play]

the human eye if working correctly is a magnificent piece of kit.

The problem we have here is how the brain interpretates the information it receives from the eye.

All evidence mate and I mean all evidence proves just using the human eye to make decisions in real time will result in mistakes.

 

[makumstu]

All evidence mate and I mean all evidence proves just using the human eye to make decisions in real time will result in mistakes.

Well we were really unfortunate at the weekend when the referee decided to try something different and instead of using his eyes to help him make decisions he decided to start plucking them from his anus!!!

 

[Voice of fair play]

Thats the issue, PGMOL are a closed shop and it is only in the recent light of high profile mistakes that they have started to release audio and have "employees" speak to the media. Referees are still banned from speaking to the media.

It seems people were all for the ref being interviewed after a game and at least in this instance he has been able to put his side of things across, instead we all just sit in the dark and wonder if the report that is given in is provided just to match what they want to to be said (as per currently denied accusations by Mark Halsey).

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That is just another clear indication that having to make a decision in real time and then having the opportunity to watch a replay are entirely different things