I can see your point, but as I've said before it doesn't stop him being a hypocrite just because he doesn't try to hide it. It just shows him to be more of an arsehole in my book.
But great songs etc.
I think we can agree to differ on this one, BB.
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I can see your point, but as I've said before it doesn't stop him being a hypocrite just because he doesn't try to hide it. It just shows him to be more of an arsehole in my book.
But great songs etc.
Really?Living in England, being born in England, doesn't prevent anyone from forming their own political opinion which doesn't agree with the country's establishment. Having a cultural and familial heritage that is strongly associated with another country is inevitably going to be influential. The main reason Irish people have ended up in England is economic, part of that is to do, historically, with the way Irish people were treated by Brits.
Being hypocritical would require Shane to spend his time hobnobbing with the queen and secretly funding the British army. He is an Irish Republican and has a right to be. Bringing up his scholarship at Westminster School is a bit old hat. I should also say that supporting a united Ireland is not exclusive to people who are Irish or of Irish extraction. The actions of Britain in Ireland are nothing to be proud of and the real violence started, in the most recent phase of Anglo Irish relations, with British soldiers acting on behalf of the British government.
He is an alcohol and drug using genius and some of the best gigs I have been to involved him, with The Pogues. memorably guesting with The Dubliners at The Mean Fiddler and Clapham Grand, and stupendous early gigs with The Popes, - duetting with Nick Cave on I Have Been A Rover
It was up to the audience to decide if they wanted to hear him perform. The hypocrites would be people who saw him perform, liked the music but then wanted him to be something other than what he was/is. The Pogues weren't overtly Republican, after The Pogues, MacGowan was more explicit.Really?
And you think that by performing to UK audiences in the 80's and also advocating blowing them up isn't being a hypocrite?
Cracking tunes btw.
So he did attend, albeit rarely? Meaning he did receive an English public school education?Shane spent on year on a scholarship at Westminster School before he was kicked out. The public school education is a myth as he rarely attended during that year.
Rock music is filled with flawed genius's. You have to ask yourself whether your going to let a lifetime of great music pass you by or choose the song and not the singer.All these musical “legends”, I feel a bit uneasy about things they’ve done. Particularly heroin, but John Lennon was a massive wife beating, adulterous, shit dad, smack head who wrote great songs. Johnny Rotten is like a caricature who’s a great frontman. Ian Brown’s went off his tits on the whole anti COVID thing, but was part of an era defining band. They’re all tossers really. But with Shane MacGowan I can’t look past the songs. They’re too good.
He can't be that staunch, he couldn't even be arsed to be born in Ireland.Hypocrite or is it just me struggling to understand the complexities of the Irish political landscape of the 70s/80s?
Seemed happy enough to make his name & fortune in the UK but looks like it was through gritted (rotten) teeth?
"MacGowan’s enthusiastic endorsement of Irish uprisings against the British and adoration of the IRA – “I felt ashamed I didn’t have the guts to join [them],” he says at one point."
Crock of Gold: A Few Rounds with Shane MacGowan review – a sombre salute
Julien Temple rounds up the old gang for bleakly worshipful profile of the recalcitrant Pogues starwww.theguardian.com
It seems that to be being that obsessively single minded, driven and ambitious enough to find success in the ruthless, cutthroat music industry is hard, very hard. These musicians have to write songs, perform and express these emotions & moral messages. Like musical tourettes.Rock music is filled with flawed genius's. You have to ask yourself whether your going to let a lifetime of great music pass you by or choose the song and not the singer.
There are loads you could add to the list. Jimmy Page for one. Joe Strummer thought Alan Ginsberg was a genius(which he was) but he was also a member of the Man/Boy Love Association. Bono, Morrissey the list is endless.
Forgot to add Eric Clapton, who almost sang Send The Buggers Back
All these musical “legends”, I feel a bit uneasy about things they’ve done. Particularly heroin, but John Lennon was a massive wife beating, adulterous, shit dad, smack head who wrote great songs. Johnny Rotten is like a caricature who’s a great frontman. Ian Brown’s went off his tits on the whole anti COVID thing, but was part of an era defining band. They’re all tossers really. But with Shane MacGowan I can’t look past the songs. They’re too good.
