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NUFC thread 2021.

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beezer said:
Is that saying the mags‘ average league position based on their entire history is about 14th in the top division?

Out of interest don’t suppose you know ours?
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Aye they're 14th now and we're about 16th now and they passed us around 1994-95 when we were both at 15th.

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MackemX said:
You mean the 13 years when you spent huge amounts, thanks to the money injection from Sky as football finances shot up and a few clubs gambled on playing with the big boys? Is that the 13 years you won nowt and come the end were heading more into debt because of the lack of 'success'? What about the 13 years prior or the many seasons of nothingness prior to that? 🤔🤫

In the image below, it shows the actual league position that season, the overall average position and the last 15 seasons position. The highlighted bit is the 'success' period. You finished 42nd in 1991-92 which was your lowest ever position and also the lowest 15 year average. The 15 year average position in 1992 was 24th as in the 15 years prior, you'd only finished as high as 8th in Div 1.

You last finished top 4 way back in 1950-51 though no European competitions were around then. You did qualify for Europe in 1976-77 when you finished 5th, though it used to be top 4 prior seasons though. Look at the league positions from 1940's even as you're not really a yoyo club but rather a rollercoaster ride of huge ups and downs.

It just shows you were nowt before the huge cash injection that nearly cost you before Ashley came in. Yet many of the mag fans (probably '92ers) go on as if NUFC is a 'big' club that should be up there and they don't deserve this. This is part of the reason why they're thought of as being deluded and not just by the Mackems.

You've simply reverted to type and today's history lesson for the deluded has now concluded! 😂🤣😂🤣

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POTAAOY. Outstanding stuff.
 
MackemX said:
Aye they're 14th now and we're about 16th now and they passed us around 1994-95 when we were both at 15th.

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Thanks mate. Interesting that. They way they go on you’d think they’re historically a superclub and we‘re nowhere near, yet in reality we’re a lot closer than theyd like to think.
 
Skellington said:
that’s a good chart - shows that since their last title in 1927, nearly a century ago, they haven’t been anything special.

It’s harder now than ever imo. Due to the inequalities of football finances, there’s a small group of clubs sharing the trophies amongst themselves with no one else getting much of a look in. This trend has actually been going on for decades but has really accelerated in recent years.

Throughout most of ourselves and the mags history, the north east produced more players than anywhere else. That was one of the main justifications for the portrayal of both clubs as “sleeping giants”.

If either of us could get the right people in place, we could take advantage of the gold mine we were sat on, and then mobilise the massive support base to become one of the strongest teams in the land. You didn’t need anything like the same financial backing and commercial deals you do now. It’s been said a thousand times on here, but if we’d ever got Brian Clough in the hot seat and let him do what he wanted, success would surely have followed.

Neither of us managed to do it, and now we don’t produce players in those numbers anymore, and probably never will again.

Even in those favourable circumstances, the mags weren’t ever able to become a force. So why do they now think that simply removing Ashley will result in glory? It wasn’t like that before, and it’s far harder now.
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In six years time it’ll be their 100th anniversary. I’m gonna have to start looking after myself, I’ve gotta be around to see it. Will the Queen send them all a telegram or just one to their club or one to MA?
 
Skellington said:
that’s a good chart - shows that since their last title in 1927, nearly a century ago, they haven’t been anything special.
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Since that last league win, their average position from 1927-28 to 1992-93 was mid 18th position, so you could say 18th one season 19th the next.

Their overall historical average after 1992-93 was only just over 15th. Since Ashley came in 2007/08, he's averaged just over 14th in 13 seasons. They averaged just over alternate 7th and 8th for the 13 Premier League seasons prior to Ashley. If you look back at the image again, you'll see it was last 50's when they last enjoyed an average 15 season spell higher than what Ashley has got, though they got close mid 1970's and last hit it mid 1930's.

Skellington said:
Even in those favourable circumstances, the mags weren’t ever able to become a force. So why do they now think that simply removing Ashley will result in glory? It wasn’t like that before, and it’s far harder now.
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Club dysmorphia?

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beezer said:
Thanks mate. Interesting that. They way they go on you’d think they’re historically a superclub and we‘re nowhere near, yet in reality we’re a lot closer than theyd like to think.
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Aye a simple excel chart as those in the COVID forum will know I easily make graphs. Took me longer to make the pretty lines and colours than it did compiling it :lol:
 
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Cloughie said:
No, I didn't. My smilies were in response to abusive responses received.

I've no qualms if you prove me wrong, none at all. I was happy to concede we had different interpretations of 'on the brink' and I explained why.

By the same token, I'm also not going to sit and take dogs abuse from you and a few others because you disagree with me. You can't give it out and not expect something back.
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Well do us all a favour and leave the board. Try doing something positive, get some freah air. Go for a run (if your too big to go for a walk) anything but annoy us on OUR forum.
 
MackemX said:
Since that last league win, their average position from 1927-28 to 1992-93 was mid 18th position, so you could say 18th one season 19th the next.

Their overall historical average after 1992-93 was only just over 15th. Since Ashley came in 2007/08, he's averaged just over 14th in 13 seasons. They averaged just over alternate 7th and 8th for the 13 Premier League seasons prior to Ashley. If you look back at the image again, you'll see it was last 50's when they last enjoyed an average 15 season spell higher than what Ashley has got, though they got close mid 1970's and last hit it mid 1930's.

Club dysmorphia?

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Aye a simple excel chart as those in the COVID forum will know I easily make graphs. Took me longer to make the pretty lines and colours than it did compiling it :lol:
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I like all these stats about average positions historically, but don't know where to find the info.
Out of interest could you do the "big 6"? Interested to see how Everton or Arsenal would compare to Man United and Liverpool, as Arsenal and Everton have had more top flight seasons over the last 100 years but won less titles. I think Man City might be slightly higher than Newcastle and Spurs probably between City and Everton
 
What A Waster said:
I like all these stats about average positions historically, but don't know where to find the info.
Out of interest could you do the "big 6"? Interested to see how Everton or Arsenal would compare to Man United and Liverpool, as Arsenal and Everton have had more top flight seasons over the last 100 years but won less titles. I think Man City might be slightly higher than Newcastle and Spurs probably between City and Everton
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I've just used the 'seasons' pages on wiki, copy table and hoy it into excel and simple find/match/formulas to get actual positions depending on league and averages etc.

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MackemX said:
I've just used the 'seasons' pages on wiki, copy table and hoy it into excel and simple find/match/formulas to get actual positions depending on league and averages etc.

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Click to expand...

I haven't a clue how to do that with excel tbf.

I found this after my previous post, can't work out how to upload it as an image
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But it doesn't put it in a graph like what you have.
Liverpool, Arsenal and Everton average position 9th-10th, Man United 10th to 11th, Villa 11/12th, Man City 14th, Newcastle 15th.
 
What A Waster said:
I haven't a clue how to do that with excel tbf.

I found this after my previous post, can't work out how to upload it as an image
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But it doesn't put it in a graph like what you have.
Liverpool, Arsenal and Everton average position 9th-10th, Man United 10th to 11th, Villa 11/12th, Man City 14th, Newcastle 15th.
Click to expand...

This is Arsenal's but it may not be perfect as I've done it quickly and I'm not sure about the early years.

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What A Waster said:
Is that red line 15 seasons average from any specific point?
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It's the preceding 15 seasons average from the point on the red line to the year above. You can see how Man City's has climbed for example, 15 seasons ago at 19.8 (just above 20th) in 2006/07 to 4.40 last season (alternating just above 4th/5th). As they'll finish 1st this season then it will go to 3.53 (alternating 3rd/4th).

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