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Ashes 5 test - The Oval

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Ah the 82 I thought you were referring to Curran hence the :lol: Overton fair enough - that's his pace and like Curran it isnt really quick enough to get good players out on good pitches. OT was a good test match surface, it did exactly what its supposed to do. It was easy paced and comfortable for batting and as it got into days 4 and 5 helped tall quick bowlers with uneven bounce and started to spin a lot. There was nothing in it day 1-5 for an 80mph bowler that pitches it up thats for sure. That's why he wasn't picked and they went to the extent of bringing someone in from the cold rather than select him on that pitch in those conditions. You are right about Headingley - when I said Curran would have bowled well there i was being slightly generous, I should have specified on days one and two when it was seaming and swinging before flattening out.


Well Jimmy Anderson completely disagrees with you. Last year the pitches suited us more than India says Jimmy. This year the pitches suited Australia more than us says Jimmy. I would like to have seen more grass on them etc, etc. Good pitches for us against India last year, not this year. Good pitches for pitch it up English seamers such as Curran last year, not this year. Your thoughts?


I think we’re in danger of over playing the importance of the pitch a bit here mind. Yes it’s nice to have a green top, overheads, and 6ft 90mph quicks, but Jimmy has been excellent on tours of UAE, Australia and SL in recent times, most of the time not bowling much above 84/85mph. Yes he’s our greatest ever fast bowler, but surely that shows if you get the ball in good areas consistently, you get your rewards. Sam Curran showed last summer he was capable of getting some of the worlds best batsmen out and could have made a crucial difference in this series.

Oh and check out the pitch from last years Test at the Oval and tell me how different it looks to the OT one!

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Curran in according to Surrey twitter
Roy and Overton dropped, Curran and Woakes come in
 
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He has a decent record, avearging 40s over last few seasons

Theres no need to be so disrpectful to county cricket, its not just "dibbly dobbler bowlers" with an old ball

Ben Stokes came into international cricket batting 5 for Durham by the way


The pitches have been bizarre

Why can't we just produce normal English pitches

Its only England that we prepare pitches more suited to other teams, doesn't happen anywhere else in the world, he is right.

Saying all this, if he had been fit for 5 tests we'd have won, simple.
Ben Stokes batting 5 for Durham came into the England side batting 6.

Jason Roy could have come in at 6 and I don't think anyone would have had any problems.

FYI Roy only played 10 innings in the championship in seasons 2017,2018 and 2019 so played as much red ball cricket for England as he has Surrey in recent seasons.

Not really ideal practice for the guy to be launched into an Ashes series
 
Ben Stokes batting 5 for Durham came into the England side batting 6.

Jason Roy could have come in at 6 and I don't think anyone would have had any problems.

FYI Roy only played 10 innings in the championship in seasons 2017,2018 and 2019 so played as much red ball cricket for England as he has Surrey in recent seasons.

Not really ideal practice for the guy to be launched into an Ashes series

Yeah I know, thats what I said

I dispute your dibbly dobbly comment though its disrepctful and not true

lets not play Pope then as he went through based on your theory
 
Yeah I know, thats what I said

I dispute your dibbly dobbly comment though its disrepctful and not true

lets not play Pope then as he went through based on your theory
Fair enough, as we all know getting emotional with language on here does no good.

Difference between Pope and Roy is the former has had 28 innings in the championship for Surrey scoring 6 tons and 6 half centuries

Roy had 1 century and 3 50s over 3 seasons for Surrey in 10 innings. Pope you would think be more prepared at playing red ball.

The real point is the ECB made the wrong call over both positions to the detriment of their careers.
 
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Fair enough, as we all know getting emotional with language on here does no good.

Difference between Pope and Roy is the former has had 28 innings in the championship for Surrey scoring 6 tons and 6 half centuries

Roy had 1 century and 3 50s over 3 seasons for Surrey in 10 innings. Pope you would think be more prepared at playing red ball.

The real point is the ECB made the wrong call over both positions to the detriment of their careers.

I wasn't, just pointing out he is a middle order player at CC level and has a decent record over last few years, its where he should have played

Don't think you can say he couldn't make a success of it because he was only playing dibbly dobbly bowlers at 5 or 6, thats all

I feel for the lad, he has been royally shafted by Ed Smith and James Taylor and we will probably never know now if he could have made it

Buttler at 6 again though, I'd prefered to have seen Roy given a shot there.
 
So I take it that Stokes will move to 4, with the out of form Bairstow and Buttler at 5 & 6? :lol:

Crazy ain't it

this is what I was saying on the other thread about players being messed around

once again our lower order has been moved to make up for other problems in the side, it literally happens every time, and then people will cry bloody murder when Stokes fails at 4 and Bairstow fails at 5 like its all their fault.
 
I wasn't, just pointing out he is a middle order player at CC level and has a decent record over last few years, its where he should have played

Don't think you can say he couldn't make a success of it because he was only playing dibbly dobbly bowlers at 5 or 6, thats all

I feel for the lad, he has been royally shafted by Ed Smith and James Taylor and we will probably never know now if he could have made it

Buttler at 6 again though, I'd prefered to have seen Roy given a shot there.
As I said being a tad daft by using more emotional language.

Was just surprised by the fact he had never batted 2 sessions. You'd have thought that was a pre-requisite for test match cricket.

@rentaghost @Voice of fair play I know you've both said you cant just look at averages and go they should be the next cab off the rank, but have our selectors done any digging into who the side should be.

I'm not really sure to be honest, they don't really seem to have made well thought out selections or been coherent in their selections.
 
Roy dropped.

FFS man. Let's not put the selectors in charge of stable doors.
Absolutely pathetic selection from England again.

3 tests at the top of the order when he's never opened then 1 test in his natural position then dropped.

Clowns
So what are we looking at:

Burns, Denly, Root(c), Stokes, Bairstow(w), Buttler, Woakes, Curran, Archer, Leach, Broad

3 specialist batsmen, 5 all-rounders and 3 bowlers.

Do they never f***ing learn?
 
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Burns
Denly
Root
Stokes
Buttler
Bairstow
Woakes
Curran
Leach
Archer
Broad

Strong well balanced line up imo. Am sure they will have Leach and Archer swapped in the order, and probably Buttler and Bairstow, buts that’s what I go with if Bairstow keeps. In fact, I’d probably have Bairstow 5 and Buttler keeping at 6.
Absolutely pathetic selection from England again.

3 tests at the top of the order when he's never opened then 1 test in his natural position then dropped.

Clowns
So what are we looking at:

Burns, Denly, Root(c), Stokes, Bairstow(w), Buttler, Woakes, Curran, Archer, Leach, Broad

3 specialist batsmen, 5 all-rounders and 3 bowlers.

Do they never f***ing learn?
I think it’s fair enough really. He was given the opportunity to open because that’s what we were short of. He’s not taken it and has dropped several costly chances along the way. Doesn’t deserve to keep his place. And that’s from someone who is a fan and wanted him in the side.
 
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Burns
Denly
Root
Stokes
Buttler
Bairstow
Woakes
Curran
Leach
Archer
Broad

Strong well balanced line up imo. Am sure they will have Leach and Archer swapped in the order, and probably Buttler and Bairstow, buts that’s what I go with if Bairstow keeps. In fact, I’d probably have Bairstow 5 and Buttler keeping at 6.
I would go with that just for the inevitable tantrum :)
 
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