Oh aye, you’re right. I’m not saying I don’t love their music still, but I doubt there’s many I can’t get away with as people because of those flaws, they’re still interesting to a certain degree & ive probably read books & watched documentaries on all those mentioned. I suppose with most of them I wouldn’t be interested in meeting them or interacting, apart for them to perform their music, I’d love to meet Shane MacGowan though.Rock music is filled with flawed genius's. You have to ask yourself whether your going to let a lifetime of great music pass you by or choose the song and not the singer.
There are loads you could add to the list. Jimmy Page for one. Joe Strummer thought Alan Ginsberg was a genius(which he was) but he was also a member of the Man/Boy Love Association. Bono, Morrissey the list is endless.
Forgot to add Eric Clapton, who almost sang Send The Buggers Back
That’s good. I can imagine it’d be exhausting to be that person you see in interviews if he was like that 24/7. What did he talk about?I had a chat, and a couple of beers, with him in The Plimsoll Arms before we took our annual beating at Arsenal many years ago. He was nothing like the caricature he portrays. Really good company.
Oh aye, you’re right. I’m not saying I don’t love their music still, but I doubt there’s many I can’t get away with as people because of those flaws, they’re still interesting to a certain degree & ive probably read books & watched documentaries on all those mentioned. I suppose with most of them I wouldn’t be interested in meeting them or interacting, apart for them to perform their music, I’d love to meet Shane MacGowan though.
That’s good. I can imagine it’d be exhausting to be that person you see in interviews if he was like that 24/7. What did he talk about?
Lennon was a f***ing cock man. Proper horrible human who tried to do all this peace & love shite, lecturing everybody who’d listen about making the world a better place when he couldn’t get simple things right himself. Amazing songwriter
Agree with all of thatIt seems that to be being that obsessively single minded, driven and ambitious enough to find success in the ruthless, cutthroat music industry is hard, very hard. These musicians have to write songs, perform and express these emotions & moral messages. Like musical tourettes.
That's probably why the performer to fruitloopbasketcasiopath ratio is through the roof in the music business. It's a good thing, take a look at what happens when you let the beige PE exempt bastards have a go. Keane, Coldplay and The West London Wurzels come in and uncorrupt the youth.
The nearest The Mumfords have been to farming is hedge funds and Ed Sheeran.
Chris Martin as a rock God? Michael f***ing Mckintyre would have Martin's dinner money away, I reckon Timmy Mallet, Ray Mears, Giles Brandreth and Sir Patrick Moore have drunkenly crashed more flap than Toffs R Us. They had Oi! In the 70s, we've got Oik!
He knew he was though. And openly told his fans, don't look at me, look at you.This.
The bloke was an utter arsehole and he got away with a lot because he was a Beetle. His treatment of Cynthia was particularly unpleasant
We probably are all hypocrites in some way.We're all hypocrites in our own way.
What we see in others we genuinely refuse to acknowledge in ourselves. A denial of sorts.
If you found out your boss of your overall company was causing all kinds of misery all over the world, would you resign?We probably are all hypocrites in some way.
I'm not sure we are all hypocritical enough to live, socialise, and earn money from people we would like to maim, torture and murder though.
Well I’ve seem him singing like a normal front man, and I’ve also seen him sitting on a chair working his way though 3 bottles of wine and mumbling the words. Not really what I paid good money to see. Yet when Winehouse did the same thing once it was all over the news.Pissed !!! What exactly did you expect from shane McGowan
If I found out my boss wanted to be part of an illegal terrorist organisation which was murdering torturing and maiming innocent men, women and children I'd do a bit more than resign mate.If you found out your boss of your overall company was causing all kinds of misery all over the world, would you resign?
If it was on our own doorstep we may take things a bit more personal...but....if it was somewhere remote and rarely in our mindset, would we resign and give reasons for ?
Would you cease to be a Sunderland supporter/fan if your owner was doing the same?
This is why we are all hypocrites in many ways. It just depends on what's on offer and how our very own lifestyle can change if we go against stuff as opposed to simply accepting it,regardless of us having any inking of higher wrong doing.
We all work under governments and follow their rules and they sanction that very same stuff...so...you see what I'm getting at?If I found out my boss wanted to be part of an illegal terrorist organisation which was murdering torturing and maiming innocent men, women and children I'd do a bit more than resign mate.