Fallout from the T20 Series

[TheRey]

Yep I agree. I’d probs go Root at 3 based on what he did in the last T20 World Cup and he provides another spin option but that’s very harsh on Malan who hasn’t done much wrong. Any 2 of Roy/Hales/Bairstow opening they’re all excellent

I'm happy with either Malan or Root. As a pure batsman I'd rather Malan, but as you say, Roots spin adds a huge dimension. Definitely absolutely ridiculous that he isn't even being considered as far as we know.

Think with Buttler is that he will score opening but so will hales, Bairstow, Roy and countless others. There’s no one else who will score in the middle for us. Don’t think Roy will score on slower pitches so he’s out for me. Probably the same for Jonny.

I’d move stokes to open where he was IPL MVP and has numerous 100s. I’d also bring Hales back into the side, and root.

Stokes
Hales
Malan
Root
Morgan
Buttler

I think having stokes and root lets you bring in a 7th bat if needed, but probably rather have the bowling option. Bowling wise, think Woakes and Wiley both have to be contenders and should be our 3/4th seamers - depending on whether you want 3/2 seams and spins or 4/1. Then Ali is the obvious second spinner in T20.

So:

Ali/Woakes
Wiley
Wood
Archer
Rashid

For me

Wouldn't necessarily disagree with any of that, but I do feel it's a tad harsh on Jroy

 

[TravellingMackem]

I'm happy with either Malan or Root. As a pure batsman I'd rather Malan, but as you say, Roots spin adds a huge dimension. Definitely absolutely ridiculous that he isn't even being considered as far as we know.

Wouldn't necessarily disagree with any of that, but I do feel it's a tad harsh on Jroy

I just feel you have to do more than Roy does. Getting to 30 and getting out at best ain’t good enough for me. There’s always some risk in T20, of course there is, but you need to chip in with bigger scores once you’re in than he does.

 

[Voice of fair play]

Buttler is a brilliant white ball cricketer who needs to open for two reasons, one to face as many balls as possible and two to have the opportunity to play in that vital power play when the field is in.

You simply can’t have your best player ( which he is) to far down the order.

He is a great finisher and could win games batting down the order, but will win more opening imo.

I just feel you have to do more than Roy does. Getting to 30 and getting out at best ain’t good enough for me. There’s always some risk in T20, of course there is, but you need to chip in with bigger scores once you’re in than he does.

Depends how quick you get them thirty odd, if a opener gets 30 very quickly meaning you have 60 on after the power play would be happy with that start most times.

 

[TravellingMackem]

Buttler is a brilliant white ball cricketer who needs to open for two reasons, one to face as many balls as possible and two to have the opportunity to play in that vital power play when the field is in.

You simply can’t have your best player ( which he is) to far down the order.

He is a great finisher and could win games batting down the order, but will win more opening imo.


Depends how quick you get them thirty odd, if a opener gets 30 very quickly meaning you have 60 on after the power play would be happy with that start most times.

But it isn’t that good if you have to then spend the next 2 overs rebuilding a partnership. As kohli showed today, the most important thing in cricket is not getting out. You can catch up scoring rates easily if you don’t lose wickets. The same goes in all formats and it’s one of our biggest flaws. We don’t go on to make the same big scores other teams do. If Buttler or malan bat through we win today. But especially Malans wicket, it’s just given away. Really really poor shot. We only have 2 iT20 hundreds in English cricket I believe. Malan and hales. Sharma has 4, Rahul has 2. They both have more than every English batsman.

 

[TheRey]

Buttler is a brilliant white ball cricketer who needs to open for two reasons, one to face as many balls as possible and two to have the opportunity to play in that vital power play when the field is in.

You simply can’t have your best player ( which he is) to far down the order.

He is a great finisher and could win games batting down the order, but will win more opening imo.


Depends how quick you get them thirty odd, if a opener gets 30 very quickly meaning you have 60 on after the power play would be happy with that start most times.

I don't think 4 is too low down the order for him though. He'll still get plenty of balls, but he might actually be able to finish games.

I know you want to see Buttler face every single ball in the innings, but the reality is we've a multitude of players who can do what he's currently doing. But what we really lack is someone in the middle order who has the nous, cool head, and intelligence to finish a game - three things that basically define Buttler as a cricketer.

He'd be far more use lower down than opening, IMO.

 

[GuestServices]

Think with Buttler is that he will score opening but so will hales, Bairstow, Roy and countless others. There’s no one else who will score in the middle for us. Don’t think Roy will score on slower pitches so he’s out for me. Probably the same for Jonny.

I’d move stokes to open where he was IPL MVP and has numerous 100s. I’d also bring Hales back into the side, and root.

Stokes
Hales
Malan
Root
Morgan
Buttler

I think having stokes and root lets you bring in a 7th bat if needed, but probably rather have the bowling option. Bowling wise, think Woakes and Wiley both have to be contenders and should be our 3/4th seamers - depending on whether you want 3/2 seams and spins or 4/1. Then Ali is the obvious second spinner in T20.

So:

Ali/Woakes
Wiley
Wood
Archer
Rashid

For me

Agree Stokes to open or come in at 3.

 

[TheRey]

Agree Stokes to open or come in at 3.

Thing is, you put Stokes at 3 and you have to leave out your glue in either Root or Malan. So every game will be a 50/50 - we'll either come off and hit 225, or collapse and be bowled cheaply.

