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Russia invading Ukraine (NEWS/UPDATES)

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Behind Enemy Lines said:
Surely the mutually sensible thing to do then would be to just agree to not let them join? Would be seen as "backing down to Putin" or whatever but surely preferable to a war of this scale, Ukraine's potential NATO membership obviously means a lot more to Russian than it does to us.
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I'm not even sure it was about that, I think it was a pretext to justify his actions. The man is a wily, conniving fruitloop. I think this was what he planned from the off, regardless of what anyone else did. Maybe if everyone surrendered to every demand he had, he might have accepted that. We will never know now.
 
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Wild Card said:
I'm not even sure it was about that, I think it was a pretext to justify his actions. The man is a wily, conniving fruitloop. I think this was what he planned from the off, regardless of what anyone else did. Maybe if everyone surrendered to every demand he had, he might have accepted that. We will never no now.
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My guess is that if the west had he would have been back with a new list of demands quite sharp
 
Behind Enemy Lines said:
Surely the mutually sensible thing to do then would be to just agree to not let them join? Would be seen as "backing down to Putin" or whatever but surely preferable to a war of this scale, Ukraine's potential NATO membership obviously means a lot more to Russian than it does to us.
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Which is exactly what we tried with the Sudetenland, but it didn’t work as the real motivations weren’t addressed.

Similarly NATO isn’t the true motivation here.
 
Just a question of how quickly it goes South now really. What next?

Some reports of large military columns moving North through Donbas (The separatists don’t hold all of it) and Zelensky due to speak soon.

If he says they won’t accept it and will defend Donbas then it’s conceivable it could of kicked off in a few hours
 
Behind Enemy Lines said:
Surely the mutually sensible thing to do then would be to just agree to not let them join? Would be seen as "backing down to Putin" or whatever but surely preferable to a war of this scale, Ukraine's potential NATO membership obviously means a lot more to Russian than it does to us.
Click to expand...

It's all about what the people voted for innit.

It's like Northern Ireland voting to rejoin Ireland but Boris invading Belfast to stop it
 
woodlebert said:
Surely Ukraine could point to the Budapest Memorandum and say Russia has broken that?
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Aye they broke it in regard to Crimea, incidentally I'm not on either side here I just see paralells with the Cuba crisis. From 2015;

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and more recentlyfrom Reuters:
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Behind Enemy Lines said:
Surely the mutually sensible thing to do then would be to just agree to not let them join? Would be seen as "backing down to Putin" or whatever but surely preferable to a war of this scale, Ukraine's potential NATO membership obviously means a lot more to Russian than it does to us.
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You are assuming this is all about a potential Nato membership for Ukraine
 
luvulongtime said:
why not ask Russia to join Nato
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Yeltsin suggested it to Clinton but got the run around. I read somewhere Putin asked why Russia wasn't invited to join after the US rejected his idea for Europe led security arrangement.

Here's some of the comms between Clinton and Yeltsin on the matter of security.

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