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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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beverly macca said:
I wonder what the everyday Ukrainian people are thinking. Or the ones who have had to take up arms.
I know posters on here are talking about how they would be out there throwing Molotov’s and single handed taking out ruskies but it’s easy from our front rooms knowing deep down it would never come to that even if the shit hit the fan.
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I do know many soldiers are itching to get over and help that I can confirm jusy from the lads I’ve spoken too,

Nightmares holding a rifle and having yo fire it. It’s the most awful thing man can do yet when you are forced to to it for survival it seems so natural.

People won’t know how they will react in that situation and I’m glad it will never come here.

War is hell and you never stop living it till you take your last breath.
 
UpTheDuff said:
I don’t care if Russia sees itself as the good guy. It isn’t.

NATO membership for Ukraine would have no impact on Russia. NATO is a defence alliance, not an aggressor. Ukraine may “be more than just another country” to Russia, but that’s Russia’s problem, no one else’s.

Ukraine is an independent sovereign nation and it is entitled to join any group or organisation it wants without fear of attack from a neighbouring country.

Being an independent sovereign nation making your own decisions is not provocation.

So yes, the invasion is unprovoked.
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I'm sure Russia has some genuine, deeply held grievances, some of which may well be valid.

That doesn't give them the right to invade though!

In fact by this outrageous action they've rendered whatever genuine complaints they did have utterly meaningless.

They deserve every punishment coming to them and a hell of a lot more.
 
scott934 said:
I dunno how many times it has to be pointed out to you that NATO is a union for defence only, but hopefully this time will be the one that does it.
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Yeh he has a strange understanding of what NATO is. He seems to think it is some sort of aggressive force trying to colonise countries. When it is just a treaty organisation countries want to join to protect themselves against invasion and attack. Unfortunately Ukraine didn’t join in time.
 
NATO a defence alliance, that creeps east after saying it wouldn't, suffocating the Russia state along it's borders and bringing the weapons of a super power closer and closer to it's borders. You'd don't see how that's an issue to the Russians.


UpTheDuff said:
I don’t care if Russia sees itself as the good guy. It isn’t.

NATO membership for Ukraine would have no impact on Russia. NATO is a defence alliance, not an aggressor. Ukraine may “be more than just another country” to Russia, but that’s Russia’s problem, no one else’s.

Ukraine is an independent sovereign nation and it is entitled to join any group or organisation it wants without fear of attack from a neighbouring country.

Being an independent sovereign nation making your own decisions is not provocation.

So yes, the invasion is unprovoked.
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Once the Ukraine was brought into the fold through the IMF and given bilateral loan guarantees from the US, the strings were attached. At that point, whoever is elected is beholden to the West. Joe Biden explained how US money can be used to influence internal Ukrainian decision making "either fire him or you're not getting the billion dollars."

In the Washington Post in 2015 by Fiona Hill, a NSC member and European and Russian affairs expert, she said this.

In Putin’s view, the United States, the European Union and NATO have launched an economic and proxy war in Ukraine to weaken Russia and push it into a corner. As Valery Gerasimov, chief of staff of the Russian armed forces, has underscored, this is a hybrid, 21st-century conflict, in which financial sanctions, support for oppositional political movements and propaganda have all been transformed from diplomatic tools to instruments of war. Putin likely believes that any concession or compromise he makes will encourage the West to push further.

We've been playing a game with Ukraine, and Putin made his move, right or wrong. But, we knew the crash course this was on and did nothing to stop it, and only instigated it further.
 
West_Winger said:
“The West makes clear that if Putin goes and is replaced by a more moderate leader, then Russia will see the lifting of some sanctions and a restoration of normal diplomatic relations.”

That’s how I see this ending.
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I think that is what we all want. If we go in and cause WW3 I have no doubt that Putin will launch nukes. He has already said to some affect, there is no point in a world without Russia. If he thinks he will lose he will ensure MAD, I'm convinced of this, he is an old man, all his policies are backwards thinking, never forward about the future. It has to be from Russia. Hopefully the reports of the Kremlin being in shock at his decisions is true and he doesn't last long. Surely he cannot, with decisions like public executions and sending protestors to the front line, The more you read the more he is losing his shit, he has embarrassed himself and the Russian forces in Ukraine. I feel sorry for the soldiers under his command, he has hung them out to dry, he isn't even feeding them for ffs. Don't get me wrong the incompetence of the Russian generals is Ukraine gain and I'm pleased at that.
 
UpTheDuff said:
Says the poster who bangs on saying whatabout Iraq etc. lol.
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The Bloomberg article is conjecture and arguable sensationalism on something that hasn't happened?

I'm leaving this thread for good. You and you're ilk and are beyond reproach, unable to comprehend or challenge a narrative.
 
rudd said:
It makes no sense.

If Putin wants Ukraine why the hell are they bombing the crap out of it all? It's going to make it much much harder to get the public onside for one, and Russia don't have the money to repair it. If he takes it all it's only going to lead to repeated insurgents or a full blown revolution. He's messed up big time by underestimating the strength of Ukraine and their citizens.
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I see this as another sign of his mental instability. Wants might have changed to wants rid of the problem by whatever it takes, which seems to be the path Putin is now pursuing.
 
Concordsafc said:
To be honest unless the west help Ukraine will fall I am pro Ukraine and wish them all the hope in the world but they will fall, I think Kyiv will last longer than you have stated but if putin won’t give in and either will Ukraine it’s going to end one way.

Thing is Russia will be so weak after this war they wont be able to do much else’s.

Can’t rebuild what they have lost won’t get the parts or can’t afford the labor. Be a long slog for the folk of Russia.
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Agreed. I know there’s talk of Moldova but they’re going to need a crazy amount of personnel in Ukraine.
 
beverly macca said:
I wonder what the everyday Ukrainian people are thinking. Or the ones who have had to take up arms.
I know posters on here are talking about how they would be out there throwing Molotov’s and single handed taking out ruskies but it’s easy from our front rooms knowing deep down it would never come to that even if the shit hit the fan.
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And if I were a Ukrainian, I’d be pretty pissed off if the Russians nuked the fuck out of my city because a foreign country made the wrong decision.
 
Hugh Gains said:
NATO a defence alliance, that creeps east after saying it wouldn't, suffocating the Russia state along it's borders and bringing the weapons of a super power closer and closer to it's borders. You'd don't see how that's an issue to the Russians.
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How's it "suffocating" Russia?

NATO's sole purpose is to defend its members from attack. If Russia doesn't attack its members then NATO presents to problem whatsoever to it.
 
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