I wouldn't be averse to him opening (although again, IMO we have better options there), but he wouldn't fit at 3

 

[Jack Torrance]

Buttler is a brilliant white ball cricketer who needs to open for two reasons, one to face as many balls as possible and two to have the opportunity to play in that vital power play when the field is in.

You simply can’t have your best player ( which he is) to far down the order.

He is a great finisher and could win games batting down the order, but will win more opening imo.


Depends how quick you get them thirty odd, if a opener gets 30 very quickly meaning you have 60 on after the power play would be happy with that start most times.

Nobody doubts he’s a brilliant opener but we don’t have anyone to finish the innings. 3 games we lost we could have won if we had someone capable of finishing an innings

 

[TheRey]

Nobody doubts he’s a brilliant opener but we don’t have anyone to finish the innings. 3 games we lost we could have won if we had someone capable of finishing an innings

Precisely.

He's done jolly well at opening, but no better than Bairstow, Hales or Stokes would've done.

We've really missed him in the middle order. Had he come in at 4 today, he could've seen us home, rather than a collapse.

 

[Jack Torrance]

Thing is, you put Stokes at 3 and you have to leave out your glue in either Root or Malan. So every game will be a 50/50 - we'll either come off and hit 225, or collapse and be bowled cheaply.

I wouldn't be averse to him opening (although again, IMO we have better options there), but he wouldn't fit at 3

I agree Stokes never a 3. He needs to learn how to bat in the middle - he played well in the 4th game but him and Bairstow should have seen us home

 

[TheRey]

I agree Stokes never a 3. He needs to learn how to bat in the middle - he played well in the 4th game but him and Bairstow should have seen us home

It is such a tough one with Ben. For me, I'm leaning towards him just having to swallow that he's playing in an era where we're spoilt for choice in T20 cricket right now, and settle for being the talisman in the other forms.

But then if you ask every other side in the WC if they'd rather face an England side with Stokes in it or out of it, and they'd rather he was out of the side. So I don't know...

 

[Ghfd]

Precisely.

He's done jolly well at opening, but no better than Bairstow, Hales or Stokes would've done.

We've really missed him in the middle order. Had he come in at 4 today, he could've seen us home, rather than a collapse.

Jolly well. Are you off to Henly for the regatta this year, what what

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[scotch]

Stokes or Malan
Roy
Hales
Root/Buttler depending on how well we start
Bairstow (his record is too good to be dropped imo)
Morgan
Archer
Woakes or Jordan
Wood
Rashid

 

[chopsfc007]

Stokes or Malan
Roy
Hales
Root/Buttler depending on how well we start
Bairstow (his record is too good to be dropped imo)
Morgan
Archer
Woakes or Jordan
Wood
Rashid

Malan should be first name picked

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

Really not sure what Malan has to do

Quickest man to 1,000 T20i runs ever
3rd fasted block of 1,000 T20i runs ever (any 1,000 block in a career) after Babar and Kohli
Average of 50, second highest ever after Kohli
Strike rate 144, best in team and 13th highest of all time (amongst major nations)
World ranked #1

yeah, he has had a scratchy series. Find me a player who doesn’t have one

 

[TheRey]

Really not sure what Malan has to do

Quickest man to 1,000 T20i runs ever
3rd fasted block of 1,000 T20i runs ever (any 1,000 block in a career) after Babar and Kohli
Average of 50, second highest ever after Kohli
Strike rate 144, best in team and 13th highest of all time (amongst major nations)
World ranked #1

yeah, he has had a scratchy series. Find me a player who doesn’t have one

I just don't think his face "fits" with Morgan.

 

[TravellingMackem]

Really not sure what Malan has to do

Quickest man to 1,000 T20i runs ever
3rd fasted block of 1,000 T20i runs ever (any 1,000 block in a career) after Babar and Kohli
Average of 50, second highest ever after Kohli
Strike rate 144, best in team and 13th highest of all time (amongst major nations)
World ranked #1

yeah, he has had a scratchy series. Find me a player who doesn’t have one

Bigger issue for me is the horses for courses argument. I don’t doubt he’s a great player with pace on, and if the World Cup was in Australia I’d have him first name on the team sheet. Just don’t see his game as suited to subcontinental pitches at all. And his immediate rival, root, is perfectly suited to Indian pitches

 

[chunkyshanhawk53]

I just don't think his face "fits" with Morgan.

Or the fans

 

[scotch]

Really not sure what Malan has to do

Quickest man to 1,000 T20i runs ever
3rd fasted block of 1,000 T20i runs ever (any 1,000 block in a career) after Babar and Kohli
Average of 50, second highest ever after Kohli
Strike rate 144, best in team and 13th highest of all time (amongst major nations)
World ranked #1

yeah, he has had a scratchy series. Find me a player who doesn’t have one

He has to open for me as thats his game, having him at 3 does him no favours

 

[Salem Street South]

Really not sure what Malan has to do

Quickest man to 1,000 T20i runs ever
3rd fasted block of 1,000 T20i runs ever (any 1,000 block in a career) after Babar and Kohli
Average of 50, second highest ever after Kohli
Strike rate 144, best in team and 13th highest of all time (amongst major nations)
World ranked #1

yeah, he has had a scratchy series. Find me a player who doesn’t have one

Scratchy is being kind and for the first four games he looked anything but the World number 1 in that format.

Even the last game he got slightly fortunate in how he got started and when in a position to win us the game by being there at the end he gave it away.

He’s played some really good cricket but I feel those numbers flatter him, let’s face it he’s not even the best batsman in our side, never mind the world. There’s a better one being excluded at present